Kenosis Heresy

101G

Well-known member
JG, my, my, my... are you thinking?, if all of the "ONE" Spirit, God that you say is the Son is in that Body, and the Spirit desended on him at his baptism .... then you have two Spirits..... :eek: YIKES, see your problem now?

PICJAG, 101G.
 

101G

Well-known member
I agree it's an anthromorphism. So you don't see Jesus as having a human body in heaven?
no, a resurrected Body, yes, scripture, 1 Corinthians 15:35 "But some man will say, How are the dead raised up? and with what body do they come?"
1 Corinthians 15:36 "Thou fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die:"
1 Corinthians 15:37 "And that which thou sowest, thou sowest not that body that shall be, but bare grain, it may chance of wheat, or of some other grain:"
1 Corinthians 15:38 "But God giveth it a body as it hath pleased him, and to every seed his own body."1 Corinthians 15:39 "All flesh is not the same flesh: but there is one kind of flesh of men, another flesh of beasts, another of fishes, and another of birds."
1 Corinthians 15:40 "There are also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial: but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another."
1 Corinthians 15:41 "There is one glory of the sun, and another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars: for one star differeth from another star in glory."
1 Corinthians 15:42 "So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:"1
Corinthians 15:43 "It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:"
1 Corinthians 15:44 "It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body."

so no, not any human flesh, he has no "BLOOD", which is the Life of a human body.
Ah, so he is no longer a fleshly being in heaven. Wouldn't that mean that he no longer exists in any way separate from the Father?
he is the Father, the Ordinal FIRST.

PICJAG, 101G.
 

Roger Thornhill

Well-known member
no, a resurrected Body, yes, scripture, 1 Corinthians 15:35 "But some man will say, How are the dead raised up? and with what body do they come?"
1 Corinthians 15:36 "Thou fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die:"
1 Corinthians 15:37 "And that which thou sowest, thou sowest not that body that shall be, but bare grain, it may chance of wheat, or of some other grain:"
1 Corinthians 15:38 "But God giveth it a body as it hath pleased him, and to every seed his own body."1 Corinthians 15:39 "All flesh is not the same flesh: but there is one kind of flesh of men, another flesh of beasts, another of fishes, and another of birds."
1 Corinthians 15:40 "There are also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial: but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another."
1 Corinthians 15:41 "There is one glory of the sun, and another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars: for one star differeth from another star in glory."
1 Corinthians 15:42 "So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:"1
Corinthians 15:43 "It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:"
1 Corinthians 15:44 "It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body."

so no, not any human flesh, he has no "BLOOD", which is the Life of a human body.

he is the Father, the Ordinal FIRST.

PICJAG, 101G.
I am Orthodox Oneness and agree there is no flesh in heaven. But your terminology confuses me. Is there an ordinal second? A third? A potential infinite number?
 

101G

Well-known member
Listen up people, Matthew 1:23 "Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us." How was God with us? in a body of flesh and Blood.

what people cannot understand is that the Spirit that was in that body is the "EQUAL SHARE" of the "ECHAD" .... the First, the Ordinal First and the Last, the Orrdinal Last. meaning the same Person, but how is this when the "Spirit" was G2758 κενόω kenoo? answer, Philippians 2:6 "Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:"

the term "Form" is the Greek word, G3444 μορφή morphe (mor-fee') n.
1. form.
2. (intrinsically) fundamental nature.
[perhaps from the base of G3313 (through the idea of adjustment of parts)]
KJV: form
Root(s): G3313

the Nature that the Lord Jesus has is an "EQUAL SHARE" of the ONE "Spirit". meaning he is the ECHAD or the equal share of himself in flesh.

How do we know this... again, the answer lay in the root of G3444 μορφή morphe which is G3313 μέρος meros (me'-ros) n.
1. a portion (i.e. an amount allotted, a part of something).

another word for "Portion" is ... "SHARE" BINGO, the Lord Jesus, (the one Spirit), one Person, is the Equal Share of himself in flesh.

in the Greek, it is called the G243 Allos. wehich means, "Allos expresses a numerical difference and denotes another of the same sort"

the NUMERICAL DIFFERENCE is the "ECHAD" in Ordinal First, Father/LORD, and Ordinal Last, Son/Lord. this is what the ECHAD is, "ONE" in "SHARE".

Deuteronomy 6:4 "Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD:"

ONE: H259 אֶחָד 'echad (ech-awd') adj.
1. (properly) united, i.e. one.
2. (as an ordinal) first.
[a numeral from H258]
KJV: a, alike, alone, altogether, and, any(-thing), apiece, a certain, (dai-)ly, each (one), + eleven, every, few, first, + highway, a man, once, one, only, other, some, together.
Root(s): H258

the Numerical Difference in G243 Allos is the Ordinal First, "LORD" in Deuteronomy 6:4, and the Ordinal Last "Lord" in the Last Adam, the Son,
1 Corinthians 15:45 "And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit."

