Jesus The Jews' Messiah?

Dant01

Active member
.
Our primary sources for this explanation are "Things To Come" by J. Dwight
Pentecost and "The Coming Prince" by Sir Robert Anderson.

Our point of reference is Daniel 9:25-26 where it's said:

"So you are to know and discern that from the issuing of a decree to restore and
rebuild Jerusalem until Messiah the Prince there will be seven weeks and sixty-two
weeks. After the sixty-two weeks Messiah will be cut off."

Now a technicality to be aware of is that those sixty-nine weeks are not heptads of
days, rather, of years; which when added up come to 483.

A further technicality to be aware of is that those 483 years aren't normal years,
rather, they're prophetic years, which are only 360 days apiece compared to normal
years which are roughly 364¼ days apiece.

So, in normal years, the sixty-nine weeks add up to only 477.

Turning to Neh 1:1-2:18, we find our hero depressed and upset because his home
town, the very city where his relatives are buried, was in ruins; its wall broken
down, and its gates ashes. So, with a goodly amount of butterflies in his stomach,
Nehemiah petitioned his boss for a leave of absence to go and rebuild Jerusalem.

Artaxerxes gave him permission, supported by official memorandums, in the month
of Nisan, in the twentieth year of his reign. So it is in Neh 2 that we find the only
actual Bible record of a royal permit to rebuild the city of Jerusalem. This, then, is
our choice for the beginning of Daniel's prediction.

Fortunately, the date of Artaxerxes reign can be easily and definitely ascertained--
not from the elaborate investigative treatises of biblical commentators and
prophetic writers; but from ordinary history books. Artaxerxes-- a.k.a. Artaxerxes 1
--reigned from 465-425 BCE.

According to Nehemiah, the Persian edict, which gave him permission to rebuild
Jerusalem, was issued during the Jewish month of Nisan in the twentieth year of
Artaxerxes. Unfortunately the exact day is not given. It is very possible the decree
was dated the 1st of Nisan; but that's not really important as long as we come
close enough for practical consideration. The sixty-nine weeks then, within reason,
and close enough for our purposes, will therefore be calculated from the 1st of
Nisan 445 BCE.

Counting 477 normal years forward from 445 BC drops us off at 32 CE which, if
correct, becomes the year that Daniel predicted Messiah would be cut off. That
figure appears to be in the ball park; and here's why:

According to Luke 3:1-3, Tiberius was the emperor in Rome when John the Baptist
began his public ministry.

Tiberius' reign spanned 14 CE to 37 CE and according to Luke, John's ministry
began sometime in 29 CE. Precisely on what day Jesus was baptized by John we
don't know for sure, but we do know that he was about thirty years old at the time.
(Luke 3:21-23)

Jesus' own ministry ran about three years before he was cut off. So if we add 3 to
29 we get 32 CE.

* We're not trying to prove that Jesus was the Messiah predicted by Daniel 9:25
26. We're only explaining why we believe he's a reasonable candidate due to the
fact that his life and times coincide remarkably well with Daniel's time element.
_
 
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Keraz

Active member
Our primary sources for this explanation are "Things To Come" by J. Dwight
Pentecost and "The Coming Prince" by Sir Robert Anderson.
Reliance on 'experts' from the past cannot be right, as we are told in Daniel 12:4 that the Prophetic Word is sealed until the time of the end.
Then; only a few will understand; Daniel 12:10
Also; Jesus said that God hides His secrets from the learned and wise. Matthew 11:25

However, carful reading and intensive study, with an open mind, does lead to understanding of what God has planned for our future.
In the website - logostelos.info, the Prophesies are set out in an easily read way with explanations from other scriptures and from modern knowledge.
 

American Gothic

Well-known member
So, in normal years

the Rabbinic/Pharisaic calendar is probably not the Biblical calendar

there are 360 monthly days (12 months/30 days each) , 4 Takufah outside the month "days" (equinoxes/solstices)
and an occasional leap week
on a certain Dead Sea Scroll calendar

445bc for the decree and 32ad for death of Messiah
seem to match reconstruction I'm familiar with
 
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Dant01

Active member
.
we are told in Daniel 12:4 that the Prophetic Word is sealed until the time of the
end.

