Jesus is NOT Michael !

Buzzard

Active member
A matter of Contast:
AV Isa 14:12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! [how] art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
AV Isa 14:14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.

Reference: Lucifer is an angel of GOD. "I will be like the most High.", But not with resurrection power.

AV 1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
AV Ju 1:9 Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring against him a railing accusation, but said, The Lord rebuke thee.

Bible evidence supports the ONLY bodily escape from the grave is resurrection.

I have understood this verse to say(noting proper order), "shout" of the Father, "the voice of the archangel" of Jesus and "the trump of God" the Holy Spirit; The GODhead working resurrection from the dead. Bible evidence suggest ONLY the GODhead can resurrect from the grave. Textual evidence for GODhead or "Trinity".

AV Mt 28:18 And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power{G1849 exousia, authority, jurisdiction, liberty, power, right, strength} is given unto me in heaven and in earth.
AV Jn 5:28-29 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, 29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.
AV Jn 10:27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:

In your soteriology, Who's "his voice"/"the voice" has the "power" to resurrect a soul, with your scripture evidence please ???

Yours in Christ, Michael
Whose voice will Job hear

Job 14:12
So man lieth down, and riseth not:
till the heavens be no more,
they shall not awake,
nor be raised out of their sleep.

13 O that thou wouldest hide me in the grave,
that thou wouldest keep me secret,
until thy wrath be past,
that thou wouldest appoint me a set time,
and remember me!

14 If a man die, shall he live again?
all the days of my appointed time will I wait,
till my change come.

15 Thou shalt call, and I will answer thee:

thou wilt have a desire to the work of thine hands.

1Th 4:16
For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout,
with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God:
and the dead in Christ shall rise first:


Jn 5:28-29 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming,
in the which all that are in the graves
shall hear his voice,

Michael has asked
Who's "his voice"/"the voice" has the "power" to resurrect a soul,


Maybe someone here can tell us
 
BTW: Thanks for your insightful support !!!
Whose voice will Job hear
...
Michael has asked
Who's "his voice"/"the voice" has the "power" to resurrect a soul,


Maybe someone here can tell us
AV Jb 40:6 Then answered the LORD unto Job out of the whirlwind, and said,
AV Jb 40:9 Hast thou an arm like God? or canst thou thunder with a voice like him?

GOD loves rhetorical questions to make us consider the truth.

AV Jn 5:25 Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the{definite article} voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live.
AV 1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

"Maybe someone here can tell us ", Look and we will discern GOD's Truth in GOD's Words.

Yours in Christ, Michael
 
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Jesus also crushed the serpent's head. That something Michael could not do.
AV Re 12:7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,

The GODhead has timing for everything during this time of sin. BTW: "Michael" still wins/"prevails", then, now and later.

From GOD's Point of View(POV), How many sides are there ???

Yours in Christ, Michael
 

John t

Active member
Whose voice will Job hear

Job 14:12
So man lieth down, and riseth not:
till the heavens be no more,
they shall not awake,
nor be raised out of their sleep.

13 O that thou wouldest hide me in the grave,
that thou wouldest keep me secret,
until thy wrath be past,
that thou wouldest appoint me a set time,
and remember me!
Interesting, but totally irrelevant to the issue of the OP
1Th 4:16
For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout,
with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God:
and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
Interesting, but totally irrelevant to the issue of the OP

Jn 5:28-29 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming,
in the which all that are in the graves
shall hear his voice,

Michael has asked
Who's "his voice"/"the voice" has the "power" to resurrect a soul,
Interesting, but out of context as well as irrelevant to the OP
Cultists frequently fail the context issue, and this is no exception.

WHO is doing the resurrection here? ( It is the same Person who resurrected Lazarus from the dead.)

IN ITS CONTEXT:

John 5:​
25 Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live.
26 For as the Father hath life in himself; so hath he given to the Son to have life in himself;​
27 And hath given him authority to execute judgment also, because he is the Son of man.​
28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,​
29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.​

WHAT WILL Y'ALL TRY NEXT? In its context, context simply "ate your lunch" about that heresy.

Refresh the memory by looking at this post again: https://forums.carm.org/threads/jesus-is-not-michael.74/page-2#post-9142

Completely, you ignored ALL but one time that Michael was mentioned in Scripture, and you utterly ignored the explanations from many sources that likewise disproved your heresy, which you share with the JWs

You also ignored the mental health issues of Ellen in that same post.

It is sad, and I sorta dislike attacking your so-called "prophetess" but facts are facts, and it is my hope that this sort of "shock therapy" will convince you of your error regarding the heresy of "Michael=Jesus". Only a mad woman, who also is historically an "acolyte of William Miller" could concoct such an ill-founded heresy
 

Wrenage

Member
I will back be here to answer in steps towards a goal, so I will be using at least several posts.

