Jewish Perspective on the Ten Commandments

[balshan]

They all used as a basis for how Jews should live and have specific context and meaning.

Some apply to general laws for living, some ceremonial, some court judgements, and some just laws with no apparent rational basis for them like the laws concerning the red heifer and cleansing from the dead.

Keep in mind, in general it is joked 2 Jews 3 opinions. Even within Orthodoxy, they are many flavors of Jews.

There's another joke about a Jew stranded on an island. He built 2 synagogues. One he wouldn't attend and one that he did. So, even within close circles, there are strong opinions and disagreements. Even the greatest Rabbi's disagreed.

I have heard those jokes before. I believe most of the statements are true for how all humanity should live. I mean there are the Noahide laws. It shows us how to treat each other. I know you disagree but reading the life of Yeshua, but it shows us a lot about how to treat one another. He is moved by empathy and compassion, do not worry about tomorrow, turn the other cheek, treat others as yourself etc.

I was surprised when doing the Jewish studies because of an attitude that some had in the class. I mean the Tanakh is very clear on how to treat each other when we do business dealings, we are to be fair. There was a case at the time of a real estate deal where a person was well and truly ripped off by what I would call poor ethics in a deal. Some in the course said it was okay it was just business, but others agreed with me that we are meant to be fair in our dealings. So yes different opinions.

The behaviour shown by Yeshua are in the Tanakh as well. It would be great if we all followed the greatest commandment, it would be a major difference in how we treat one another. I do not understand why their is a need in some people to harm or hurt others.

 

[Caroljeen]

The ten commandments (or ten statements or ten words) are simply part of the larger body of 613 laws that God gave to Moses for Israel. "Speak to the Children of Israel saying..."

Jews do organize the verses differently than Christains: we organize them as follows:
First Commandment (Exodus 20:2)
I am the Lord Your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage.

Second Commandment (Exodus 20:3-6)
You shall have no other gods beside Me. You shall not make for yourself any graven image, nor any manner of likeness, of any thing that is heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. You shall not bow down to them, nor serve them, for I, the Lord Your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation.

Third Commandment (Exodus 20:7)
You shall not take the name of the Lord Your God in vain; for the Lord will not hold him guiltless that takes His name in vain.

Fourth Commandment (Exodus 20:8-11)
Remember the Sabbath, to keep it holy. Six days you shall labor, and do all your work; but the seventh day is a Sabbath unto the Lord Your God, in it you shall not do any manner of work, you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your man-servant, nor your maid-servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger that is within your gates; for in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested on the seventh day. Wherefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day, and made it holy.

Fifth Commandment (Exodus 20:12)
Honor your father and your mother, that your days may be long upon the land which the Lord God gives you.

Sixth Commandment (Exodus 20:13)
You shall not murder.

Seventh Commandment (Exodus 20:13)
You shall not commit adultery.

Eighth Commandment (Exodus 20:13)
You shall not steal.

Ninth Commandment (Exodus 20:13)
You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.

Tenth Commandment (Exodus 20:14)
You shall not covet your neighbor’s house, nor his wife, his man-servant, his maid-servant, nor his ox, nor his ass, nor anything that is your neighbor’s.

What about the other ten commandments in Exodus 34:14-26? What is the Jewish opinion on those?

 

[Open Heart]

What about the other ten commandments in Exodus 34:14-26? What is the Jewish opinion on those?

I have not learned anything specific to this topic. Perhaps @Jewjitzu might be able to help you.

 

[Caroljeen]

I have not learned anything specific to this topic. Perhaps @Jewjitzu might be able to help you.

Thank you. I hope he can help me.

 

[Jewjitzu]

What about the other ten commandments in Exodus 34:14-26? What is the Jewish opinion on those?

As I said before, there are more than ten commandments. OpenHeart has pointed this out as well.

What is your specific question? There are 613 commandments by Jewish count.

 

[Caroljeen]

As I said before, there are more than ten commandments. OpenHeart has pointed this out as well.

What is your specific question? There are 613 commandments by Jewish count.

Were the commandments in Exodus 34:14-26 written on the second set of tablets? The set that Moses wrote during his second time of 40 days/40 nights with God on the mountain?

 

[Jewjitzu]

Were the commandments in Exodus 34:14-26 written on the second set of tablets? The set that Moses wrote during his second time of 40 days/40 nights with God on the mountain?

If we read Ex 34:1, we see that God indeed wrote again the original words of the ten sayings from the Har Sinai revelation on the tablets Moses carved out.