The Hebrew word translated "sealed" is somewhat ambiguous. It's located in
something like 27 passages in the Old Testament in a variety of applications; and
rarely, if ever, has anything at all to do with secrecy.


BTW: It's none of my business but you might consider distancing yourself from the
"we" with whom you've been associating and find yourself some friends familiar
with the linguistic resources compiled with the Strong's Concordance.
_
 

Keraz

Active member
.


The Hebrew word translated "sealed" is somewhat ambiguous. It's located in
something like 27 passages in the Old Testament in a variety of applications; and
rarely, if ever, has anything at all to do with secrecy.


BTW: It's none of my business but you might consider distancing yourself from the
"we" with whom you've been associating and find yourself some friends familiar
with the linguistic resources compiled with the Strong's Concordance.
_
I have a Strongs Exhaustive Concordance I often refer to it.
That the Prophetic Word is sealed, is confirmed by how Daniel 12:4 says many will rush about trying to gain this knowledge, Unsuccessfully
So whatever the Hebrew word says; the context dictates the true meaning.

Other prophesies like Isaiah 42:18-20 and Isaiah 8:16, also prove this inability to understand the Bible prophesies. Evidenced by the many and varied beliefs about the end times among Christians.
 

Dant01

Active member
.
A Word Of Caution:

If perchance someone out there feels like computing Messiah's first visit on their
own, just be sure to begin your dating with the commission to rebuild the city of
Jerusalem rather than the Temple because those two tasks weren't taken up
simultaneously.
_
 

Dant01

Active member
.
Unfortunately important genealogies archived in the Temple were lost when Titus
sacked Jerusalem; so that now any man claiming to be Messiah will have some
difficulty establishing his relation to David and the tribe of Judah.


NOTE: Messiah's association with the tribe of Judah was predicted as far back as
Genesis 49:10 which states:

"The scepter shall not depart from Judah, nor a lawgiver from between his feet,
until Shiloh come; and unto him shall the gathering of the people be." (cf.
Sanhedrin 98b)
_
 

Arkycharlie

Super Member
Ignorance reigns supreme in this thread! The only thing that I personally agree with is the assertion of Keraz that the prophecies of Daniel remain "sealed and concealed" to the vast majority of expositors and teachers to this very day.
 

Dant01

Active member
.
the prophecies of Daniel remain "sealed and concealed" to the vast majority of
expositors and teachers to this very day.

So then you admit that there exists at least a minority of expositors and teachers to
this very day for whom Daniel's prophecy has been unsealed and unconcealed?

That situation was true in the first century too because on at least one occasion
Jesus made it possible for some guys he encountered on the way to Emmaus to
understand Daniel's prophecy. (Luke 24:27)

Now; there is a difficulty hindering the majority that they cannot overcome. The
sealing and concealing of Daniel's prophecy makes it impossible for the majority to
recognize his true meanings when shown them, even when his true meanings are
explained in the simplest of terms, viz: they can neither recognize, nor accept,
the true meanings of Daniel's prophecy even when the meanings came to them from
someone they greatly admire and/or highly respect.

In other words: the vast majority could actually be looking right at the true
meanings of Daniel's prophecy and not even know it.
_
 

Dant01

Active member
.
In other words: the vast majority could actually be looking right at the true meanings of
Daniel's prophecy and not even know it.

I think it's safe to assume that the guys Jesus encountered on the way to Emmaus
constitute the minority whom Jesus empowers to understand "all the prophets"
(Luke 24:27).

And I think it's safe to assume that the folks to whom Jesus showed himself alive in
Luke 24:33-45 also constitute the minority whom Jesus empowers to understand
all the prophets.

In addition, I think it's safe to assume there is even now, in our own time, a number
of folks constituting the minority in accord with Eph 4:11-14 whom Jesus empowers
to understand all the prophets.

So then, seeing as how there exists a minority of folks in our own time whom Jesus
has empowered to understand all the prophets; then who, I might ask, is listening
to them? Answer: a very select group.

