Justification from everlasting

brightfame52

Well-known member
If it were it would not be contrary to

Romans 4:24 (KJV)
24 But for us also, to whom it shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead;

Romans 4:7-12 (KJV)
7 Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered.
8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin.
9 Cometh this blessedness then upon the circumcision only, or upon the uncircumcision also? for we say that faith was reckoned to Abraham for righteousness.
10 How was it then reckoned? when he was in circumcision, or in uncircumcision? Not in circumcision, but in uncircumcision.
11 And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had yet being uncircumcised: that he might be the father of all them that believe, though they be not circumcised; that righteousness might be imputed unto them also:
12 And the father of circumcision to them who are not of the circumcision only, but who also walk in the steps of that faith of our father Abraham, which he had being yet uncircumcised.

but it is so its error not truth
So you refuse to discuss the Gospel !
 
T

TomFL

Guest
So you refuse to discuss the Gospel !
That claim is a fabrication

You are running from objections to your theology

Unbelievers are not righteous and certainly not justified

Justification is by faith

Romans 4:24 (KJV)
24 But for us also, to whom it shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead;

Romans 4:7-12 (KJV)
7 Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered.
8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin.
9 Cometh this blessedness then upon the circumcision only, or upon the uncircumcision also? for we say that faith was reckoned to Abraham for righteousness.
10 How was it then reckoned? when he was in circumcision, or in uncircumcision? Not in circumcision, but in uncircumcision.
11 And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had yet being uncircumcised: that he might be the father of all them that believe, though they be not circumcised; that righteousness might be imputed unto them also:
12 And the father of circumcision to them who are not of the circumcision only, but who also walk in the steps of that faith of our father Abraham, which he had being yet uncircumcised.

but it is so its error not truth
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
Slain from the foundation of the World !

Rev 13:8

8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

Many false teachers try their best to destroy the Truth of this verse that John was inspired to write, and that is that Christ the Lamb was actually slain from the foundation of the World !

Yes, I said actually which means actual or existing fact !

He was actually slain from the foundation of the World by God's Decree and Purpose, which makes it an Actual Existing Fact in the Mind of God. John here is revealing to us the Mind of God on this matter !

And with that, this verse speaks to the Truthfulness of the Eternal Justification of all God's Elect in His Mind, Purpose and Decree from the foundation of the World, Yes for all them that Christ did come and die for in time, they were already Justified by the Purpose of God before Time Began. This is so much so, that in the Purpose, Decree, and Mind of God they were already Saved 2 Tim 1:9

9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,

Or it can read "Who hath saved or Justified us according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began"

Paul states the same here Titus 3:7

7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.

That is, Freely Justified by that Grace which was Given Us in Christ Jesus before the World Began !

This is a Gospel Truth, for Paul Just stated in Vs 8 2 Tim 1:8-10

8 Be not thou therefore ashamed of the testimony of our Lord, nor of me his prisoner: but be thou partaker of the afflictions of the gospel according to the power of God;


Which Gospel Truth He Proclaims in Vs 9

9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,

The Gospel is that Testimony of that Eternal Grace Given in Christ, which we are Justified by, before the World began.

Paul said the same also here Acts 20:2454

24 But none of these things move me, neither count I my life dear unto myself, so that I might finish my course with joy, and the ministry, which I have received of the Lord Jesus, to testify the gospel of the grace of God.

This Testimony of the Gospel of the Grace of God refers to 2 Tim 1:8-9 which enlightens of the Church's Eternal Justification by the Grace of God , premised on the Covenant Engagement of Christ being Slain for their Sins !

And to omit this Truth of the Gospel of the Grace of God is to consequently Preach No Gospel. Yes, Eternal Justification of the Church is a GOSPEL TRUTH, and I just proved it with scripture !
 
T

TomFL

Guest
Slain from the foundation of the World !

Rev 13:8

8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

Many false teachers try their best to destroy the Truth of this verse that John was inspired to write, and that is that Christ the Lamb was actually slain from the foundation of the World !

Yes, I said actually which means actual or existing fact !

He was actually slain from the foundation of the World by God's Decree and Purpose, which makes it an Actual Existing Fact in the Mind of God. John here is revealing to us the Mind of God on this matter !

And with that, this verse speaks to the Truthfulness of the Eternal Justification of all God's Elect in His Mind, Purpose and Decree from the foundation of the World, Yes for all them that Christ did come and die for in time, they were already Justified by the Purpose of God before Time Began. This is so much so, that in the Purpose, Decree, and Mind of God they were already Saved 2 Tim 1:9

9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,

Or it can read "Who hath saved or Justified us according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began"

Paul states the same here Titus 3:7

7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.

