"it came from God" so is it infallible?

1Thess521

Well-known member

Pope Francis says Abu Dhabi document ‘came from God’ and you ‘can’t understand it otherwise’​


"“It was something that came from God,” Francis proclaimed. “You can’t understand it otherwise, because none of us had this in mind. It emerged during a friendly lunch, and that is a big thing.”

The Abu Dhabi document has been widely criticized by faithful Catholics for putting the Catholic faith and its worship of the God of Revelation on the same plane with religions that do not worship the true God and deliberately reject Him. It also contradicts the teaching according to which there is no salvation outside of the Catholic Church

 
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Pope Francis says Abu Dhabi document ‘came from God’ and you ‘can’t understand it otherwise’​


"“It was something that came from God,” Francis proclaimed. “You can’t understand it otherwise, because none of us had this in mind. It emerged during a friendly lunch, and that is a big thing.”

The Abu Dhabi document has been widely criticized by faithful Catholics for putting the Catholic faith and its worship of the God of Revelation on the same plane with religions that do not worship the true God and deliberately reject Him. It also contradicts the teaching according to which there is no salvation outside of the Catholic Church

is the Pope in error when he states that the "Abu Dhabi document ‘came from God’
 
In a way, Frankie is right – the Abu Dhabi document did come from god. The god of Roman Catholicism, the god of this world. ? The god that hates true believers and has been persecuting them and putting them to death from the start.

--Rich
"Esse quam videri"
It is so sad, well we know what RCs think about popes even if they are the devil they are to be followed.
 
T

Pope Francis says Abu Dhabi document ‘came from God’ and you ‘can’t understand it otherwise’​


"“It was something that came from God,” Francis proclaimed. “You can’t understand it otherwise, because none of us had this in mind. It emerged during a friendly lunch, and that is a big thing.”

The Abu Dhabi document has been widely criticized by faithful Catholics for putting the Catholic faith and its worship of the God of Revelation on the same plane with religions that do not worship the true God and deliberately reject Him. It also contradicts the teaching according to which there is no salvation outside of the Catholic Church

Thank you I had not seen this.
 

Pope Francis says Abu Dhabi document ‘came from God’ and you ‘can’t understand it otherwise’​


"“It was something that came from God,” Francis proclaimed. “You can’t understand it otherwise, because none of us had this in mind. It emerged during a friendly lunch, and that is a big thing.”

The Abu Dhabi document has been widely criticized by faithful Catholics for putting the Catholic faith and its worship of the God of Revelation on the same plane with religions that do not worship the true God and deliberately reject Him. It also contradicts the teaching according to which there is no salvation outside of the Catholic Church

Far from backing down or trying to rationalize or explain this blasphemous document in an orthodox way, Bergoglio is doubling down on the complete blasphemy and apostasy that is contained in this document he signed three years ago.

It is an open act of apostasy, because as it is written, Bergoglio doesn't just deny the Catholic Faith, but he denies Christianity altogether, and that there even exists any true religion. It is total religious indifferentism. Catholicism, Protestantism, Orthodox, Jewish, Muslim, Buddhism, Hinduism, Voodooism; it's all the same to Bergoglio, one is just as good as another.

The document declared: "The pluralism and the diversity of religions, color, sex, race and language are willed by God in His wisdom, through which He created human beings."

There is no way to twist this to mean that non-Catholic religions are tolerated by God in his passive will, since it is tied into the creative act itself in which God created human beings and the two sexes.

Further, Bergoglio had this document, without any modification, placed in the Acta Apostolicae Sedis, which is the Vatican’s official and authoritative compendium of papal acts, thus making it an official act of Bergoglio's magisterium. "Catholics" are bound to give assent to this document with "divine and Catholic Faith", as it is part of the magisterium.

This is not the only time Bergoglio has affirmed this blasphemy. On numerous occasions Bergoglio has made statements about how the diversity of religions are "essential" or "necessary", or "a human health", etc.

Just before Bergoglio's trip to celebrate Reformation Day in 2016 with the Lutherans, he agreed to an interview with the Catholic publication, La Civiltà Cattolica. In this interview, Bergoglio gave his definition of religion;

"There are idolatries connected to religion: the idolatry of money, of enmities, of space greater than time, the greed of the territoriality of space. There is an idolatry of the conquest of space, of dominion, that attacks religions like a malignant virus. And idolatry is a false religion, it is wrong religiosity. I call religion an immanent transcendence, namely a contradiction. But the true religions are the development of the capacity that humanity has to transcend itself towards the absolute. The religious phenomenon is transcendent and it has to do with truth, beauty, goodness and unity. If there isn’t this openness, there is no transcendence, there is no true religion, there is idolatry."