PICJAG, 101G.
 

101G

Well-known member
I am Orthodox Oneness and agree there is no flesh in heaven. But your terminology confuses me. Is there an ordinal second? A third? A potential infinite number?
NO, only a Ordinal First who is ALSO the Ordinal Last, listen, Isaiah 41:4 "Who hath wrought and done it, calling the generations from the beginning? I the LORD, the first, and with the last; I am he." I, is a single person.
but it sound like two persons... meaning the term "WITH" don't it. well let the bible tell us if it's one or two persons,

Isaiah 48:12 "Hearken unto me, O Jacob and Israel, my called; I am he; I am the first, I also am the last."

Now Roger, tell us is this ONE person, or Two? ...... ALSO? .... remember G243 Allos, a numerical difference. your answer please.

PICJAG, 101G.
 

Roger Thornhill

Well-known member
NO, only a Ordinal First who is ALSO the Ordinal Last, listen, Isaiah 41:4 "Who hath wrought and done it, calling the generations from the beginning? I the LORD, the first, and with the last; I am he." I, is a single person.
but it sound like two persons... meaning the term "WITH" don't it. well let the bible tell us if it's one or two persons,

Isaiah 48:12 "Hearken unto me, O Jacob and Israel, my called; I am he; I am the first, I also am the last."

Now Roger, tell us is this ONE person, or Two? ...... ALSO? .... remember G243 Allos, a numerical difference. your answer please.

PICJAG, 101G.
What verse has allos for God or Christ?
 

101G

Well-known member
What verse has allos for God or Christ?
John 14:16 "And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;"
here G243 Allos is "Another", and that Comforter is the Lord Jesus, 1 John 2:1 "My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:"

and the Greek word for advocate is
G3875 παράκλητος parakletos (pa-ra'-klee-tos) n.
1. (properly) one called near (to give help).
2. an intercessor (one who entreats of behalf of another).
3. a comforter.

[(not given)]
KJV: advocate, comforter
Root(s): G3844, G2822

the same for "Comforter" in John 14:16, see definition #3, but also notice definition #2. an intercessor? ... who pray tell is that? let the bible, the Word of God, tell us by our teacher and guide the Holy Ghost... Romans 8:26 "Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered."

there he is, the "intercessor", Jesus the Christ the righteous: the Holy Spirit, the Ordinal FIRST.

understand Jesus the Christ is the First COMFORTER .... he was in Flesh, per, Luke 2:25. and now in Glorified flesh, he came in Spirit, on the day of Pentecost, as the "Spirit", our the Comforter, our Teacher, and Guide.... better known as the "HELPER", the Spirit of Truth, the GIFT, the Holy Spirit.

if any question, just ask.

PICJAG, 101G.
 

johnny guitar

Well-known member
if so then the ONE Spirit is only the Son. ONE PERSON... (smile), remember, there is ONE Spirit, and that ONE Spirit was G2758 κενόω kenoo. Philippians 2:7 "But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:"

and the ONE "Spirit" is the same ONE one Spirit in that body, Philippians 2:6 "Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:" and that "Form" is Spirit.

and the Spirit that was G2758 κενόω kenoo is EQUAL "WITH", God , because no one else is EQUAL with God, so it's all or NONE, and since you said all of the Spirit was in the man I agree, but how was all in him? and yet G2758 κενόω kenoo. THAT YOUR DELIMMIA.

SO HOW WAS ALL THE SAME ONE SPIRIT IN THAT BODY IN A G2758 κενόω kenoo STATES AND YET RAN THE UNIVERSE.? REMEMBER "GOD" IS A "SPIRIT". so either the one Spirit was in that body, (which it was), OR NOE, but that ONE Spirit in that Body was in a G2758 κενόω kenoo



PICJAG, 101G.
The ONE Spirit is Father, Son, Holy Spirit.
You are charged with mis-quoting me. I said that ONE Spirit BECAME A Man, NOT was in a body.
 

101G

Well-known member
The ONE Spirit is Father, Son, Holy Spirit.
You are charged with mis-quoting me. I said that ONE Spirit BECAME A Man, NOT was in a body.
First thanks for the replt, second, nope I did not, listen to yourself. if the ONE Spirit, as you say contain the three person, and that ONE "Spirit" was made flesh, then all three of your persons was G2758 κενόω kenoo (ke-no-ō'). because again, Phil 2:6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:
as said before, BEING is present tense, and FORM is NATURE, so the Nature that contain the three person... unless the NATURE was divided, all three of your persons in that one Spirit, which dwelt in that one Body was G2758 κενόω kenoo. or as said, either that nature was divided, and the scriptures clearly states that there is only "ONE" Spirit. and if two of your person was not G2758 κενόω kenoo, then you have a divided NATURE, because that Spiriut that was in that BODY, was G2758 κενόω kenoo,. .so all or some of the NATURE that contain your three person was either A. Divided, or B. was EQUALLY Shared in in the ECHAD, meaning ONLY one person was shared, (Which is what I teach, NO DIVISION of NATURE, only one person shared). so no division of Spirit, that (we both agree). so the correct answer is in the ECHAD as the Ordinal First, (Spirit), in Heaven), and the EQUALLY "SHARED", the Ordinal Last, (spirit), on Earth in flesh , now listen to the scripture, and understand, John 3:13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.