That is, Freely Justified by that Grace which was Given Us in Christ Jesus before the World Began !

This is a Gospel Truth, for Paul Just stated in Vs 8 2 Tim 1:8-10

8 Be not thou therefore ashamed of the testimony of our Lord, nor of me his prisoner: but be thou partaker of the afflictions of the gospel according to the power of God;


Which Gospel Truth He Proclaims in Vs 9

9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,

The Gospel is that Testimony of that Eternal Grace Given in Christ, which we are Justified by, before the World began.

Paul said the same also here Acts 20:2454

24 But none of these things move me, neither count I my life dear unto myself, so that I might finish my course with joy, and the ministry, which I have received of the Lord Jesus, to testify the gospel of the grace of God.

This Testimony of the Gospel of the Grace of God refers to 2 Tim 1:8-9 which enlightens of the Church's Eternal Justification by the Grace of God , premised on the Covenant Engagement of Christ being Slain for their Sins !

And to omit this Truth of the Gospel of the Grace of God is to consequently Preach No Gospel. Yes, Eternal Justification of the Church is a GOSPEL TRUTH, and I just proved it with scripture !
So you are not going to address this

Unbelievers are not righteous and certainly not justified

Justification is by faith

Romans 4:24 (KJV)
24 But for us also, to whom it shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead;

Romans 4:7-12 (KJV)
7 Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered.
8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin.
9 Cometh this blessedness then upon the circumcision only, or upon the uncircumcision also? for we say that faith was reckoned to Abraham for righteousness.
10 How was it then reckoned? when he was in circumcision, or in uncircumcision? Not in circumcision, but in uncircumcision.
11 And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had yet being uncircumcised: that he might be the father of all them that believe, though they be not circumcised; that righteousness might be imputed unto them also:
12 And the father of circumcision to them who are not of the circumcision only, but who also walk in the steps of that faith of our father Abraham, which he had being yet uncircumcised.

but it is so its error not truth
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
So you are not going to address this

Unbelievers are not righteous and certainly not justified

Justification is by faith

Romans 4:24 (KJV)
24 But for us also, to whom it shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead;

Romans 4:7-12 (KJV)
7 Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered.
8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin.
9 Cometh this blessedness then upon the circumcision only, or upon the uncircumcision also? for we say that faith was reckoned to Abraham for righteousness.
10 How was it then reckoned? when he was in circumcision, or in uncircumcision? Not in circumcision, but in uncircumcision.
11 And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had yet being uncircumcised: that he might be the father of all them that believe, though they be not circumcised; that righteousness might be imputed unto them also:
12 And the father of circumcision to them who are not of the circumcision only, but who also walk in the steps of that faith of our father Abraham, which he had being yet uncircumcised.

but it is so its error not truth
Did you understand the post ? I explained my point, lets discuss it. Anyone else care to discuss it ?
 
T

TomFL

Guest
Did you understand the post ? I explained my point, lets discuss it. Anyone else care to discuss it ?
I understand as should anyone who observes this is your typical method of avoiding

responding to objections to your view

Justification is by faith not unbelief
 

newheart78

Well-known member
Slain from the foundation of the World !

Rev 13:8

8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

Many false teachers try their best to destroy the Truth of this verse that John was inspired to write, and that is that Christ the Lamb was actually slain from the foundation of the World !

Yes, I said actually which means actual or existing fact !

He was actually slain from the foundation of the World by God's Decree and Purpose, which makes it an Actual Existing Fact in the Mind of God. John here is revealing to us the Mind of God on this matter !

And with that, this verse speaks to the Truthfulness of the Eternal Justification of all God's Elect in His Mind, Purpose and Decree from the foundation of the World, Yes for all them that Christ did come and die for in time, they were already Justified by the Purpose of God before Time Began. This is so much so, that in the Purpose, Decree, and Mind of God they were already Saved 2 Tim 1:9

9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,

Or it can read "Who hath saved or Justified us according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began"

Paul states the same here Titus 3:7

7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.

That is, Freely Justified by that Grace which was Given Us in Christ Jesus before the World Began !

This is a Gospel Truth, for Paul Just stated in Vs 8 2 Tim 1:8-10

8 Be not thou therefore ashamed of the testimony of our Lord, nor of me his prisoner: but be thou partaker of the afflictions of the gospel according to the power of God;


Which Gospel Truth He Proclaims in Vs 9

9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,

The Gospel is that Testimony of that Eternal Grace Given in Christ, which we are Justified by, before the World began.