Amid his incoherent blather about space being greater than time (whatever that means) he expresses his idea of religion as a sort of eastern pantheism. The "immanent transcendence" is basically taken straight from St. Pope Pius X's monumental encyclical on modernism, Pascendi Dominici gregis.

Bergoglio is not just a non-Catholic. He is an apostate that denies that there is any true religion. He is a liar and his father is the father of lies.
 
Far from backing down or trying to rationalize or explain this blasphemous document in an orthodox way, Bergoglio is doubling down on the complete blasphemy and apostasy that is contained in this document he signed three years ago.

It is an open act of apostasy, because as it is written, Bergoglio doesn't just deny the Catholic Faith, but he denies Christianity altogether, and that there even exists any true religion. It is total religious indifferentism. Catholicism, Protestantism, Orthodox, Jewish, Muslim, Buddhism, Hinduism, Voodooism; it's all the same to Bergoglio, one is just as good as another.

The document declared: "The pluralism and the diversity of religions, color, sex, race and language are willed by God in His wisdom, through which He created human beings."

There is no way to twist this to mean that non-Catholic religions are tolerated by God in his passive will, since it is tied into the creative act itself in which God created human beings and the two sexes.

Further, Bergoglio had this document, without any modification, placed in the Acta Apostolicae Sedis, which is the Vatican’s official and authoritative compendium of papal acts, thus making it an official act of Bergoglio's magisterium. "Catholics" are bound to give assent to this document with "divine and Catholic Faith", as it is part of the magisterium.

This is not the only time Bergoglio has affirmed this blasphemy. On numerous occasions Bergoglio has made statements about how the diversity of religions are "essential" or "necessary", or "a human health", etc.

Just before Bergoglio's trip to celebrate Reformation Day in 2016 with the Lutherans, he agreed to an interview with the Catholic publication, La Civiltà Cattolica. In this interview, Bergoglio gave his definition of religion;

"There are idolatries connected to religion: the idolatry of money, of enmities, of space greater than time, the greed of the territoriality of space. There is an idolatry of the conquest of space, of dominion, that attacks religions like a malignant virus. And idolatry is a false religion, it is wrong religiosity. I call religion an immanent transcendence, namely a contradiction. But the true religions are the development of the capacity that humanity has to transcend itself towards the absolute. The religious phenomenon is transcendent and it has to do with truth, beauty, goodness and unity. If there isn’t this openness, there is no transcendence, there is no true religion, there is idolatry."

Amid his incoherent blather about space being greater than time (whatever that means) he expresses his idea of religion as a sort of eastern pantheism. The "immanent transcendence" is basically taken straight from St. Pope Pius X's monumental encyclical on modernism, Pascendi Dominici gregis.

Bergoglio is not just a non-Catholic. He is an apostate that denies that there is any true religion. He is a liar and his father is the father of lies.
but on top of allof what you just posted:
I think this is the worst.
the claim that it "came from God’
 
but on top of allof what you just posted:
I think this is the worst.
the claim that it "came from God’
Isn't that the point of discernment though? When we are in a position of making some sort of moral decision, the question is is this coming from God or the devil.
 
Isn't that the point of discernment though? When we are in a position of making some sort of moral decision, the question is is this coming from God or the devil.
Do you see many Carm-posting Catholics demonstrating any discernment?
Other than Mysterium Fidei: who else thinks the Pope is in error?


Catholic Identity Conference opens with call to ‘resist’ Pope Francis and the ‘New World Order’”
vs
dingoling's viewpoint

"Even if the Pope were Satan incarnate, we ought not to raise up our heads against him, but calmly lie down to rest on his bosom. He who rebels against our Father is condemned to death, for that which we do to him we do to Christ: we honor Christ if we honor the Pope; we dishonor Christ if we dishonor the Pope. I know very well that many defend themselves by boasting: “They are so corrupt, and work all manner of evil!” But God has commanded that, even if the priests, the pastors, and Christ-on-earth were incarnate devils, we be obedient and subject to them, not for their sakes, but for the sake of God, and out of obedience to Him."
— St. Catherine of Siena, Virgin & Doctor of the Church
 
Isn't that the point of discernment though? When we are in a position of making some sort of moral decision, the question is is this coming from God or the devil.
Hmm interesting as you have to obey the pope and his cronies on certain things and what did Catherine of Siena quote say which all Rcs seemed to agree with. If they agree with that quote then there is no room for them to use discernment.
 
Do you see many Carm-posting Catholics demonstrating any discernment?
Other than Mysterium Fidei: who else thinks the Pope is in error?