1Cor 2:12-14 . . Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit
which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.
Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but
which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual. But the
natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness
unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
_
 

Arkycharlie

Super Member
.So then you admit that there exists at least a minority of expositors and teachers to
this very day for whom Daniel's prophecy has been unsealed and unconcealed?
With almost 8 billion people in the world, I have no basis upon which to speculate who or how many the Lord may have given insight and understanding of the prophecies of Daniel. Based upon the two references that you cited, you most certainly don't qualify in that regard!
That situation was true in the first century too because on at least one occasion
Jesus made it possible for some guys he encountered on the way to Emmaus to
understand Daniel's prophecy. (Luke 24:27)
When Jesus began His earthly ministry, it was necessary for the Jewish people to have an accurate understanding of the prophecy of Daniel's seventy weeks. And the Gospels make it clear that they did! Otherwise, they could not have received a "good faith" offer of the Kingdom which, according to the plan and purpose of the Godhead, they rejected and crucified their Messiah. When He began His ministry and was baptized by John, the religious leaders were aware that the end of the first 483 years was at hand. That is why there was such excitement and expectation in Jerusalem.

Now; there is a difficulty hindering the majority that they cannot overcome. The sealing and concealing of Daniel's prophecy makes it impossible for the majority to recognize his true meanings when shown them, even when his true meanings are explained in the simplest of terms, viz: they can neither recognize, nor accept, the true meanings of Daniel's prophecy even when the meanings came to them from someone they greatly admire and/or highly respect.

In other words: the vast majority could actually be looking right at the true meanings of Daniel's prophecy and not even know it.
I couldn't have said it any better! So I assume that you don't consider yourself in that category. When you state:
"Our primary sources for this explanation are "Things To Come" by J. Dwight Pentecost and "The Coming Prince" by Sir Robert Anderson."
you put yourself squarely in the category of unable to understand the prophecies of Daniel even when explained "in the simplest of terms". Anderson's "The Coming Prince" was a key source used by the Lord to keep the Daniel 9 sealed and concealed until the appointed time of the end. The time in which we now find ourselves!
 

Dant01

Active member
.
I sincerely believe myself placed squarely in the category of the select group
enabled by God's Spirit to hear, and to accept, the explanations of Daniel's
prophecy taught by the inspired minority spoken of by Eph 4:11-14.

1Cor 2:12-14 . . Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit
which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.
Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but
which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual. But the
natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness
unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
_
 

Arkycharlie

Super Member
.I sincerely believe myself placed squarely in the category of the select group
enabled by God's Spirit to hear, and to accept, the explanations of Daniel's
prophecy taught by the inspired minority spoken of by Eph 4:11-14.

As if that wasn't patently obvious. "Sincerity" does not correctly interpret Scripture! You admit that you get your vast knowledge from the writings of others: "Our primary sources for this explanation are "Things To Come" by J. Dwight Pentecost and "The Coming Prince" by Sir Robert Anderson."

Everything that I post is based upon my own research in the original languages with two overriding principles: literal interpretation and Scripture interprets Scripture. Are you aware that the Gospels of Matthew and Luke have a direct quote from Daniel 9:26? And this quote makes it quite clear how the religious leaders in Israel at the time of Christ interpreted the seventy weeks and it most certainly was not the fabrication of Anderson's "The Coming Prince". Perhaps you're aware of the passages that I refer to. My guess is that you're not even going to make a stab at it because you don't have the slightest clue. Prove me wrong if you think you can!
 

Dant01

Active member
.
At the moment, Jesus isn't physically available for obtaining the empowerment
spoken of by Luke 24:27; which says:

"And beginning at Moses and all the Prophets, he expounded unto them in all the
scriptures the things concerning himself."

all the prophets includes Daniel because "all" precludes the possibility of omitting
him from the list.

However, Jesus' genuine followers have access to the next best thing during his
physical absence.

John 14:25-26 . .These things I have spoken to you, while abiding with you. But
the helper-- the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name --he will teach
you all things, and bring to your remembrance all that I said to you.

Only Jesus' genuine followers are empowered with the helper spoken of in that
passage; thus it is very difficult, if not impossible, for students of the Bible deprived
of the helper to interpret the Bible the same way Christ interprets it.

1Cor 2:11-14 . . No one knows the things of God except the Spirit of God. Now
we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, that
we might know the things that have been freely given to us by God.