It can be understood that Moses wrote upon the tablets the additional words of v14-26 with the words God wrote, so that the translation reads from v28, "with the words of the covenant.", since the Hebrew particle "et" here means "with".

Or, being that Moses also wrote a book of the covenant, Ex 24:7; Deut 29:21; 31:26, these additional words could have been written on the book at that time for later insertion into the ark along with the decalogue.

This notion of a new or original 10 commandments in v14-26 was first conjectured in 1773 by a German poet Goethe. He later admitted to his insufficient knowledge in the matter (Wahrheit und Dichtung, Book XII). But, as you might expect, since then, other Bible critics like Wellhausen, etc., have followed this mistake, distinguishing between a moral and ritual decalogue.

 

[Caroljeen]

If we read Ex 34:1, we see that God indeed wrote again the original words of the ten sayings from the Har Sinai revelation on the tablets Moses carved out.

When you read down to Ex 34: 28 it looks like Moses wrote the commandments on the tablets that he carved.

It can be understood that Moses wrote upon the tablets the additional words of v14-26 with the words God wrote, so that the translation reads from v28, "with the words of the covenant.", since the Hebrew particle "et" here means "with".

God also said in Ex 34:27 The Lord said to Moses: Write these words; in accordance with these words I have made a covenant with you and with Israel.
It sounds like God is calling Ex 34: 14-26 "these words".

Or, being that Moses also wrote a book of the covenant, Ex 24:7; Deut 29:21; 31:26, these additional words could have been written on the book at that time for later insertion into the ark along with the decalogue.

The decalogue is the 10 commandments given by God from Sinai in Ex 20, correct?

This notion of a new or original 10 commandments in v14-26 was first conjectured in 1773 by a German poet Goethe. He later admitted to his insufficient knowledge in the matter (Wahrheit und Dichtung, Book XII). But, as you might expect, since then, other Bible critics like Wellhausen, etc., have followed this mistake, distinguishing between a moral and ritual decalogue.

What decalogue do you consider to be engraved on the two tablets spoken of in Exodus 24 and 31 or do you believe it was only the words of the covenant written on the two tablets?
What decalogue was engraved on the second set of tablets spoken of in Exodus 34?
Thank you for your help.

 

[Jewjitzu]

When you read down to Ex 34: 28 it looks like Moses wrote the commandments on the tablets that he carved.

And I answered that question. If you start with verse 34:1, you see God rewrote the decalogue.

God also said in Ex 34:27 The Lord said to Moses: Write these words; in accordance with these words I have made a covenant with you and with Israel.

Moses wrote additional words besides what God already wrote. The covenant includes 613 commandments.

It sounds like God is calling Ex 34: 14-26 "these words".

It's part of the overall covenant.

The decalogue is the 10 commandments given by God from Sinai in Ex 20, correct?

Yes.

What decalogue do you consider to be engraved on the two tablets spoken of in Exodus 24 and 31 or do you believe it was only the words of the covenant written on the two tablets?

Exodus 24:4,7, speaks of the book of the covenant, and Exodus 24:12 speaks of the tablets which the decalogue was written on from Exodus 20.

I believe Exodus 31:18 speaks of the same decalogue from Exodus 20.

What decalogue was engraved on the second set of tablets spoken of in Exodus 34?

The same from Exodus 20.

Thank you for your help.

No problem. The whole issue I believe is a misunderstanding of what Moses wrote himself.... the book of the law.

 

[Grace]

The ten commandments (or ten statements or ten words) are simply part of the larger body of 613 laws that God gave to Moses for Israel. "Speak to the Children of Israel saying..."

Jews do organize the verses differently than Christains: we organize them as follows:
First Commandment (Exodus 20:2)
I am the Lord Your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage.

Second Commandment (Exodus 20:3-6)
You shall have no other gods beside Me. You shall not make for yourself any graven image, nor any manner of likeness, of any thing that is heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. You shall not bow down to them, nor serve them, for I, the Lord Your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation.

Third Commandment (Exodus 20:7)
You shall not take the name of the Lord Your God in vain; for the Lord will not hold him guiltless that takes His name in vain.

Fourth Commandment (Exodus 20:8-11)
Remember the Sabbath, to keep it holy. Six days you shall labor, and do all your work; but the seventh day is a Sabbath unto the Lord Your God, in it you shall not do any manner of work, you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your man-servant, nor your maid-servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger that is within your gates; for in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested on the seventh day. Wherefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day, and made it holy.

Fifth Commandment (Exodus 20:12)
Honor your father and your mother, that your days may be long upon the land which the Lord God gives you.

Sixth Commandment (Exodus 20:13)
You shall not murder.