Catholic Identity Conference opens with call to ‘resist’ Pope Francis and the ‘New World Order’”
vs
dingoling's viewpoint

"Even if the Pope were Satan incarnate, we ought not to raise up our heads against him, but calmly lie down to rest on his bosom. He who rebels against our Father is condemned to death, for that which we do to him we do to Christ: we honor Christ if we honor the Pope; we dishonor Christ if we dishonor the Pope. I know very well that many defend themselves by boasting: “They are so corrupt, and work all manner of evil!” But God has commanded that, even if the priests, the pastors, and Christ-on-earth were incarnate devils, we be obedient and subject to them, not for their sakes, but for the sake of God, and out of obedience to Him."
— St. Catherine of Siena

This needs to be put in perspective. I don't know what dingoling purpose was in posting it. I assume it was to mean that Bergoglio must be acknowledged as pope unconditionally, but this is not the case. A pope is not immaculate or sinless. He goes to confession like any other Catholic. A pope could be personally sinful or even corrupt but what a pope cannot be is a public manifest pertinacious heretic, because that contradicts the teaching of the Church.

To acknowledge Bergoglio as a true pope, is to deny the defined dogma of the Church regarding the papacy. It is to deny the infallibility and indefectibility of the Church.
 
Far from backing down or trying to rationalize or explain this blasphemous document in an orthodox way, Bergoglio is doubling down on the complete blasphemy and apostasy that is contained in this document he signed three years ago.

It is an open act of apostasy, because as it is written, Bergoglio doesn't just deny the Catholic Faith, but he denies Christianity altogether, and that there even exists any true religion. It is total religious indifferentism. Catholicism, Protestantism, Orthodox, Jewish, Muslim, Buddhism, Hinduism, Voodooism; it's all the same to Bergoglio, one is just as good as another.

The document declared: "The pluralism and the diversity of religions, color, sex, race and language are willed by God in His wisdom, through which He created human beings."

There is no way to twist this to mean that non-Catholic religions are tolerated by God in his passive will, since it is tied into the creative act itself in which God created human beings and the two sexes.

Further, Bergoglio had this document, without any modification, placed in the Acta Apostolicae Sedis, which is the Vatican’s official and authoritative compendium of papal acts, thus making it an official act of Bergoglio's magisterium. "Catholics" are bound to give assent to this document with "divine and Catholic Faith", as it is part of the magisterium.

This is not the only time Bergoglio has affirmed this blasphemy. On numerous occasions Bergoglio has made statements about how the diversity of religions are "essential" or "necessary", or "a human health", etc.

Just before Bergoglio's trip to celebrate Reformation Day in 2016 with the Lutherans, he agreed to an interview with the Catholic publication, La Civiltà Cattolica. In this interview, Bergoglio gave his definition of religion;

"There are idolatries connected to religion: the idolatry of money, of enmities, of space greater than time, the greed of the territoriality of space. There is an idolatry of the conquest of space, of dominion, that attacks religions like a malignant virus. And idolatry is a false religion, it is wrong religiosity. I call religion an immanent transcendence, namely a contradiction. But the true religions are the development of the capacity that humanity has to transcend itself towards the absolute. The religious phenomenon is transcendent and it has to do with truth, beauty, goodness and unity. If there isn’t this openness, there is no transcendence, there is no true religion, there is idolatry."

Amid his incoherent blather about space being greater than time (whatever that means) he expresses his idea of religion as a sort of eastern pantheism. The "immanent transcendence" is basically taken straight from St. Pope Pius X's monumental encyclical on modernism, Pascendi Dominici gregis.

Bergoglio is not just a non-Catholic. He is an apostate that denies that there is any true religion. He is a liar and his father is the father of lies.
And yet a "Spirit led" College of Cardinals elected him to be in charge of their infallible church system.

It seems that Bergoglio is one of the BEST ARGUMENTS for Protestantism.
 
"Even if the Pope were Satan incarnate, we ought not to raise up our heads against him, but calmly lie down to rest on his bosom. He who rebels against our Father is condemned to death, for that which we do to him we do to Christ: we honor Christ if we honor the Pope; we dishonor Christ if we dishonor the Pope. I know very well that many defend themselves by boasting: “They are so corrupt, and work all manner of evil!” But God has commanded that, even if the priests, the pastors, and Christ-on-earth were incarnate devils, we be obedient and subject to them, not for their sakes, but for the sake of God, and out of obedience to Him."
— St. Catherine of Siena

This needs to be put in perspective. I don't know what dingoling purpose was in posting it. I assume it was to mean that Bergoglio must be acknowledged as pope unconditionally, but this is not the case. A pope is not immaculate or sinless. He goes to confession like any other Catholic. A pope could be personally sinful or even corrupt but what a pope cannot be is a public manifest pertinacious heretic, because that contradicts the teaching of the Church.

To acknowledge Bergoglio as a true pope, is to deny the defined dogma of the Church regarding the papacy. It is to deny the infallibility and indefectibility of the Church.