so what was in HEAVEN was not G2758 κενόω kenoo, but what was on earth was G2758 κενόω kenoo. ....... did you really grasped what was just said? again, he who is in HEAVEN, is the same "he" who was on earth at the same speaking here to a Pharisees, named Nicodemus. read the entire chapter. but as verse 13 states he who was in heaven, was on earth in flesh at the same time. now the revelation,

understand, just as G243 Allos States, "ANOTHER", the NUMERICAL DIFFERENCE, "IN" THE SAME NATURE of the SAME one PERSON,. and the Only way one can get a NUMERICAL DIFFERENCE IN THE SAME NATURE that is EQUALLY SHARED of the same ONE "PERSON", is in an ECHAD of a Ordinal Number designation, of FIRST and LAST., just as Deut 6:4, STATES. H259 אֶחָד 'echad (ech-awd') adj.
1. (properly) united, i.e. one.
2. (as an ordinal) first.
[a numeral from H258]
KJV: a, alike, alone, altogether, and, any(-thing), apiece, a certain, (dai-)ly, each (one), + eleven, every, few, first, + highway, a man, once, one, only, other, some, together.

LET us repete this, "The Only way one can get a NUMERICAL DIFFERENCE "IN" THE SAME NATURE that is of the same ONE "PERSON", is ONLY in an ECHAD of Ordinal Number designation, just as Deut 6:4, STATES". above in the definition. JG, and anyone else, ... one need to re-read that statement over, and over. again.

this answer HOW God can be G2758 κενόω kenoo in flesh, (ON EARTH), while yet upholding the universe at the same time in (HEAVEN), as the none G2758 κενόω kenoo. the Spirit, with all his POWERS intact.

we again suggest you re-read, and copy this informatation, because this is what the bibicial doctrine "Diversified Oneness" is teaching.

this is what the apostles was taught, the desiciples, and the Early church menbers was taught.

PICJAG, 101G.

now JG and many more this will eliminate any any so-called three person trinity........ more to come....
 

johnny guitar

Well-known member
First thanks for the replt, second, nope I did not, listen to yourself. if the ONE Spirit, as you say contain the three person, and that ONE "Spirit" was made flesh, then all three of your persons was G2758 κενόω kenoo (ke-no-ō'). because again, Phil 2:6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:
as said before, BEING is present tense, and FORM is NATURE, so the Nature that contain the three person... unless the NATURE was divided, all three of your persons in that one Spirit, which dwelt in that one Body was G2758 κενόω kenoo. or as said, either that nature was divided, and the scriptures clearly states that there is only "ONE" Spirit. and if two of your person was not G2758 κενόω kenoo, then you have a divided NATURE, because that Spiriut that was in that BODY, was G2758 κενόω kenoo,. .so all or some of the NATURE that contain your three person was either A. Divided, or B. was EQUALLY Shared in in the ECHAD, meaning ONLY one person was shared, (Which is what I teach, NO DIVISION of NATURE, only one person shared). so no division of Spirit, that (we both agree). so the correct answer is in the ECHAD as the Ordinal First, (Spirit), in Heaven), and the EQUALLY "SHARED", the Ordinal Last, (spirit), on Earth in flesh , now listen to the scripture, and understand, John 3:13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.

so what was in HEAVEN was not G2758 κενόω kenoo, but what was on earth was G2758 κενόω kenoo. ....... did you really grasped what was just said? again, he who is in HEAVEN, is the same "he" who was on earth at the same speaking here to a Pharisees, named Nicodemus. read the entire chapter. but as verse 13 states he who was in heaven, was on earth in flesh at the same time. now the revelation,

understand, just as G243 Allos States, "ANOTHER", the NUMERICAL DIFFERENCE, "IN" THE SAME NATURE of the SAME one PERSON,. and the Only way one can get a NUMERICAL DIFFERENCE IN THE SAME NATURE that is EQUALLY SHARED of the same ONE "PERSON", is in an ECHAD of a Ordinal Number designation, of FIRST and LAST., just as Deut 6:4, STATES. H259 אֶחָד 'echad (ech-awd') adj.
1. (properly) united, i.e. one.
2. (as an ordinal) first.
[a numeral from H258]
KJV: a, alike, alone, altogether, and, any(-thing), apiece, a certain, (dai-)ly, each (one), + eleven, every, few, first, + highway, a man, once, one, only, other, some, together.