AV Jn 1:1-2 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 The same was in the beginning with God.

AV Jn 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

Was Jesus "the Word" before becoming/"was made" "flesh" ???

AV Mt 1:21-23 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name JESUS: for he shall save his people from their sins. 22 Now all this was done, that it might be fulfilled which was spoken of the Lord by the prophet, saying, 23 Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.

So what are all the names of "the Word", before "the Word" was called "his name JESUS" ???

AV Jn 14:6-11 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. 7 If ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also: and from henceforth ye know him, and have seen him. 8 Philip saith unto him, Lord, shew us the Father, and it sufficeth us. Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou [then], Shew us the Father? 10 Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works. 11 Believe me that I [am] in the Father, and the Father in me: or else believe me for the very works'sake.

After three and a half years, Philip had issues of recognizing GOD in the flesh or in the GODhead. This is the problem, I will address as a discussion. As it relates to "Michael{H4317 Miyka'el}", Is recognizing GOD in Their three persons, many forms, titles and names.

Yours in Christ, Michael
No need to go too far into the weeds. I'm slow and have already lost sight of the main point.

Main point: is there some SDA doctrine that depends on Jesus being Michael? If so, what is it?

The only verses that probably need to be looked at are ones that concern Michael, Jesus's identity and angels.

For me, it is a fairly simple matter to see Jesus is not Michael. Just sticking in Daniel, one sees various Princes mentioned, like of Persia and Greece, and Michael is grouped among them in Daniel 10:13. Throw in the Enoch reference, and Jesus not being Michael is reasonable.

In my opinion, the only reason to insist Jesus is Michael is because it is somehow important to a denomination's identity.
 

Sherman

Active member
According to Ellen G. White (EGW), the Seventh-day Adventist's prophet, and also taught by the Jehovah's Witnesses. Evangelical Christianity has rejected the teaching that Michael is Christ, because it is not Biblical. It may surprise you to learn that there are only five references in the entire Bible to Michael, and not one reference names Michael as Jesus Christ. We will look at each one of them.​
This only add to dubiousness of this teaching IMHO. I didn't know about the catalepsy of Ellen G. White.
 

robycop3

Active member
The quack Ellen G. White wrote:
“Satan the tempter had claimed the body of Moses because of his sin; but Christ the Saviour brought him forth from the grave.”
(Desire of Ages, p.421)

‘Moses passed through death, but Michael came down and gave him life before his body had seen corruption. Satan tried to hold the body, claiming it as his; but Michael resurrected Moses and took him to heaven. Satan railed bitterly against God, denouncing Him as unjust in permitting his prey to be taken from him; but Christ did not rebuke His adversary, though it was through his temptation that the servant of God had fallen. He meekly referred him to His Father, saying, “The Lord rebuke thee.”
(Early Writings, p. 164.)

Patriarchs and Prophets page 761—
Again: Christ is called the Word of God. John 1:1-3. He is so called because God gave His revelations to man in all ages through Christ. It was His Spirit that inspired the prophets. 1 Peter 1:10, 11. He was revealed to them as the Angel of Jehovah, the Captain of the Lord’s host, Michael the Archangel.

Prophets and Kings page 572—
For three weeks Gabriel wrestled with the powers of darkness, seeking to counteract the influences at work on the mind of Cyrus; and before the contest closed, Christ Himself came to Gabriel’s aid. “The prince of the kingdom of Persia withstood me one and twenty days,” Gabriel declares; “but, lo, Michael, one of the chief princes, came to help me; and I remained there with the kings of Persia.” Daniel 10:13.

"There is none that holdeth with me in these things but Michael (Christ) your prince."
(Desire of Ages, p.99)


Michael, or Christ
, with the angels that buried Moses, came down from heaven,
--The Truth About Angels, Page 104, Ellen G White

So, EGW plainly taught that Michael = Jesus. She also denie3d the Deity of Jesus:

In fact, Ellen G. White DENIED the deity of Jesus. In 1903 she wrote,
“The man Christ Jesus was not the Lord God Almighty”
(ms 140, SDA Commentary V, p. 1129).

While the Seven-Day-Adlibber cult openly denies, in their writings that are made public for anyone to see, that false doctrine. But, once they get a newbie hooked, they slowly begin to indoctrinate him/her with their blasphemous false doctrines, including "Jesus = Michael". Their guru wrote such, & while they try to keep some of her stuff from being so public, it's a matter of record, & takes very-little digging to find.