Seventh Commandment (Exodus 20:13)
You shall not commit adultery.

Eighth Commandment (Exodus 20:13)
You shall not steal.

Ninth Commandment (Exodus 20:13)
You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.

Tenth Commandment (Exodus 20:14)
You shall not covet your neighbor’s house, nor his wife, his man-servant, his maid-servant, nor his ox, nor his ass, nor anything that is your neighbor’s.

What is being commanded in the first commandment?

 

[Jewjitzu]

What is being commanded in the first commandment?

The belief in the existence of God. Otherwise, the rest doesn't matter.

 

[American Gothic]

the existence of God. Otherwise, the rest doesn't matter.

maybe it's just allegory

 

[Grace]

The belief in the existence of God. Otherwise, the rest doesn't matter.

OK. It certainly doesn't read that way to me, but if that's your belief, so be it. Thank you for answering my question. BTW, is your answer what Jewish scholars say or is it your opinion? (FYI - your opinion counts of course, I just want to know if your answer is aligned with Jewish teaching).

 

[En Hakkore]

If we read Ex 34:1, we see that God indeed wrote again the original words of the ten sayings from the Har Sinai revelation on the tablets Moses carved out.

No, the passage indicates the deity's intention to write something on the tablets... it is nowhere narrated in the chapter that he did so.

It can be understood that Moses wrote upon the tablets the additional words of v14-26 with the words God wrote, so that the translation reads from v28, "with the words of the covenant.", since the Hebrew particle "et" here means "with".

The את here is functioning as the direct object marker for the verb כתב --- your translation, while existing within the realm of possibility, is not the most natural way to read the text and is thus highly improbable. Indeed, I'm not aware of any major translation, including JPS, that interprets the particle as the preposition "with" and even footnotes this as a possible alternative. This idiosyncratic suggestion (if it exists somewhere in the rabbinic tradition, please supply the reference) further falters on the point above that the deity is nowhere narrated to have written anything on these tablets within the chapter for Moses to ostensibly supplement. If we take the conflicting report in Deuteronomy into consideration, Moses makes no claim to have added anything to what the deity wrote (10:1-4).

Or, being that Moses also wrote a book of the covenant, Ex 24:7; Deut 29:21; 31:26,

The Exodus and Deuteronomy documents you refer to here were written forty years apart from each other in a synchronic reading of the Torah.

This notion of a new or original 10 commandments in v14-26 was first conjectured in 1773 by a German poet Goethe. He later admitted to his insufficient knowledge in the matter (Wahrheit und Dichtung, Book XII). But, as you might expect, since then, other Bible critics like Wellhausen, etc., have followed this mistake, distinguishing between a moral and ritual decalogue.

To what "mistake" are you referring? Simply reading the text and observing we have two different sets of divine instructions labelled "the ten words"? The curt dismissal above does not overhaul a couple hundred years of critical scholarship on this matter...

Kind regards,
Jonathan

 

[Jewjitzu]

OK. It certainly doesn't read that way to me, but if that's your belief, so be it.

Yes, it is my belief.

Thank you for answering my question. BTW, is your answer what Jewish scholars say or is it your opinion?

Yes, my belief aligns with Orthodox Judaism, its Rabbi scholars, etc.

(FYI - your opinion counts of course, I just want to know if your answer is aligned with Jewish teaching).

In Orthodoxy, there are many opinions.

 

[Grace]

Yes, it is my believe.


Yes, my belief aligns with Orthodox Judaism, its Rabbi scholar, etc.


In Orthodoxy, there are many opinions.

Thanks.

 

[Jewjitzu]

No, the passage indicates the deity's intention to write something on the tablets... it is nowhere narrated in the chapter that he did so.

True, I assume He did. The passages also don't say Moses wrote on the tablets as God did in Exodus 31:18. It is narrated nowhere Moses did do

The את here is functioning as the direct object marker for the verb כתב --- your translation, while existing within the realm of possibility, is not the most natural way to read the text and is thus highly improbable. Indeed, I'm not aware of any major translation, including JPS, that interprets the particle as the preposition "with" and even footnotes this as a possible alternative. This idiosyncratic suggestion (if it exists somewhere in the rabbinic tradition, please supply the reference) further falters on the point above that the deity is nowhere narrated to have written anything on these tablets within the chapter for Moses to ostensibly supplement. If we take the conflicting report in Deuteronomy into consideration, Moses makes no claim to have added anything to what the deity wrote (10:1-4).

That my opinion is supported in the grammar should show it's a viable understanding. The other of course is it's a reference to the book of the law which Moses did write.