LET us repete this, "The Only way one can get a NUMERICAL DIFFERENCE "IN" THE SAME NATURE that is of the same ONE "PERSON", is ONLY in an ECHAD of Ordinal Number designation, just as Deut 6:4, STATES". above in the definition. JG, and anyone else, ... one need to re-read that statement over, and over. again.

this answer HOW God can be G2758 κενόω kenoo in flesh, (ON EARTH), while yet upholding the universe at the same time in (HEAVEN), as the none G2758 κενόω kenoo. the Spirit, with all his POWERS intact.

we again suggest you re-read, and copy this informatation, because this is what the bibicial doctrine "Diversified Oneness" is teaching.

this is what the apostles was taught, the desiciples, and the Early church menbers was taught.

PICJAG, 101G.

now JG and many more this will eliminate any any so-called three person trinity........ more to come....
The Son of God did NOT dwell "in a body". He BECAME a Man.
Yet He NEVER ceased to be God.
 

101G

Well-known member
The Son of God did NOT dwell "in a body". He BECAME a Man.
Yet He NEVER ceased to be God.
JG, JG, JG, are you reading your bible? the Son of God is the "BODY" yes, that flesh bone and blood, listen, Luke 1:35 "And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God."

well, well, well, the son of God is BORN. JG are you saying that God is "BORN?", I hope not....... see the Son of God is the flesh bone and the blood,..... the "BODY", the spirit that dwelt in that body is the Son of Man, read and understand Isaiah 9:6.

see God the CREATOR, and MAKER of ALL THING, is not "BORN", but the flesh or the Body that he came in was. READ Luke 1:35 again. what was BORN is the son of God. I have said this before, and now again, the son of God came out of Mary, (the flesh body), the woman. the Son of man, (spirit), came from heaven.....

so READ your bible... ok, now the difference between the Son of God, and the son of Man.... ok.

PICJAG, 101G.
 

Anthony

Active member
JG, JG, JG, are you reading your bible? the Son of God is the "BODY" yes, that flesh bone and blood, listen, Luke 1:35 "And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God."

well, well, well, the son of God is BORN. JG are you saying that God is "BORN?", I hope not....... see the Son of God is the flesh bone and the blood,..... the "BODY", the spirit that dwelt in that body is the Son of Man, read and understand Isaiah 9:6.

see God the CREATOR, and MAKER of ALL THING, is not "BORN", but the flesh or the Body that he came in was. READ Luke 1:35 again. what was BORN is the son of God. I have said this before, and now again, the son of God came out of Mary, (the flesh body), the woman. the Son of man, (spirit), came from heaven.....

so READ your bible... ok, now the difference between the Son of God, and the son of Man.... ok.

PICJAG, 101G.
Bro, do you see correlation between these scriptures?

Gen 1:3 And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.

Apostle Paul interprets the above as:

4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

5 For we preach not ourselves, but Christ Jesus the Lord; and ourselves your servants for Jesus' sake.

6 For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.

Then in Col 1, Paul speaks of Christ the firstborn of all creation (old) and firstborn from the dead (new creation).

Do these scriptures teach about The Son of Man you are talking about?
 

101G

Well-known member
Bro, do you see correlation between these scriptures?

Gen 1:3 And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.

Apostle Paul interprets the above as:

4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

5 For we preach not ourselves, but Christ Jesus the Lord; and ourselves your servants for Jesus' sake.

6 For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.

Then in Col 1, Paul speaks of Christ the firstborn of all creation (old) and firstborn from the dead (new creation).

Do these scriptures teach about The Son of Man you are talking about?
thanks, here is the correlation for all to see, 1 Corinthians 1:24 "But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God." there is that "Son of Man".

6 For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.
as I been saying, the LIGHT in Genesi 1:3 is WISDOM, which is the LIGHT that shine or Light every man... John 1:4 "In him was life; and the life was the light of men." John 1:5 "And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not."

and that "LIGHT" is shining right now.

PICJAG, 101G.
 
Last edited:

johnny guitar

Well-known member
JG, JG, JG, are you reading your bible? the Son of God is the "BODY" yes, that flesh bone and blood, listen, Luke 1:35 "And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God."

well, well, well, the son of God is BORN. JG are you saying that God is "BORN?", I hope not....... see the Son of God is the flesh bone and the blood,..... the "BODY", the spirit that dwelt in that body is the Son of Man, read and understand Isaiah 9:6.

see God the CREATOR, and MAKER of ALL THING, is not "BORN", but the flesh or the Body that he came in was. READ Luke 1:35 again. what was BORN is the son of God. I have said this before, and now again, the son of God came out of Mary, (the flesh body), the woman. the Son of man, (spirit), came from heaven.....

so READ your bible... ok, now the difference between the Son of God, and the son of Man.... ok.

PICJAG, 101G.
Jesus Christ The MAN and The Son of God is born.
The MAN Jesus Christ came out of Mary.
The Son of God is Divine, The Son of Man is human.
Jesus is BOTH. The Son of God BECAME a Man. He did NOT enter INTO a Man.
 