. . .These things we also speak, not in words which man's wisdom teaches but
which the Holy Spirit teaches, comparing spiritual things with spiritual. But the
natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are
foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

So then; when folks attempt to interpret the Bible while deprived of the Spirit of
God, they not only fail to interpret the Bible the way Christ would teach it, but their
beliefs will actively oppose his right along with opposing those of his genuine followers.
_
 
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Arkycharlie

Super Member
So then; when folks attempt to interpret the Bible while deprived of the Spirit of
God
, they not only fail to interpret the Bible the way Christ would teach it, but their
beliefs will actively oppose his right along with opposing those of his genuine followers.
_
Oh, that's a classy response. Since you have no answer to my question, you stoop to an Ad hominem attack implying that I'm not actually a Christian. Invariably, when folks simply parrot the the views of others, they're ill equipped to defend those views when challenged. When the subject is eschatology, you're a fraud, purporting to be an "expert" but completely lacking in substance.

I said, "My guess is that you're not even going to make a stab at it because you don't have the slightest clue." and I rest my case!
 

Keraz

Active member
You that are deaf - hear now. Look you blind, and see!

Isaiah 42:9 The earlier prophecies have come to pass, now I declare new things:

Isaiah 42:10-12 Sing a new song to the Lord, sing His praises throughout the world, you that sail the seas and you that inhabit the coasts and islands. Let the wilderness settlements rejoice in Kedar and Sela.

Isaiah 42:13-15 Long have I restrained Myself and kept silence, but now I cry out like a woman in labour. Now I shall lay waste to the hills and dry up the watercourses. The Lord will go forth as a warrior, He will raise the battle cry and triumph over His enemies.

Isaiah 42:16-24 You that are deaf, hear now, look you blind and see! Who is as blind as the one who has My trust, so deaf as the servant of the Lord? You have seen much but perceived little, your ears are open, but you hear nothing. I shall lead the blind along paths they do not know, making smooth the way, but those who trust in idols will be turned back in shame. It pleased the Lord to further His justice, to make His Law great. Yet, here is a people taken as spoil and plundered, all hidden away with no hope of rescue. Who will pay heed to this? Who was it that handed Israel over? Who gave up Israel for spoil? It was the Lord, against whom they sinned for they refused obedience to His Laws.

Isaiah 42 :25 So, onto Jacob He poured His wrath. The flames of God’s wrath burned him, yet still they did not take it to heart.

Isaiah 43:1-2 But now, Jacob, this is the word of the Lord, of Him who created you: When you pass through waters, I will be with you. When you walk through fire, you will not be scorched.

Isaiah 43:3-4 I am the Holy One of Israel, your Deliverer. Because I love you, I will give other peoples as ransom for your life.

Isaiah 43:5-7 Have no fear, for I am with you. I shall bring your descendants from the East and West. From the North and South and the ends of the earth, everyone who bears My name, all who I have made for My glory.

Isaiah 43:8 Lead out those who are blind – a people who have eyes, but cannot see, who have ears, but cannot hear.

Isaiah 43:9 The nations are gathered. Which of them foretold former things? Or can interpret this for us? Let them prove their case, so we can see if it is true.

Isaiah 43:10-13 You are My witnesses, says the Lord. You are My servants, chosen by Me, so that you may understand that I am God alone. I am the Lord and I alone am your Deliverer. What I do, no one can undo. Reference: Revised English Bible, some verses abridged



42:10-12 All those who love the Lord, throughout the world – get ready to praise Him for their deliverance.

42:13-15 The Lord has restrained Himself, but soon He will act in the world. Psalms 50:1-6

42:16-17 His People, righteous Christians, the Israelites of God, will be led into the Promised Land. Anyone who revolts and rebels cannot enter. Ezekiel 20:37-38

42:18-20 & 43:8 The Lord’s servants are unable to understand prophecy or foresee His plans for them. Jeremiah 4:22, Jeremiah 6:10 That is how God wants it.