I believe Ibn Ezra holds the opinion regarding "et" in v28.

Deut 10:1-4 supports the understanding that God wrote the 2nd set of tablets with his finger as intimated in Exodus 34:1. I'm not sure why you think it conflicts?

The Exodus and Deuteronomy documents you refer to here were written forty years apart from each other in a synchronic reading of the Torah.

And?

To what "mistake" are you referring? Simply reading the text and observing we have two different sets of divine instructions labelled "the ten words"? The curt dismissal above does not overhaul a couple hundred years of critical scholarship on this matter...

I don't know about critical scholarship, but your entitled to your own opinion. I'm referring to a different set of 10 commandments starting from 34:14-26.

BTW, in 200 years of scholarship no one ever had a thought about the "et" particle? Kind of ironic if that's the case, right?

Kind regards,
Jonathan

Likewise.

 

[Open Heart]

What is being commanded in the first commandment?

The "first commandment" isn't actually a commandment, but a statement.
(Exodus 20:2)
I am the Lord Your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage.

 

[Grace]

The "first commandment" isn't actually a commandment, but a statement.
(Exodus 20:2)
I am the Lord Your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage.

I agree.

 

[En Hakkore]

True, I assume He did.

There's no reason to make this assumption unless one is committed to trying to harmonize disparate traditions within the Torah.

The passages also don't say Moses wrote on the tablets as God did in Exodus 31:18. It is narrated nowhere Moses did do

To the best of my knowledge no one is suggesting Moses had anything to do with the writing on the first set of tablets, which is what Exod 31:18 is referring to.

That my opinion is supported in the grammar should show it's a viable understanding.

I stated it was "within the realm of possibility" but because it is an unnatural way of reading the text that it was "highly improbable" --- indeed, let's compare the two options:

ויכתב על־הלחת את דברי הברית עשרת הדברים
And he wrote on the tablets the words of the covenant, the ten words
And he wrote on the tablets with the words of the covenant, the ten words

As noted previously, I'm not aware of any translation that renders it the way you propose, nor even footnotes it as a viable alternative. A direct object for the verb drops out of the clause, which is awkward but not unheard of... but this is compounded by ambiguity in the resultant prepositional phrase --- does it mean he wrote on the tablets that contained the covenant words or that he wrote on the tablets alongside the covenant words? There are more natural ways of conveying either one of these ideas that what you propose with a prepositional force to את. Your suggestion further deviates from the standard practice of marking direct objects of this verb elsewhere... analogical models for the standard translation are found within the context of Exodus:

Exod 24:4 // ויכתב משה את כל־דברי יהוה
Exod 34:1 // וכתבתי על־הלחת את־הדברים אשר היו על־הלחת הראשנים אשר שברת
Exod 34:27 // כתב־לך את־הדברים האלה

The two from chapter 34 are important since they establish syntactical alignments... particularly the second one since the imperative there is carried out in the verse in question. You would thus have to suggest that it, too, be retranslated "Write for yourself with these words", which makes even less sense since "these words" are a reference back not to anything written but to what the deity has just spoken in the preceding verses. Your suggestion is rendered problematic on so many levels that, as I said, it is highly improbable and rightly does not appear in any translation of which I am aware, even as a footnoted alternative.

The other of course is it's a reference to the book of the law which Moses did write.

What Moses writes is clarified to be the "ten words" so cannot be a "book of the law", whatever it is you think that might mean in this context.

I believe Ibn Ezra holds the opinion regarding "et" in v28.

You believe he mused so but cannot find the source of it? In any case, the critique above stands...

Deut 10:1-4 supports the understanding that God wrote the 2nd set of tablets with his finger as intimated in Exodus 34:1. I'm not sure why you think it conflicts?

It conflicts with Exod 34:27-28 that Moses wrote the "ten words" on these tablets.

And?

You tell me... you're the one who offered these passages in the context of discussion about chapter 34 --- what relevance do these purported writings --- one written ten chapters earlier and the other forty years later in the timeline of the Torah --- have to do with the subject at hand?

I don't know about critical scholarship, but your entitled to your own opinion. I'm referring to a different set of 10 commandments starting from 34:14-26.

The ones you propose were written alongside the other set of "ten words" that the Israelite deity wrote, making a total of twenty commandments on the tablets... attempts at harmonization lead inevitably to traditions held by none of the biblical authors.

BTW, in 200 years of scholarship no one ever had a thought about the "et" particle? Kind of ironic if that's the case, right?

Not really because it's a tortured reading of the text, as outlined above...

Kind regards,
Jonathan