NOT convention. See 1 Cor 11:3."But out of convention, Paul distinguished between the two"
NOT convention. See 1 Cor 11:3."But out of convention, Paul distinguished between the two"
Actually it is God who saves.A human person who has a human nature can save no one but himself. A divine person who has a human nature can save all those whom He has chosen to save. Because the divine person is infinite, the merit of His suffering according to His human nature can be applied to many people. The value of His sacrifice can extend to many because His person is not finite. Our salvation requires a divine person who suffered according to His human nature, not His divine nature.
NOT convention. See 1 Cor 11:3.
That’s false since nowhere in Scripture is God limited by your assumption.Actually it is God who saves.
A divine person cannot have a human nature by your doctrine (not mine I stress) as otherwise he wouldn't be God (God cannot change). You must invent a dependent human person which subsists alongside your divine person. As such your divine person is incapable of being a savior as he only exists in the divine nature, and your human person in likewise incapable of providing salvation as he is a product of philosophical discourse and not a human being of free will as subordinate to (controlled by) the divine.
You invalidate Heb 5:8,9 "Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered; And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;"
For you, the Son "wasn't made perfect" because he never lacked perfection.
God is the head of Christ. I'm sorry that this point is incomprehensible to a Trinitarian. Just one of those many, many problems. Also see John 14:28, Titus 2:13 and many other such verses.Huh?
1Cor. 11:3 But I want you to know that Christ is the head of every man, and the man is the head of a woman, and God is the head of Christ.
Would you like to explain what you think your point is, or do we have to guess?
Hardly an adequate answer.That’s false since nowhere in Scripture is God limited by your assumption.
Sure it is since God said in numerous places in the OT that He would come and dwell / live among men.Hardly an adequate answer.
God is the head of Christ. I'm sorry that this point is incomprehensible to a Trinitarian.
Just one of those many, many problems.
Also see John 14:28,
Titus 2:13 and many other such verses.
The word translated "perfect" in Hebrews 5:9 is τελειωθεις which means complete, accomplish.Actually it is God who saves.
A divine person cannot have a human nature by your doctrine (not mine I stress) as otherwise he wouldn't be God (God cannot change). You must invent a dependent human person which subsists alongside your divine person. As such your divine person is incapable of being a savior as he only exists in the divine nature, and your human person in likewise incapable of providing salvation as he is a product of philosophical discourse and not a human being of free will as subordinate to (controlled by) the divine.
You invalidate Heb 5:8,9 "Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered; And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;"
For you, the Son "wasn't made perfect" because he never lacked perfection.
Peter also also identifies Jesus as God and Savior.* * * Titus 2:13 as we wait for the happy fulfillment of our hope in the glorious appearing of our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ.
One of my favourite passages, where Paul identifies Jesus as "our great God and Savior".
Still ZERO "problems".
The tense is aorist passive.The word translated "perfect" in Hebrews 5:9 is τελειωθεις which means complete, accomplish.
Per Trinity Christ IS God so God cannot be his "head."Your condescension notwithstanding, every Trinitarian knows and accepts that "God is the head of Christ". What you've failed to explain is how that is the least bit at odds with the Trinity.
One shouldn't imagine that one's perception is "necessarily" the same as reality or truth. Many sinners are lost upon this fallacy.Well, so far we're at ZERO "problems".
How can God be greater than God?John 14:28 You heard me say to you, ‘I am going away and I am coming back to you.’ If you loved me, you would be glad that I am going to the Father, because the Father is greater than I am.
We still have ZERO "problems".
I get the feeling that you are quoting random verses now.
The problem here is in the scurrilous mistranslation of the Greek by Trinitarians. They have turned the genitive Greek noun "doxa" into an adjective to make the text say something it doesn't say.Titus 2:13 as we wait for the happy fulfillment of our hope in the glorious appearing of our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ.
One of my favourite passages, where Paul identifies Jesus as "our great God and Savior".
Still ZERO "problems".
Indeed, Our God and Savior, Jesus Christ saves.Actually it is God who saves.
A divine person cannot have a human nature by your doctrine (not mine I stress) as otherwise he wouldn't be God (God cannot change). You must invent a dependent human person which subsists alongside your divine person. As such your divine person is incapable of being a savior as he only exists in the divine nature, and your human person in likewise incapable of providing salvation as he is a product of philosophical discourse and not a human being of free will as subordinate to (controlled by) the divine.
You invalidate Heb 5:8,9 "Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered; And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;"
For you, the Son "wasn't made perfect" because he never lacked perfection.