CAN ANYONE SHOW ME A LEGITIMATE BIBLE VERSION THAT READS "FATHER, MICHAEL, HOLY SPIRIT" ?????????????
 

John t

Active member
This only add to dubiousness of this teaching IMHO. I didn't know about the catalepsy of Ellen G. White.
That is why I posted it. Most people look at her crazy doctrines as the ramblings of an uneducated woman. Indeed, she is that. But it is also true that the fact that catalepsy fits often go hand-in-glove with schizophrenia. Her own medical doctor made the diagnosis, and it is somewhere in the record (perhaps well hidden now) that change her rambling, and out-of-context "prophesies" from being romanticized nonsense and go deep into a mind needing psychotropic medications. (That is saying it nicely)

Nor do I gloat about this situation
 

John t

Active member
<SNIP>

In fact, Ellen G. White DENIED the deity of Jesus. In 1903 she wrote, (ms 140, SDA Commentary V, p. 1129).

While the Seven-Day-Adlibber cult openly denies, in their writings that are made public for anyone to see, that false doctrine. But, once they get a newbie hooked, they slowly begin to indoctrinate him/her with their blasphemous false doctrines, including "Jesus = Michael". Their guru wrote such, & while they try to keep some of her stuff from being so public, it's a matter of record, & takes very-little digging to find.

CAN ANYONE SHOW ME A LEGITIMATE BIBLE VERSION THAT READS "FATHER, MICHAEL, HOLY SPIRIT" ?????????????

Because a negative (meaning an absence of evidence) cannot prove anything, according to logic, going back to this post https://forums.carm.org/threads/jesus-is-not-michael.74/page-3#post-9786 will demonstrate beyond doubt the impossibility of your question.

I went to about 5 different sources, including Britannica and looking at the book of Enoch. Nothing can demonstrate what you request.
Aren't you glad?

All they can do is cobble out-of-context snippets from unrelated sources to provide pretend evidence of their "impossible dream" of making Ellen correct. They attempt to ignore that "inconvenient truth" that what she stated about Michael=Jesus is simply blankety-blank craziness. (Fill in your own appropriate adjectival clause) :ROFLMAO:
 

Sherman

Active member
The Book of Enoch is sheer tripe. But the SDA's I know do not really discuss that book. I have not heard then deny the Deity of Christ. Perhaps many modern SDA's reject that part of Ellen G. White's teachings.
 

John t

Active member
The Book of Enoch is sheer tripe. But the SDA's I know do not really discuss that book. I have not heard then deny the Deity of Christ. Perhaps many modern SDA's reject that part of Ellen G. White's teachings.
I have no reason to call into question your experiences with members of the SDA church. In all honesty, there may be some who are saved by grace in that church, but from my experiences with some "SDA-Nazis" here on CARM, over the years, that is rare. Those sorts of people........... not going there.

As an explanation of the inexplicable, I believe that , the SDAs (and the LDS people) approach their theology as we approach a Chinese buffet. Some of this, some of that, and we totally skip the egg rolls because they are so packed with the oil in which they are fried, that we may as well attempt to drink a cup of liquid Crisco.

The food analogies aside, they ignore the unpleasant and stupid statements of their founder in order to maintain the façade of rational belief and thought. If you really want a rofl type of experience, read what Ellen says about masturbation and what it does to the mind. Funny, she says ZERO about the act of marriage which has the same physical response as does masturbation. Why is one good, and the other bad?

That is why the adage about inconsistency being a haunting hobgoblin for all cults is so uniformly accurate. All that any of us can do is to present the truth, hoping they will see and understand it.
 
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No need to go too far into the weeds. I'm slow and have already lost sight of the main point.

Main point: is there some SDA doctrine that depends on Jesus being Michael? If so, what is it?

The only verses that probably need to be looked at are ones that concern Michael, Jesus's identity and angels.

For me, it is a fairly simple matter to see Jesus is not Michael. Just sticking in Daniel, one sees various Princes mentioned, like of Persia and Greece, and Michael is grouped among them in Daniel 10:13. Throw in the Enoch reference, and Jesus not being Michael is reasonable.

In my opinion, the only reason to insist Jesus is Michael is because it is somehow important to a denomination's identity.
AV Col 1:27 To whom God would make known what [is] the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory:

"Main point: is there some SDA doctrine that depends on Jesus being Michael? If so, what is it?", It's a test from GOD for all who will be lost. Recognizing Jesus everywhere in the bible, so that those who are Jesus', can be like Jesus.