Paul said the same also here Acts 20:2454

24 But none of these things move me, neither count I my life dear unto myself, so that I might finish my course with joy, and the ministry, which I have received of the Lord Jesus, to testify the gospel of the grace of God.

This Testimony of the Gospel of the Grace of God refers to 2 Tim 1:8-9 which enlightens of the Church's Eternal Justification by the Grace of God , premised on the Covenant Engagement of Christ being Slain for their Sins !

And to omit this Truth of the Gospel of the Grace of God is to consequently Preach No Gospel. Yes, Eternal Justification of the Church is a GOSPEL TRUTH, and I just proved it with scripture !

Amen Brother, though Christ did not experientially receive death for the sins of His Elect before the world began, He did receive it within the Divine Purpose of God imputatively by the Godhead: Particularly by the Father and the Spirit as a Witness; did judicially impute the sins of the Elect / the Sheep onto the Son, their Existing Mediator and Surety! Yes, they were also Justified before God because of this Eternal Purpose to impute sin on Christ. This was in the Mind of God from Everlasting, as if it had already been done Rom. 4:17; just as though they were already accomplished!
 
T

TomFL

Guest
Amen Brother, though Christ did not experientially receive death for the sins of His Elect before the world began, He did receive it within the Divine Purpose of God imputatively by the Godhead: Particularly by the Father and the Spirit as a Witness; did judicially impute the sins of the Elect / the Sheep onto the Son, their Existing Mediator and Surety! Yes, they were also Justified before God because of this Eternal Purpose to impute sin on Christ. This was in the Mind of God from Everlasting, as if it had already been done Rom. 4:17; just as though they were already accomplished!
Are you saying the word was imputed sinful ?
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
Amen Brother, though Christ did not experientially receive death for the sins of His Elect before the world began, He did receive it within the Divine Purpose of God imputatively by the Godhead: Particularly by the Father and the Spirit as a Witness; did judicially impute the sins of the Elect / the Sheep onto the Son, their Existing Mediator and Surety! Yes, they were also Justified before God because of this Eternal Purpose to impute sin on Christ. This was in the Mind of God from Everlasting, as if it had already been done Rom. 4:17; just as though they were already accomplished!
Exactly Sister, Praise God for your Testimony to the Truth !
 
T

TomFL

Guest
Dude what are you talking about ? You dont have a clue, but this is Gospel Truth !
Amen Brother, though Christ did not experientially receive death for the sins of His Elect before the world began, He did receive it within the Divine Purpose of God imputatively by the Godhead: Particularly by the Father and the Spirit as a Witness; did judicially impute the sins of the Elect / the Sheep onto the Son, their Existing Mediator and Surety! Yes, they were also Justified before God because of this Eternal Purpose to impute sin on Christ. This was in the Mind of God from Everlasting, as if it had already been done Rom. 4:17; just as though they were already accomplished!

That is heresy
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
Slain from the foundation of the World ! cont

Christ's Death for the Elect was an Eternal Offering, given through the Eternal Spirit Heb 9:14

14 How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?

It the Death or Offering of Christ was from a Human perspective offered in time, but ordained before time for its objects 1 Pet 1:20

20 Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you, The Church or the Elect of God 1 Pet 1:2, They would also be the foreknown of God Rom 8:29

29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

Rom 11:2

2 God hath not cast away his people which he foreknew. Wot ye not what the scripture saith of Elias? how he maketh intercession to God against Israel saying,

All those that would believe in God by Him 1 Pet 1:20-21

20 Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,

21 Who by him do believe in God, that raised him up from the dead, and gave him glory; that your faith and hope might be in God.

And it's Meritorious Effects, of His Death, are from Everlasting to Everlasting. The Effects of it had Eternal Influences on all that are Justified by it from Pre Cross to Post Cross, and by it they all had been sanctified and perfected forever Heb 10:10,14
 

newheart78

Well-known member
Slain from the foundation of the World ! cont

Christ's Death for the Elect was an Eternal Offering, given through the Eternal Spirit Heb 9:14

14 How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?

It the Death or Offering of Christ was from a Human perspective offered in time, but ordained before time for its objects 1 Pet 1:20

20 Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you, The Church or the Elect of God 1 Pet 1:2, They would also be the foreknown of God Rom 8:29

29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

Rom 11:2

2 God hath not cast away his people which he foreknew. Wot ye not what the scripture saith of Elias? how he maketh intercession to God against Israel saying,

All those that would believe in God by Him 1 Pet 1:20-21

20 Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,

21 Who by him do believe in God, that raised him up from the dead, and gave him glory; that your faith and hope might be in God.