Our Great God and Savior, Jesus Christ.Per Trinity Christ IS God so God cannot be his "head."
One shouldn't imagine that one's perception is "necessarily" the same as reality or truth. Many sinners are lost upon this fallacy.
How can God be greater than God?
The problem here is in the scurrilous mistranslation of the Greek by Trinitarians. They have turned the genitive Greek noun "doxa" into an adjective to make the text say something it doesn't say.
It should read "appearing of the glory of the great God and our saviour Jesus Christ" - which speaks of Christ being the glory of God.
This is one of the worst instances of "deliberate" Trinitarian mistranslation.
Perfect by His sufferings, which made Him the perfect sacrificial Lamb.The tense is aorist passive.
The tense in Heb 5:9 is thus the same as that in James 2:22 "by works was faith made perfect".
It is talking about Christ himself being made perfect or complete.
You're saying Christ wasn't a believer?Perfect by His sufferings, which made Him the perfect sacrificial Lamb.
Moral perfection is NOT in view in this passage.
James 2:22 is speaking of Christian believers, NOT Christ.
Per Trinity Christ IS God so God cannot be his "head."
One shouldn't imagine that one's perception is "necessarily" the same as reality or truth. Many sinners are lost upon this fallacy.
How can God be greater than God?
The problem here is in the scurrilous mistranslation of the Greek by Trinitarians. They have turned the genitive Greek noun "doxa" into an adjective to make the text say something it doesn't say.
It should read "appearing of the glory of the great God and our saviour Jesus Christ" - which speaks of Christ being the glory of God.
This is one of the worst instances of "deliberate" Trinitarian mistranslation.
Since when does role or rank play a part in ones nature ?Per Trinity Christ IS God so God cannot be his "head."
One shouldn't imagine that one's perception is "necessarily" the same as reality or truth. Many sinners are lost upon this fallacy.
How can God be greater than God?
The problem here is in the scurrilous mistranslation of the Greek by Trinitarians. They have turned the genitive Greek noun "doxa" into an adjective to make the text say something it doesn't say.
It should read "appearing of the glory of the great God and our saviour Jesus Christ" - which speaks of Christ being the glory of God.
This is one of the worst instances of "deliberate" Trinitarian mistranslation.
No, you're just talking nonsense. God is not "a state of being." It is identified with a personal pronoun and / or with the Father throughout the bible.You are confusing "being" with "person".
"God" is His "being". "Son" is His "person".
Christ is God, and the Father is His head.
This is why you should try to be more humble in your approach, and stop trying to be a holier-than-thou know-it-all.
Do you understand?
He didn't say the Father's role was greater than himself. He said the Father was greater than himself.Yes... YOU of all people should be VERY concerned about this very thing, instead of presuming to judge others. Lose the attitude.
The Father can have a role which is greater than the Son's.
I don't think we need to be fluent in Koine Greek to distinguish a noun from an adjective. We just look it up in the interlinear.Well, first off, are you fluent in Koine Greek? I don't believe you are.
Are you telling me the translators weren't Trinitarians?Secondly, this is not a "Trinitarian" "mistranslation"
I didn't say "glory of the appearing." I said "appearing of the glory."Secondly, there's no significant difference between "the glory of the appearing" and "the glorious appearing", regarding meaning, so I think you're grasping at straws here.
Please stop talking nonsense and apply your injunction to be humble to yourself FIRST.Third, it's Christ who will be appearing, not the Father.
And finally, it is clear from the Greek that the entire phrase, "our great God and Savior", is referring to Christ, in exactly the same way that "our Lord and Savior" in 2 Pet. 1:11 is referring to Christ.
It's not "Trinitarian bias" which is showing that, but your anti-Trinitarian bias which is denying the obvious. Now we can discuss this in more detail if you'd like, but I'd appreciate it if you lost the superior attitude.
I'm sorry, but I don't recognize your "ability" to read Greek, especially when it goes against EVERY modern translation. Again, the phrase "our great God and Savior" refers to ONE person, that is, Christ.
Oh, wow... "Deliberate"? So now you're pretending to be a mind-reader? I guess the virtue of "charity" is absent from your vocabulary.
When did I infer it?Since when does role or rank play a part in ones nature ?
?Does a woman is submission to her husband make her any less human ?
I wasn't aware God had a rank. But you're right in one sense. In Jn 1:1b it is said "The Word was with God" not "the Father was with God." Have you figured out why?Are you any less human than the CEO, CFO. COO of your company because they have a higher rank over you ?