101G

Well-known member
Jesus Christ The MAN and The Son of God is born.
The MAN Jesus Christ came out of Mary.
The Son of God is Divine, The Son of Man is human.
Jesus is BOTH. The Son of God BECAME a Man. He did NOT enter INTO a Man.
thanks for the reply JD,

JG, JG, JG, what is I'M going to do with you? you start off good, but is found in the ditch later. what is I'm going to do with you?. listen, the son of God is NOT, and I repete, is NOT Divine, but NATURAL, Flesh that was born and died, or returned to the dust of the Earth. the Son of Man is "DIVINE"... spirit. which came from above, NEVER BORN, and NEVER CEASE to exist. JG listen,

John 3:31 "He that cometh from above is above all: he that is of the earth is earthly, and speaketh of the earth: he that cometh from heaven is above all."
WHO IS THE HE THAT COMES FROM ABOVE? answer, John 3:13 "And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven." now JG, the Son of Man did not Come out of Mary. one more,

John 8:23 "And he said unto them, Ye are from beneath; I am from above: ye are of this world; I am not of this world." hello?

NOW, the son of God.
Luke 1:35 "And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God."

the son of God was Born, that came out of May's womb, a child, flesh, bone and blood, not the son, the Son of Man. listen to the bible.... Isaiah 9:6 "For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace."

did you see the transcation at the beginning of the verse, A child is BORN. FLESH, "therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God."

BORN, BORN, BORN, is the Flesh... the son of God, scripture don't lie.
now, "unto us a son is given:" the Son is NOT BORN, the Son is "GIVEN". must we break out the crayons?

and this Son, that came from HEAVEN/ABOVE is The mighty God, The everlasting Father and get this the "COMFORTER", yes the comforter the Holy Spirit. see that word, "Counsellor" there, do you know what that word is synonym with?
when used as a NOUN: "A person trained to give guidance on personal or psychological problems, a Guide, teacher",

scripture reference,
the Holy Ghost as "Guide", John 16:13 "Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come."

the Holy Ghost as "Teacher", John 14:26 "But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you."

for the Holy Ghost is a TEACHER, listen, 1 Corinthians 2:13 "Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual."


when used as a Noun: "A legal adviser or solicitor", an advocate, intercessor,

scripture reference,
the Holy Ghost as "Advocate", 1 John 2:1 "My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:"

NOW, is the "advocate" the Holy Spirit? lets see, it's the Greek Word,
G3875 παράκλητος parakletos (pa-ra'-klee-tos) n.
1. (properly) one called near (to give help).
2. an intercessor (one who entreats of behalf of another).
3. a comforter.

[(not given)]
KJV: advocate, comforter
Root(s): G3844, G2822

a "comforter", yes the HOLY SPIRIT. was it not the Holy Ghost the One who concieved the CHILD in Mary's womb? lets have a look see, Matthew 1:20 "But while he thought on these things, behold, the angel of the Lord appeared unto him in a dream, saying, Joseph, thou son of David, fear not to take unto thee Mary thy wife: for that which is conceived in her is of the Holy Ghost." well JESUS is the Holy Ghost, and anyone who conceives a child, is a "FATHER"..... (smile).

but also notice definition 2 an "intercessor" .... :eek: YIKES!... 101G, are you kidding, nope, nor am I pulling your leg... (smile)... lol. just get a dictionary and LOOK UP WORDS.

now the intercessor who is the advocate who is the comforter is the Holy Ghost., which bring us to the intercessor in scripture,
Romans 8:26 "Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered." BINGO, hello, are the Light bulbs coming on now?

lets make it VERY, VERY, VERY, clear. and we'll do it from the OT,
Isaiah 59:16 "And he saw that there was no man, and wondered that there was no intercessor: therefore his arm brought salvation unto him; and his righteousness, it sustained him."

there GOD is, the Ordinal Last, the "ARM" of God, the Son of Man, God shared in flesh, JESUS, the Christ. the ARM of God is God himself. well his ARM is not 101G's ARM, or JG's ARM.... or anyone's elase ..... (smile), lol, lol, lol.

understand JG, the ARM of God is GOD in Flesh. so that child, (which was BORN), that Son, (Which was "GIVEN"), from above/heaven, is God EQUALLY SHARED in Flesh as a man... Hello? are we connecting the dots yet.

yes that son, that Child, is called the "EVERLASTING" ... drum roll please .. "FATHER". Oh how simple. bible study, bible study, can be. but that's BIBLE STUDY ..... with the Holy Spirit is a MUST to understand the Word of God a.. properly, and b. RIGHTLY DIVIDE.

JG, we suggest you copy this post, and read it again for ptoper digestion, and edification.
all of your answer was in Isaiah 9:6, just take time to LEARN and UNDERSTAND by the Holy Spirit.

this is basic KNOWLEDGE right in fromt of your eyes in ... "PRINT".