A Little review in critical thinking ...
AV Mt 25:40-41 And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done [it] unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done [it] unto me. 41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

A subtle understanding from these verses is, NOT RECOGNIZING Jesus in the Bible or other believers is hazardous to eternal life.
Rereading this quote from before, What is Jesus' major reason of the goats, failing to get eternal life ???

More evidence about "goats" ...

AV Re 16:4-7 And the third angel poured out his vial upon the rivers and fountains of waters; and they became blood. 5 And I heard the angel of the waters say, Thou art righteous, O Lord, which art, and wast, and shalt be, because thou hast judged thus. 6 For they have shed the blood of saints and prophets, and thou hast given them blood to drink; for they are worthy. 7 And I heard another out of the altar say, Even so, Lord God Almighty, true and righteous [are] thy judgments.

"For they have shed the blood of saints and prophets, ...", GOD's people in the time of the end, will be murdered in mass.

"Even so, Lord God Almighty, true and righteous [are] thy judgments.", And GOD will past "thy judgments", denying them eternal life.

Heart of the matter for GOD ...

AV Hb 10:29-30 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace? 30 For we know him that hath said, Vengeance [belongeth] unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.

"who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, ...", This is symbolic language, and needs to be understood as such.

So what does this mean to you as GOD's "sanctified" in symbolic meaning ???

Your other option is to give a literal meaning, if so what is it ???

The results according to GOD ...
"Vengeance [belongeth] unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.", This should be clear that "The Lord shall judge his people." and "Vengeance [belongeth] unto me" will be the results of GOD's "thy judgments".

Revelation and Hebrews was clear that those who are GOD's "sanctified" that can not recognize Jesus and/or "the blood of the covenant" will lose eternal life.

Summary Conclusion ...
AV Jn 5:25 Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the{definite article} voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live.
AV 1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
AV Ju 1:9 Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring against him a railing accusation, but said, The Lord rebuke thee.

"The Lord rebuke thee.", Will receive GOD's "thy judgments", up to and including "the devil he disputed". So dispute GOD's resurrection power, and those that do, join 'the devil's "thy judgments".

It's really your choice to decide if Jesus in all forms, has resurrection power over you, and others. And accept GOD's "thy judgments" on those it falls upon who do not.

Bonus feature ...
"who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing", Who have "trodden" the sabbath that Jesus kept in righteousness "under foot" ???

AV Jn 16:2 They shall put you out of the synagogues: yea, the time cometh, that whosoever killeth you will think that he doeth God service.

When did GOD asked anyone "sanctified" in the NT/NC to "killeth" anyone ???
“Question - Which is the Sabbath day?
“Answer - Saturday is the Sabbath day.
“Question - Why do we observe Sunday instead of Saturday?
“Answer - We observe Sunday instead of Saturday because the Catholic Church, in the Council of Laodicea (A.D. 364), transferred the solemnity from Saturday to Sunday.”
Peter Geiermann, C.S.S.R., The Convert’s Catechism of Catholic Doctrine, p. 50, 3rd edition, 1957.
Check Question: Who and when made sabbath "an unholy thing" ???
Check Question: Who and when made sunday holy ???

AV Re 19:20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.

Those suffering GOD's "thy judgments", a very salvific issue in GOD's works.

Yours in Christ, Michael
 
Watch the "rebuttals, having zero facts," and 100% ad hominems as a defense.​
AV Mt 7:1-2 Judge not, that ye be not judged. 2 For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.
..., but from my experiences with some "SDA-Nazis" here on CARM, ... {Emphasis added by SDAchristian}
I am pretty sure which heterodox group in "SDA-Nazis", you are referring to in name calling.

Please do not make us guess, which members, in "SDA-Nazis", you are referring to in name calling ???

Yours in Christ, Michael
 
That is why the adage about inconsistency being a haunting hobgoblin for all cults is so uniformly accurate. All that any of us can do is to present the truth, hoping they will see and understand it.
AV Ac 24:5 For we have found this man [a] pestilent [fellow], and a mover of sedition among all the Jews throughout the world, and a ringleader of the sect of the Nazarenes:

Majority is NOT a reason to represent GOD's people.

AV Mt 7:13-15 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide [is] the gate, and broad [is] the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat: Because strait [is] the gate, and narrow [is] the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it. Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.

Being in the majority, did not make these "false prophets/ravening wolves" better than GOD's "sheep".

These are words from scriptures, I pray the Holy Spirit to truly understand their applications throughout this time of GOD's permissive will.

Yours in Christ, Michael
 

Wrenage

Member
AV Col 1:27 To whom God would make known what [is] the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory:

"Main point: is there some SDA doctrine that depends on Jesus being Michael? If so, what is it?", It's a test from GOD for all who will be lost. Recognizing Jesus everywhere in the bible, so that those who are Jesus', can be like Jesus.
So in a nutshell you are saying that anyone who does not recognize Michael as Jesus has failed a test sent from God and is lost?