And it's Meritorious Effects, of His Death, are from Everlasting to Everlasting. The Effects of it had Eternal Influences on all that are Justified by it from Pre Cross to Post Cross, and by it they all had been sanctified and perfected forever Heb 10:10,14
Amen Brother, excellent speech !
 
T

TomFL

Guest
Slain from the foundation of the World ! cont

Christ's Death for the Elect was an Eternal Offering, given through the Eternal Spirit Heb 9:14

14 How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?

It the Death or Offering of Christ was from a Human perspective offered in time, but ordained before time for its objects 1 Pet 1:20

20 Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you, The Church or the Elect of God 1 Pet 1:2, They would also be the foreknown of God Rom 8:29

29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

Rom 11:2

2 God hath not cast away his people which he foreknew. Wot ye not what the scripture saith of Elias? how he maketh intercession to God against Israel saying,

All those that would believe in God by Him 1 Pet 1:20-21

20 Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,

21 Who by him do believe in God, that raised him up from the dead, and gave him glory; that your faith and hope might be in God.

And it's Meritorious Effects, of His Death, are from Everlasting to Everlasting. The Effects of it had Eternal Influences on all that are Justified by it from Pre Cross to Post Cross, and by it they all had been sanctified and perfected forever Heb 10:10,14
Romans 8:29 is still a promise to those who loved God who God had known previously

Romans 8:28-29 (ESV)
28 And we know that for those who love God all things work together for good, for those who are called according to his purpose.
29 For those whom he foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, in order that he might be the firstborn among many brothers.

Romans 11:2 those who God knew in the past

Romans 11:2-5 (ESV)
2 God has not rejected his people whom he foreknew. Do you not know what the Scripture says of Elijah, how he appeals to God against Israel?
3 “Lord, they have killed your prophets, they have demolished your altars, and I alone am left, and they seek my life.”
4 But what is God’s reply to him? “I have kept for myself seven thousand men who have not bowed the knee to Baal.”
5 So too at the present time there is a remnant, chosen by grace.

nothing at all to do with men selected before the foundation of the earth for no apparent reason
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
Romans 8:29 is still a promise to those who loved God who God had known previously

Romans 8:28-29 (ESV)
28 And we know that for those who love God all things work together for good, for those who are called according to his purpose.
29 For those whom he foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, in order that he might be the firstborn among many brothers.

Romans 11:2 those who God knew in the past

Romans 11:2-5 (ESV)
2 God has not rejected his people whom he foreknew. Do you not know what the Scripture says of Elijah, how he appeals to God against Israel?
3 “Lord, they have killed your prophets, they have demolished your altars, and I alone am left, and they seek my life.”
4 But what is God’s reply to him? “I have kept for myself seven thousand men who have not bowed the knee to Baal.”
5 So too at the present time there is a remnant, chosen by grace.

nothing at all to do with men selected before the foundation of the earth for no apparent reason
You resisting the Gospel sir !
 
T

TomFL

Guest
You resisting the Gospel sir !
You avoid truth

Romans 8:29 is still a promise to those who loved God who God had known previously

Romans 8:28-29 (ESV)
28 And we know that for those who love God all things work together for good, for those who are called according to his purpose.
29 For those whom he foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, in order that he might be the firstborn among many brothers.

Romans 11:2 those who God knew in the past

Romans 11:2-5 (ESV)
2 God has not rejected his people whom he foreknew. Do you not know what the Scripture says of Elijah, how he appeals to God against Israel?
3 “Lord, they have killed your prophets, they have demolished your altars, and I alone am left, and they seek my life.”
4 But what is God’s reply to him? “I have kept for myself seven thousand men who have not bowed the knee to Baal.”
5 So too at the present time there is a remnant, chosen by grace.

nothing at all to do with men selected before the foundation of the earth for no apparent reason
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
You avoid truth

Romans 8:29 is still a promise to those who loved God who God had known previously

Romans 8:28-29 (ESV)
28 And we know that for those who love God all things work together for good, for those who are called according to his purpose.
29 For those whom he foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, in order that he might be the firstborn among many brothers.

Romans 11:2 those who God knew in the past

Romans 11:2-5 (ESV)
2 God has not rejected his people whom he foreknew. Do you not know what the Scripture says of Elijah, how he appeals to God against Israel?
3 “Lord, they have killed your prophets, they have demolished your altars, and I alone am left, and they seek my life.”
4 But what is God’s reply to him? “I have kept for myself seven thousand men who have not bowed the knee to Baal.”
5 So too at the present time there is a remnant, chosen by grace.

nothing at all to do with men selected before the foundation of the earth for no apparent reason
Looks like you evade truth. Thats all you do, never discuss.
 
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