PICJAG, 101G.
 

Anthony

Active member
thanks for the reply JD,

JG, JG, JG, what is I'M going to do with you? you start off good, but is found in the ditch later. what is I'm going to do with you?. listen, the son of God is NOT, and I repete, is NOT Divine, but NATURAL, Flesh that was born and died, or returned to the dust of the Earth. the Son of Man is "DIVINE"... spirit. which came from above, NEVER BORN, and NEVER CEASE to exist. JG listen,

John 3:31 "He that cometh from above is above all: he that is of the earth is earthly, and speaketh of the earth: he that cometh from heaven is above all."
WHO IS THE HE THAT COMES FROM ABOVE? answer, John 3:13 "And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven." now JG, the Son of Man did not Come out of Mary. one more,

John 8:23 "And he said unto them, Ye are from beneath; I am from above: ye are of this world; I am not of this world." hello?

NOW, the son of God.
Luke 1:35 "And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God."

the son of God was Born, that came out of May's womb, a child, flesh, bone and blood, not the son, the Son of Man. listen to the bible.... Isaiah 9:6 "For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace."

did you see the transcation at the beginning of the verse, A child is BORN. FLESH, "therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God."

BORN, BORN, BORN, is the Flesh... the son of God, scripture don't lie.
now, "unto us a son is given:" the Son is NOT BORN, the Son is "GIVEN". must we break out the crayons?

and this Son, that came from HEAVEN/ABOVE is The mighty God, The everlasting Father and get this the "COMFORTER", yes the comforter the Holy Spirit. see that word, "Counsellor" there, do you know what that word is synonym with?
when used as a NOUN: "A person trained to give guidance on personal or psychological problems, a Guide, teacher",

scripture reference,
the Holy Ghost as "Guide", John 16:13 "Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come."

the Holy Ghost as "Teacher", John 14:26 "But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you."

for the Holy Ghost is a TEACHER, listen, 1 Corinthians 2:13 "Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual."


when used as a Noun: "A legal adviser or solicitor", an advocate, intercessor,

scripture reference,
the Holy Ghost as "Advocate", 1 John 2:1 "My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:"

NOW, is the "advocate" the Holy Spirit? lets see, it's the Greek Word,
G3875 παράκλητος parakletos (pa-ra'-klee-tos) n.
1. (properly) one called near (to give help).
2. an intercessor (one who entreats of behalf of another).
3. a comforter.

[(not given)]
KJV: advocate, comforter
Root(s): G3844, G2822

a "comforter", yes the HOLY SPIRIT. was it not the Holy Ghost the One who concieved the CHILD in Mary's womb? lets have a look see, Matthew 1:20 "But while he thought on these things, behold, the angel of the Lord appeared unto him in a dream, saying, Joseph, thou son of David, fear not to take unto thee Mary thy wife: for that which is conceived in her is of the Holy Ghost." well JESUS is the Holy Ghost, and anyone who conceives a child, is a "FATHER"..... (smile).

but also notice definition 2 an "intercessor" .... :eek: YIKES!... 101G, are you kidding, nope, nor am I pulling your leg... (smile)... lol. just get a dictionary and LOOK UP WORDS.

now the intercessor who is the advocate who is the comforter is the Holy Ghost., which bring us to the intercessor in scripture,
Romans 8:26 "Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered." BINGO, hello, are the Light bulbs coming on now?

lets make it VERY, VERY, VERY, clear. and we'll do it from the OT,
Isaiah 59:16 "And he saw that there was no man, and wondered that there was no intercessor: therefore his arm brought salvation unto him; and his righteousness, it sustained him."

there GOD is, the Ordinal Last, the "ARM" of God, the Son of Man, God shared in flesh, JESUS, the Christ. the ARM of God is God himself. well his ARM is not 101G's ARM, or JG's ARM.... or anyone's elase ..... (smile), lol, lol, lol.

understand JG, the ARM of God is GOD in Flesh. so that child, (which was BORN), that Son, (Which was "GIVEN"), from above/heaven, is God EQUALLY SHARED in Flesh as a man... Hello? are we connecting the dots yet.

yes that son, that Child, is called the "EVERLASTING" ... drum roll please .. "FATHER". Oh how simple. bible study, bible study, can be. but that's BIBLE STUDY ..... with the Holy Spirit is a MUST to understand the Word of God a.. properly, and b. RIGHTLY DIVIDE.

JG, we suggest you copy this post, and read it again for ptoper digestion, and edification.
all of your answer was in Isaiah 9:6, just take time to LEARN and UNDERSTAND by the Holy Spirit.

this is basic KNOWLEDGE right in fromt of your eyes in ... "PRINT".


PICJAG, 101G.
Exod 15:3 3 The LORD is a man of war: the LORD is his name.