Is that your personal take or does it directly come out of theology unique to Seventh Day Adventism?

As in, did Ellen White write that somewhere?
 
So in a nutshell you are saying that anyone who does not recognize Michael as Jesus has failed a test sent from God and is lost?
GOD will judge, so ask GOD in GOD's WORD.
Is that your personal take or does it directly come out of theology unique to Seventh Day Adventism?
I gave you, the relevant scriptures. GOD knows EXACTLY how GOD will judge.

AV 1C 6:3-4 Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life? 4 If then ye have judgments of things pertaining to this life, set them to judge who are least esteemed in the church.

It's up to us to know else well.
As in, did Ellen White write that somewhere?
Yes, but I did not look there first, I used scriptures with you. So use scriptures for yourself !!!

Yours in Christ, Michael
 

Wrenage

Member
I have no reason to call into question your experiences with members of the SDA church. In all honesty, there may be some who are saved by grace in that church, but from my experiences with some "SDA-Nazis" here on CARM, over the years, that is rare. Those sorts of people........... not going there.
I work with a Seventh Day Adventist, which started my interest in the religion. Great guy, but the longer I know him, and the more I study Seventh Day Adventism, the more I see the specter of Ellen White floating over his shoulder in everything he does and says.

Diet, politics/Sunday law and being the only one with pure doctrine while everyone else is deceived is what frames his world view. He can't even watch someone eat a hamburger or go to a Lent service without it being a reminder that he's carrying the heavy burden of truth.

I can't even imagine how hard it would be to change any of that. Like if I had been born a Seventh Day Adventist, went to a Seventh Day Adventist school, married a Seventh Day Adventist, brought up my kids in Seventh Day Adventism and had Seventh Day Adventism drilled into me in all ways, I doubt I could break that mindset.

But at the end of the day, God can do anything.
 

Wrenage

Member
GOD will judge, so ask GOD in GOD's WORD.

I gave you, the relevant scriptures. GOD knows EXACTLY how GOD will judge.

AV 1C 6:3-4 Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life? 4 If then ye have judgments of things pertaining to this life, set them to judge who are least esteemed in the church.

It's up to us to know else well.

Yes, but I did not look there first, I used scriptures with you. So use scriptures for yourself !!!

Yours in Christ, Michael
That is interesting that Ellen White said that folks who do not recognize Michael as Jesus have failed a test from God and are lost. Now it makes much more sense why Seventh Day Adventists defend the Jesus-is-Michael position.

Can you give me that quote from her work, please? I would like to see how she words it.
 

Sherman

Active member
I have no reason to call into question your experiences with members of the SDA church. In all honesty, there may be some who are saved by grace in that church, but from my experiences with some "SDA-Nazis" here on CARM, over the years, that is rare. Those sorts of people........... not going there.

As an explanation of the inexplicable, I believe that , the SDAs (and the LDS people) approach their theology as we approach a Chinese buffet. Some of this, some of that, and we totally skip the egg rolls because they are so packed with the oil in which they are fried, that we may as well attempt to drink a cup of liquid Crisco.

The food analogies aside, they ignore the unpleasant and stupid statements of their founder in order to maintain the façade of rational belief and thought. If you really want a rofl type of experience, read what Ellen says about masturbation and what it does to the mind. Funny, she says ZERO about the act of marriage which has the same physical response as does masturbation. Why is one good, and the other bad?

That is why the adage about inconsistency being a haunting hobgoblin for all cults is so uniformly accurate. All that any of us can do is to present the truth, hoping they will see and understand it.
I have also had some very ugly experiences with some SDA members. There is one floating around the internet that trolls various Christian websites. I am sure this site has had trouble with him in the past. He goes by an assortment of names, but he attacks mainline Christian groups. There's several that do nothing that harp about going to church on Saturday and they get very repetitive because the water is just very shallow when is comes to scriptures on this topic.
 

robycop3

Active member
The Book of Enoch is sheer tripe. But the SDA's I know do not really discuss that book. I have not heard then deny the Deity of Christ. Perhaps many modern SDA's reject that part of Ellen G. White's teachings.
Yes, the book of Enoch mentions a year of 365.25 days, while the year in Enoch's time was only 360 days long.

And God said that any prophet who blows one thing concerning God's word is a false prophet. And EGW certainly blew several things! Thus, the SDA is WRONG in accepting her as a prophet !

They just conveniently don't tell newbies into their cult about the more-controversion & incorrect of her teachings !
 
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