42:22-25 His people, the faithful Christians, are scattered among the nations by the Lord, as punishment for the sins of their spiritual forefathers 2 Kings 23:27, Galatians 3:26-29

43:1-7 But now, when the Lord sends His vengeance and fiery wrath, the Lord will protect His faithful people. . All will be gathered into the Promised Land. Zechariah 10:8-10, Isaiah 35:1-10, Ezekiel 34:11-16, Romans 9:24-26

43:9-13 The other nations are ignorant of the Lord’s plans. The faithful Christians are His witnesses and servants chosen by Him, so they will know God and spread the Gospel of the soon to come, Kingdom of Jesus. Isaiah 66:19, 1 Peter 2:9-10

 

Dant01

Active member
.
Most Christians readily attest that Jesus (a.k.a. Y'shua) is God, but typically
without knowing why he's God, nor knowing how he obtained divine status.
Well; the thing is; Jesus could not be a high priest seated at the right hand
of God in Heaven without divinity; so that has to be addressed.

Heb 7:1-3 . .This Melchizedek was king of Salem and priest of God Most High. He
met Abraham returning from the defeat of the kings and blessed him, and Abraham
gave him a tenth of everything. . . .Without father or mother, without genealogy,
without beginning of days or end of life, like the Son of God he remains a priest
forever.

The reference is to Gen 14:1-20 where Abraham fielded an army to rescue his
nephew Lot from a foreign invader named Chedorlaomer. You would think that the
author's Jewish friends would already know all about that particular event in their
history. But we need to keep in mind that the recipients of this letter were lax in
their study of the Scriptures (Heb 5:10-14). Even today, a number of Jews, even
pious Jews, are familiar with the Talmud, Halacha, Midrash, Mishna, and some
other writings, but not too familiar with the Tanakh.

Now, Jesus didn't follow in Melchizedek's footsteps. In point of fact, the two men
aren't even related. Jesus descends from Abraham, whereas Mel's family history is
completely unknown.

From a certain point of view, Mel is a self-existent eternal being, viz: there's no
record of his birth and there's no record of his death; indicating that priests
patterned after Melchizedek have to be men who were never born, and who have
yet to die.

Jesus is often claimed to be a self-existent eternal being right from his mother's
womb, but no, he wasn't. From the information we have to work with; Jesus was a
normal Jewish man whose blood was David's and Abraham's, i.e. Jesus wasn't some
sort of divine hominid; instead, he was a typical h.sapiens-- the Bible has his
genealogy, plus a record of his birth, and a record of his death. However; Jesus is
no longer reckoned a mere mortal in Heaven due to a very strange administrative
procedure.

As compensation for his exceptional service to both God and fellow men; Isa 52:13
and Phil 2:6-11 reveal that God bestowed upon Jesus Christ the name that is above
every name that can be named either in Heaven, on earth, and under the earth.
That name is Jehovah, a.k.a. Yahweh. (Isa 42:8)

So; Jesus is now officially authorized to be respected, to be identified, to be spoken
of, to be spoken to, and to speak for himself, by the name of God, i.e. The
Almighty. (Ps 45:1-7, Rev 1:8)

Ergo: as far as the Bible is concerned, Jesus is a self-existent eternal being because
his identity by the name of God affords him all the attributes of God: the whole ball
of wax, so to speak.

Bottom line: Jesus easily qualifies for the position of a high priest seated at the
right hand of God in Heaven because as Jehovah he had neither father nor mother,
nor is there a record of his birth or of his death.

Messiah's path to divinity may seem a tad ridiculous-- maybe even fraudulent --but
it's the path chosen for him so we have to work with it.


OBJECTION: Your explanation can't possibly be right; not when Deut 6:4 says;
"Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God, The Lord is one." You Christians have two acting
as Jehovah, whereas the Law allows for only one.


REPLY: Jesus' identity as Jehovah is an administrative credential which can be
roughly compared to the purpose of the signature ring that Pharaoh lent Joseph.
(Gen 41:39-44)

* Jesus' credential was promised to his ancestor Zerubbabel by Haggai 2:21-23
_
 

S.T.Ranger

Well-known member
.
Our primary sources for this explanation are "Things To Come" by J. Dwight
Pentecost and "The Coming Prince" by Sir Robert Anderson.

Our point of reference is Daniel 9:25-26 where it's said:

"So you are to know and discern that from the issuing of a decree to restore and
rebuild Jerusalem until Messiah the Prince there will be seven weeks and sixty-two
weeks. After the sixty-two weeks Messiah will be cut off."

Now a technicality to be aware of is that those sixty-nine weeks are not heptads of
days, rather, of years; which when added up come to 483.

