John 15 Losing eternal life

There is a sense in which none of us, even the saved, trully understand the depth of our own sin, though the Bible describes it in various ways, but a saved person has at least acknowledged that the condition exists and asked God to deliver them.
But as for the concept of sin: unbelievers understand that concept. They know murder and theft are wrong. You do not need the indwelling Holy Spirit to acknowledge that, though they may lack conviction over having committed those sins

Cain hid Abel's body in the ground. I can accept that Cain knew he was guilty of sin.

1. Did Cain understand the innocence of Abel?
2. Did Cain understand the grief of God?

I believe we have to agree...

There is information that has to come directly from God to a sinner before they can be pleasing to Him.
 
Cain hid Abel's body in the ground. I can accept that Cain knew he was guilty of sin.

1. Did Cain understand the innocence of Abel?
2. Did Cain understand the grief of God?

I believe we have to agree...

There is information that has to come directly from God to a sinner before they can be pleasing to Him.
If you are suggesting that knowing truth makes us pleasing to God, I doubt that.
Just knowing is not salvatory
 
Cain hid Abel's body in the ground. I can accept that Cain knew he was guilty of sin.

1. Did Cain understand the innocence of Abel?
2. Did Cain understand the grief of God?

I believe we have to agree...

There is information that has to come directly from God to a sinner before they can be pleasing to Him.

That is a complicated story.
 
If you are suggesting that knowing truth makes us pleasing to God, I doubt that.
Just knowing is not salvatory

I agree.

Understanding is important and involves more than just blind acceptance. I'm making the point that regardless of how you slice Salvation, it involves the working of the Spirit of God to impart knowledge that can not be received any other way.
 
I agree.

Understanding is important and involves more than just blind acceptance. I'm making the point that regardless of how you slice Salvation, it involves the working of the Spirit of God to impart knowledge that can not be received any other way.

errrrr ...... ummm

Is this all about God saying we can not be?

Thought that was Satan's game?
 
I agree.

Understanding is important and involves more than just blind acceptance. I'm making the point that regardless of how you slice Salvation, it involves the working of the Spirit of God to impart knowledge that can not be received any other way.
Yes. I agree, but it more mysterious than just saying He imparts knowledge. Christains can talk about what the Spirit taught them and non-Christians can understand and discuss those facts. But we have to mix it with faith (Heb 4:2) before we get saved.
 
Yes. I agree, but it more mysterious than just saying He imparts knowledge. Christains can talk about what the Spirit taught them and non-Christians can understand and discuss those facts. But we have to mix it with faith (Heb 4:2) before we get saved.

Can describing our experience with God to others make a difference? I want to believe it does but how does it work?

If you describe your experience with God.....

1. Some will listen to you.
2. Some will mock you.
3. Some will hate you.
4. Some will accept your message.

Taking the fact that all these people heard and received the same identical impute "EXTERNALLY" from you, then what made the difference for the one that accepted your witness?
 
Heb. 4:2 For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it.

It doesn't say "we" are the ones who "have to fix it with faith".
The next verse continues the thought and says "For we who have believed" That is the further explanation and eguivalent of "mixed with faith"
 
Can describing our experience with God to others make a difference? I want to believe it does but how does it work?

If you describe your experience with God.....

1. Some will listen to you.
2. Some will mock you.
3. Some will hate you.
4. Some will accept your message.

Taking the fact that all these people heard and received the same identical impute "EXTERNALLY" from you, then what made the difference for the one that accepted your witness?
The sower and the seed explains some of that: the condition of each person's heart. Our heart is something we have been instructed to tend to(Prov 4:23), and the condition of it influences how we respond to God.
 
The sower and the seed explains some of that: the condition of each peron's heart. Our heart is something we have been instructed to tend to(Prov 4:23), and the condition of it influences how we respond to God.


Pro 4:19 The way of the wicked is as darkness: they know not at what they stumble.

Notice the contrast...

Pro 4:20 My son, attend to my words; incline thine ear unto my sayings.
Pro 4:21 Let them not depart from thine eyes; keep them in the midst of thine heart.
Pro 4:22 For they are life unto those that find them, and health to all their flesh.
Pro 4:23 Keep thy heart with all diligence; for out of it are the issues of life.
 
The sower and the seed explains some of that: the condition of each person's heart. Our heart is something we have been instructed to tend to(Prov 4:23), and the condition of it influences how we respond to God.

Again, you're assuming synergism.
In farming, soils don't condition themselves, the farmer does it.

And this fits perfectly with Scripture, which teaches that it is GOD who gives us a good heart:

Ezek. 11:19 And I will give them one heart, and I will put a new spirit within you; and I will take the stony heart out of their flesh, and will give them an heart of flesh:

Ezek. 36:26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.
 
Pro 4:19 The way of the wicked is as darkness: they know not at what they stumble.

Notice the contrast...

Pro 4:20 My son, attend to my words; incline thine ear unto my sayings.
Pro 4:21 Let them not depart from thine eyes; keep them in the midst of thine heart.
Pro 4:22 For they are life unto those that find them, and health to all their flesh.
Pro 4:23 Keep thy heart with all diligence; for out of it are the issues of life.
I agree, and 20-21 tell people how not to end up like in verse 19
 
That passage is not discussing the origin of faith, you would need to go to some other scriptures to be able to deal with that aspect, But in Hebrews 4:2+3 it is spoken of as something a person does

Yes, of course it is something a person does.
But it is not something a person can do if God doesn't give them faith (Eph. 2:8, Phil. 1:29, Rom. 12:3, 2 Pet. 1:1, John 10:26, etc.)
 
Again, you're assuming synergism.
In farming, soils don't condition themselves, the farmer does it.

And this fits perfectly with Scripture, which teaches that it is GOD who gives us a good heart:

Ezek. 11:19 And I will give them one heart, and I will put a new spirit within you; and I will take the stony heart out of their flesh, and will give them an heart of flesh:

Ezek. 36:26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.
Exactly like the farmer conditioning the soil. our hearts do not condition themselves, we are charged with that duty
 
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