This is NOT about a Pope being immaculate or sinless
This is about a Pope saying that the circumstances of creating a document "came from God"

I know you don't believe it is true
Do you think Bergoglio believes it came from God?
(as opposed to him knowingly lying about it)
 
This is NOT about a Pope being immaculate or sinless
This is about a Pope saying that the circumstances of creating a document "came from God"

I know you don't believe it is true
Do you think Bergoglio believes it came from God?
(as opposed to him knowingly lying about it)
I think Bergoglio is lying about believing the document came from God. I don't think he believes that. I don't think Bergoglio believes in God in any sense that we do. I think he's an Atheist and a Marxist.
 
Far from backing down or trying to rationalize or explain this blasphemous document in an orthodox way, Bergoglio is doubling down on the complete blasphemy and apostasy that is contained in this document he signed three years ago.

It is an open act of apostasy, because as it is written, Bergoglio doesn't just deny the Catholic Faith, but he denies Christianity altogether, and that there even exists any true religion. It is total religious indifferentism. Catholicism, Protestantism, Orthodox, Jewish, Muslim, Buddhism, Hinduism, Voodooism; it's all the same to Bergoglio, one is just as good as another.

The document declared: "The pluralism and the diversity of religions, color, sex, race and language are willed by God in His wisdom, through which He created human beings."

There is no way to twist this to mean that non-Catholic religions are tolerated by God in his passive will, since it is tied into the creative act itself in which God created human beings and the two sexes.

Further, Bergoglio had this document, without any modification, placed in the Acta Apostolicae Sedis, which is the Vatican’s official and authoritative compendium of papal acts, thus making it an official act of Bergoglio's magisterium. "Catholics" are bound to give assent to this document with "divine and Catholic Faith", as it is part of the magisterium.

This is not the only time Bergoglio has affirmed this blasphemy. On numerous occasions Bergoglio has made statements about how the diversity of religions are "essential" or "necessary", or "a human health", etc.

Just before Bergoglio's trip to celebrate Reformation Day in 2016 with the Lutherans, he agreed to an interview with the Catholic publication, La Civiltà Cattolica. In this interview, Bergoglio gave his definition of religion;

"There are idolatries connected to religion: the idolatry of money, of enmities, of space greater than time, the greed of the territoriality of space. There is an idolatry of the conquest of space, of dominion, that attacks religions like a malignant virus. And idolatry is a false religion, it is wrong religiosity. I call religion an immanent transcendence, namely a contradiction. But the true religions are the development of the capacity that humanity has to transcend itself towards the absolute. The religious phenomenon is transcendent and it has to do with truth, beauty, goodness and unity. If there isn’t this openness, there is no transcendence, there is no true religion, there is idolatry."

Amid his incoherent blather about space being greater than time (whatever that means) he expresses his idea of religion as a sort of eastern pantheism. The "immanent transcendence" is basically taken straight from St. Pope Pius X's monumental encyclical on modernism, Pascendi Dominici gregis.

Bergoglio is not just a non-Catholic. He is an apostate that denies that there is any true religion. He is a liar and his father is the father of lies.
This type of ecumenism goes along with globalism of which the Roman Catholic pope is an integral part of.
 
Isn't that the point of discernment though? When we are in a position of making some sort of moral decision, the question is is this coming from God or the devil.
So what would you discern about a document signed by the "pope" that denies the Catholic Faith as the true religion, denies Christianity altogether and even denies that there exists any true religion? Would you discern that this document "came from God"?
 
So what would you discern about a document signed by the "pope" that denies the Catholic Faith as the true religion, denies Christianity altogether and even denies that there exists any true religion? Would you discern that this document "came from God"?
But here is the thing----

I think this is just an instance of Pope Francis not speaking clearly and precisely.

Granted Pope Francis has done and said many dubious things. At the same time----it is probably best to give any pope the benefit of the doubt when it comes to what he does or says--and find a way to interpret it in accord with Church teaching.

In other words: the pope should be given the presumption that he is teaching the Catholic Faith. His words and actions should be given the benefit of the doubt----and harmonized with Church teaching. The person accusing the pope of heresy has a high burden of proof to meet. In other words--the person accusing the pope of heresy has to show that there is NO way, NO possible way--to interpret his words or deeds in accord with Church teaching.

I mean---you seem to love Honorius. Poor Honorius---has been so misunderstood and demonized, right? He was really a good pope who defended the truth of God, right? The people accusing him of heresy--why--how dare they? He was the pope of Rome! The pope knows all! The pope can NEVER be wrong! You seem very happy to defend Honorius--and read what he said in accord with Church teaching. why not just apply the exact same logic to Pope Francis?
 
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