Isaiah 42:13 The LORD shall go forth as a mighty man, he shall stir up jealousy like a man of war: he shall cry, yea, roar; he shall prevail against his enemies.

Isaiah 9:6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

He is the same one Who spoke in OT as YHWH.
 

101G

Well-known member
Here is another "ECHAD" moment which destroys any Kenosis Heresy about God, and it is closly connected to Psalms 110:1, . Psalms 132:11 "The LORD hath sworn in truth unto David; he will not turn from it; Of the fruit of thy body will I set upon thy throne."

HOLD THE PRESS. the "LORD", all caps, is Spirit, right .... for God is a Spirit, per John 4:24a. well now, how is Almighty God is going to SIT on David throne when he made the whole universe and beyond?

but NOTICE who is going to be sitting on David throne..... the "LORD", Deuteronomy 6:4 "Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD:" but is not the Lord Jesus is given David throne? lets see, Luke 1:32 "He shall be great, and shall be called the Son of the Highest: and the Lord God shall give unto him the throne of his father David:" SAY WHAT? wait a second, 2 Samuel 7:12 "And when thy days be fulfilled, and thou shalt sleep with thy fathers, I will set up thy seed after thee, which shall proceed out of thy bowels, and I will establish his kingdom." 2 Samuel 7:13 "He shall build an house for my name, and I will stablish the throne of his kingdom for ever."

people, one have to be blind, and dishonest not to see this.

PICJAG, 101G.
 

aeg4971

Active member
Bunk, for what then is Peter speaking of in 1 Peter 1:20 "who truly was foreknown before the foundation of the world but was in these last days manifested for you"?

Or Paul's words in Romans 8:29, "for those whom he foreknew, them he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many (human) brethren".

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see in these verses that God was thinking of Jesus his human son as the first born among which many other human brethren were to be predestined to be conformed to the image of and which means that Jesus had to be the firstborn in God's mind and Logos also.

It was God's mind the Logos that was made flesh in Jesus Christ and not the actual being of God and which simply means that God's righteous character and thinking (his mind) was duplicated into his human Son from his own righteous mind or Logos.

You could even say, that God's law and which is the whole council of his word was made flesh in Jesus because he obeyed it completely and without sinning even once.

For God duplicated his Logos in his human Son Jesus and then required that Jesus keep what God instilled within him by His Spirit through perfect obedience and through the same temptations that all of us also are tempted with.

Mr humanism we all have in our possession the very same Holy Scriptures . We also know that as Aquinas says " We are hampered by the limitations of the human experience to adequately express verities of the divine ", Hence you can quote as many scriptures as you like, and still according to the Old Testament in concordance/ Union ; as in concurrent with the New Testament, we understand three things on account of Divine revelation ( ie God self revelation of Himself) ; or as the Trinitarian medieval Latin doctors assert," Subsisting Truth:"",

1. God is numerically ONE absolute ( Deu 6:4)

2. God does not by His very IMMUTABLE nature BIRTH (ie a creature ) otherness outside of Himself ( Ex 3:14/ Is (44:6). And on this account so as not to be repugnant to the SHEMA ;we understand the Apostle John to declare ;

3. God own substantial Word Himself- Form and Image (atemporally); ever proceeding by way of Similitude ( NOT DUPLICATION) subsisting numerically in the same nature (ie BOSOM OF THE) as has God the Father ; thereby temporally (when the fulness of time was come ;that holy thing born of the virgin) made passable ( Kenosis /Emptied ) ,as in made of no REPUTATION by taking upon Him the form of the sinful creature( ie a body hath thou prepared for the hypostasis or supposita of the Divine Wisdom Himself ) to become obedient unto to death to the glory of God the Father.


God the Father does not duplicate his Logos in his human Son ,but rather God gave to the Logos hypostasis in Himself. We know this because scriptures uses terms which signify conception and birth, begotten and generated. Sorry to burst your sundering semi Arian bubble, but the procession of the Logos in God is rightly called generation (not duplication) , and the Word Himself proceeding is properly called begotten and Son.




It follows in the mode


Adam was a son of God according to the gospels.
So Adam was a son of God by participation, the same as you and I according to the gospels, whereas the consubstantial Logos Himself proceeding is the Son of God by atemporal birth. having His subsistence numerically in the same nature as has God the Father.

Augustine says" ATEMPORAL Begotten/ Conceived Wisdom", Aquinas furthers this sentiment when he says" This infinite self communication in the procession of the one and only begotten Son is rightly called generation of the Word in God".

2. The same in the beginning with God.

3 .All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

4. In him was life; and the life was the light of men.

5. And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.

Tell me exactly how many sons of God can claim to be the substantial Word Himself proceeding having been made passable in the likeness of sinful flesh to become obedient unto death to the glory of God the Father?

42. Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me.

The Son is God in generation ,and temporally made flesh -God emptied. by taking upon Himself the form of a creature., being fashioned and now found as man. MAMA THERE GO THAT MAN.

