Jesus said, this is the work of God, that you believe……

Sethproton

Well-known member
Your position on this is untenable.
To reject sola Scriptura by appealing to rationalization is fallacious.
Jesus used the metaphor of maturing fruit. that is understood thru sola scriptura.
To deny that Jesus used the metaphor of fruit maturing is to do what you accuse me of
All this nonsense does raise the question why you and Civic want to deny that fruit must grow and mature
 

Chalcedon

Well-known member
Jesus used the metaphor of maturing fruit. that is understood thru sola scriptura.
To deny that Jesus used the metaphor of fruit maturing is to do what you accuse me of
All this nonsense does raise the question why you and Civic want to deny that fruit must grow and mature
Where did Paul say " Mature " fruit in Galatians 5:22-26 below ?

But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law. 24 Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires. 25 Since we live by the Spirit, let us keep in step with the Spirit. 26 Let us not become conceited, provoking and envying each other.
 

Sethproton

Well-known member
Where did Paul say " Mature " fruit in Galatians 5:22-26 below ?

But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law. 24 Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires. 25 Since we live by the Spirit, let us keep in step with the Spirit. 26 Let us not become conceited, provoking and envying each other.
Yes, good. This is your backhanded way of admitting that fruit, before being useful, must mature.
 

Chalcedon

Well-known member
Yes, good. This is your backhanded way of admitting that fruit, before being useful, must mature.
Nice try- Get thee behind me !

What I said was NOWHERE does Jesus or Paul ever say that the fruit of the spirit takes time.

But I noticed you ran away from my previous questions. So lets try this again.

Is the new birth a miracle from God ? yes or no

Is a miracle from God that occurs instantaneously seen ? yes or no

next
 

Sethproton

Well-known member
Nice try- Get thee behind me !

What I said was NOWHERE does Jesus or Paul ever say that the fruit of the spirit takes time.

But I noticed you ran away from my previous questions. So lets try this again.

Is the new birth a miracle from God ? yes or no

Is a miracle from God that occurs instantaneously seen ? yes or no

next
Two different issues.
Yes, the new life is an instantaneous miracle.
Fruit takes time
 

Chalcedon

Well-known member
No. Galatians 5 does not claim that fruit is instantaneous. Fruit develops over time, that is why the maetaphor is used
Miracles are instantaneous as you acknowledged earlier was true.

Back peddling now that I exposed your FLAWED and unbiblical, unspiritual logic eh ?

next
 

Sethproton

Well-known member
Miracles are instantaneous as you acknowledged earlier was true.

Back peddling now that I exposed your FLAWED and unbiblical, unspiritual logic eh ?

next
Are you just not reading anything for understanding? Back peddling? I have not changed what I am saying.
Regeneration is an instant miracle. Fruit grows over time, even miraculous fruit still has to grow and mature.
Paul and Jesus would not have used fruit as a metaphor if there was no time involved
 

Chalcedon

Well-known member
Are you just not reading anything for understanding? Back peddling? I have not changed what I am saying.
Regeneration is an instant miracle. Fruit grows over time, even miraculous fruit still has to grow and mature.
Paul and Jesus would not have used fruit as a metaphor if there was no time involved
sure you have follow along

1- I said miracles are instantaneous to which you agreed.
2- You agree the new birth was a miracle
3- The miracle of the new birth one has the spirit of God dwelling in them
4- The spirit only produces fruit
5- There is no time-frame with the things of the spirit.
6- I and many others upon the miracle of the new birth experienced the fruit of the spirit mentioned in Galatians 5 immediately upon conversion
7- You now want to say the Physical equals the Spiritual when its CONVENIENT
8- Spiritually Dead in your world is different than spiritually dead- Contradictions anyone ?
9- You cannot have your cake and eat it too
10- Back to the drawing board with your JW buddies.

next
 

Chalcedon

Well-known member
Two different issues.
Yes, the new life is an instantaneous miracle.
Fruit takes time
How long before a person experiences the Holy Spirit in the new birth ?

Can you tell us how long it took on the day of Pentecost for those with the Spirit to bear Fruit ?

next
 

Sethproton

Well-known member
sure you have follow along

1- I said miracles are instantaneous to which you agreed.
2- You agree the new birth was a miracle
3- The miracle of the new birth one has the spirit of God dwelling in them
4- The spirit only produces fruit
5- There is no time-frame with the things of the spirit.
6- I and many others upon the miracle of the new birth experienced the fruit of the spirit mentioned in Galatians 5 immediately upon conversion
7- You now want to say the Physical equals the Spiritual when its CONVENIENT
8- Spiritually Dead in your world is different than spiritually dead- Contradictions anyone ?
9- You cannot have your cake and eat it too
10- Back to the drawing board with your JW buddies.

next
yes Civic, this is your MO. Avoid direct questions, slander posters and throw cut and pastes to try to muddy the water.
Again, if you claim I am aligned with JW on the resurrected body, tell us what they teach, And I will tell you if i agree
 

Chalcedon

Well-known member
yes Civic, this is your MO. Avoid direct questions, slander posters and throw cut and pastes to try to muddy the water.
Again, if you claim I am aligned with JW on the resurrected body, tell us what they teach, And I will tell you if i agree
I see you are incapable of a cogent response. Thanks anyways for wasting our time once again since you cannot prove anything you believe with Scripture or sources to back up your man=made ideas.
 

Chalcedon

Well-known member
Any reasonable person will acknowledge that you made a claim about me and JW, that you are unable or unwilling to support
I have shown everyone the similarities between you and quoted both of you revealing your unbiblical ideas are identical.
 

Theo1689

Well-known member
Any reasonable person will acknowledge that you made a claim about me and JW, that you are unable or unwilling to support

More insults. Anyone who disagrees with seth's false claims is allegedly "unreasonable". Seriously, seth... Can you even write ONE post without personal attacks?
 

Sethproton

Well-known member
I see you are incapable of a cogent response. Thanks anyways for wasting our time once again since you cannot prove anything you believe with Scripture or sources to back up your man=made ideas.
the issue at hand is not what I can support. It is your false claim that I agree with JW regarding the resurrection body.
Can you support it? If not can you apologize?
 
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