A further technicality to be aware of is that those 483 years aren't normal years,
rather, they're prophetic years, which are only 360 days apiece compared to normal
years which are roughly 364¼ days apiece.

So, in normal years, the sixty-nine weeks add up to only 477.

Turning to Neh 1:1-2:18, we find our hero depressed and upset because his home
town, the very city where his relatives are buried, was in ruins; its wall broken
down, and its gates ashes. So, with a goodly amount of butterflies in his stomach,
Nehemiah petitioned his boss for a leave of absence to go and rebuild Jerusalem.

Artaxerxes gave him permission, supported by official memorandums, in the month
of Nisan, in the twentieth year of his reign. So it is in Neh 2 that we find the only
actual Bible record of a royal permit to rebuild the city of Jerusalem. This, then, is
our choice for the beginning of Daniel's prediction.

Fortunately, the date of Artaxerxes reign can be easily and definitely ascertained--
not from the elaborate investigative treatises of biblical commentators and
prophetic writers; but from ordinary history books. Artaxerxes-- a.k.a. Artaxerxes 1
--reigned from 465-425 BCE.

According to Nehemiah, the Persian edict, which gave him permission to rebuild
Jerusalem, was issued during the Jewish month of Nisan in the twentieth year of
Artaxerxes. Unfortunately the exact day is not given. It is very possible the decree
was dated the 1st of Nisan; but that's not really important as long as we come
close enough for practical consideration. The sixty-nine weeks then, within reason,
and close enough for our purposes, will therefore be calculated from the 1st of
Nisan 445 BCE.

Counting 477 normal years forward from 445 BC drops us off at 32 CE which, if
correct, becomes the year that Daniel predicted Messiah would be cut off. That
figure appears to be in the ball park; and here's why:

According to Luke 3:1-3, Tiberius was the emperor in Rome when John the Baptist
began his public ministry.

Tiberius' reign spanned 14 CE to 37 CE and according to Luke, John's ministry
began sometime in 29 CE. Precisely on what day Jesus was baptized by John we
don't know for sure, but we do know that he was about thirty years old at the time.
(Luke 3:21-23)

Jesus' own ministry ran about three years before he was cut off. So if we add 3 to
29 we get 32 CE.

* We're not trying to prove that Jesus was the Messiah predicted by Daniel 9:25
26. We're only explaining why we believe he's a reasonable candidate due to the
fact that his life and times coincide remarkably well with Daniel's time element.
_

Just a couple points that might be relevant (or not):

1. How long is a year in Prophecy?


Revelation 11
King James Version

1 And there was given me a reed like unto a rod: and the angel stood, saying, Rise, and measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein.

2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.

3 And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.



In v.3 we see a 360 day calendar used, which would coincide with forty-two months, or, 3 1/2 years.


2. Christ's ministry was two-fold: He ministered to the world in regards to Reconciliation, but had also a specific ministry that was specific to Israel:


Matthew 15:24 King James Version
But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.



3. Christ is not the "prince that shall come:"


Daniel 9:24-27 King James Version

24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.

25 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.

26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.

27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.



The reasons for not viewing the prince that shall come are:

1. Christians did not destroy the city and sanctuary: even if one wanted to spiritualize the text and say Levitical Service was made obsolete this was not accomplished by Christians.

2. Christ did not strengthen any Covenant for seven years.

3. Christ did not renege on any Covanant He established for three years after 3 1/2 years.

4. Christ did not, after His ministry, cause sacrifice and oblation to cease: Temple worship continued for another three decades.

5. Christ was cut off at the end of the 69 Weeks, not in the middle of the Seventieth.


We know His death made the Law obsolete, but this presents a seven-year period in which the Abomination which makes desolate will stand where he ought not. That hasn't happened yet.


God bless.
 

Dant01

Active member
.
Apparently quite a few people back then were expecting Messiah to show up; even
a Samaritan woman who I would've never guessed to be familiar with prophecy.

John 4:25 . .The woman said: I know that Messiah (called Christ) is coming.
When he comes, he will explain everything to us.

* Samaria represented the northern half of David's kingdom. It was sometimes
called Israel whilst the southern half was called Judah.

It was to the Samarians-- a.k.a. Israel --that God said: "You are not my people,
and I will not be your God. (Hosea 1:8-11)
_
 
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