Many of you love to assert the Son was a gloried man after His resurrection , when in divine reality He got up with all power (ie considering His equality and impassability) .

....... Alan
 

Roger Thornhill

Well-known member
Mr humanism we all have in our possession the very same Holy Scriptures . We also know that as Aquinas says " We are hampered by the limitations of the human experience to adequately express verities of the divine ", Hence you can quote as many scriptures as you like, and still according to the Old Testament in concordance/ Union ; as in concurrent with the New Testament, we understand three things on account of Divine revelation ( ie God self revelation of Himself) ; or as the Trinitarian medieval Latin doctors assert," Subsisting Truth:"",

1. God is numerically ONE absolute ( Deu 6:4)

2.
God does not by His very IMMUTABLE nature
BIRTH (ie a creature ) otherness outside of Himself ( Ex 3:14/ Is (44:6). And on this account so as not to be repugnant to the SHEMA ;we understand the Apostle John to declare ;

3. God own substantial Word Himself- Form and Image (atemporally); ever proceeding by way of Similitude ( NOT DUPLICATION) subsisting numerically in the same nature (ie BOSOM OF THE) as has God the Father ; thereby temporally (when the fulness of time was come ;that holy thing born of the virgin) made passable ( Kenosis /Emptied ) ,as in made of no REPUTATION by taking upon Him the form of the sinful creature( ie a body hath thou prepared for the hypostasis or supposita of the Divine Wisdom Himself ) to become obedient unto to death to the glory of God the Father.


God the Father does not duplicate his Logos in his human Son ,but rather God gave to the Logos hypostasis in Himself. We know this because scriptures uses terms which signify conception and birth, begotten and generated. Sorry to burst your sundering semi Arian bubble, but the procession of the Logos in God is rightly called generation (not duplication) , and the Word Himself proceeding is properly called begotten and Son.




It follows in the mode



So Adam was a son of God by participation, the same as you and I according to the gospels, whereas the consubstantial Logos Himself proceeding is the Son of God by atemporal birth. having His subsistence numerically in the same nature as has God the Father.

Augustine says" ATEMPORAL Begotten/ Conceived Wisdom", Aquinas furthers this sentiment when he says" This infinite self communication in the procession of the one and only begotten Son is rightly called generation of the Word in God".

2. The same in the beginning with God.

3 .All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

4. In him was life; and the life was the light of men.

5. And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.

Tell me exactly how many sons of God can claim to be the substantial Word Himself proceeding having been made passable in the likeness of sinful flesh to become obedient unto death to the glory of God the Father?

42. Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me.

The Son is God in generation ,and temporally made flesh -God emptied. by taking upon Himself the form of a creature., being fashioned and now found as man. MAMA THERE GO THAT MAN.

Many of you love to assert the Son was a gloried man after His resurrection , when in divine reality He got up with all power (ie considering His equality and impassability) .

....... Alan
Scripture never says anything about atemporality. You are basing your doctrine on rhetorical nonsense.
 

aeg4971

Active member
However, I wasn't only speaking of the new creation, but rather that God was looking ahead to Jesus for the redemption and restoration that would come through him, in order to create anything at all in the first creation.

For without the redemption and restoration that Christ would accomplish, God's creating anything in the first creation would have been vain and worthless.

Indeed, the only reason why God even allowed life to continue on this planet is because of the redemption and restoration that Jesus would accomplish through his perfect life and his death for sins and his resurrection and in order that those who will repent and believe from the first creation can be restored to God.

For instance, the only basis by which God could even accept sinners who repented and believed before Christ came was by his looking ahead to the future when Christ would come and die for their sins.

Otherwise God in his righteousness wouldn't have created any of it at all.

In other words, in his foreknowledge God saw Jesus in advance as crucified for the sins of the world in order that he might receive sinners by faith who came to him before Christ even came to die for them.

For the Bible is clear that without the shedding of blood there is no remission and that it is not possible for the blood of bulls and goats to take away sins and therefore they only served as a type and sign to the people that a true acceptable sacrifice for their sins would have to be made in the future by a perfect human being.

So God was only looking at those sacrifices as a vow of faith from the people so that he could receive them by his foreknowledge of Jesus coming to truly remove their sins through his own perfect blood sacrifice.

Also, their offering those sacrifices was for a sign unto them that it was necessary for a perfect blood sacrifice to be made for them in order for sins to be forgiven the people, other than that, those sacrifices did nothing to actually removed the sins of the people and the Bible is clear on that also.

Of course God was looking ahead to Jesus for redemption and restoration for Augustine says," Thy Today is Eternity, therefore didst thou begat the Co- eternal to whom didst thou saith this day have I begotten thee ".

Clearly your Monotheism teaches two beings in unity . One divine and one human , whereas we understand Unity to be numerical and thus only logically and relatively a distinction in the supposita of which it is spoken.


....... Alan
 
Top