Law of Proper Alignment

Neo

Member
The Law of Proper Alignment states that if there is a proper alignment for something or some being, then this something or some being has a designer.

Some examples of proper alignment are putting batteries into a controller. If the + is connected to the positive charge of the battery and the - is connected to the negative charge of the battery, then the controller will function properly. If the charges do not match up, then the controller will not function properly. If the batteries are not placed in the proper slots in the controller, but are laying beside the controller, then the controller will not function properly. Etc.

Another example is there is a proper alignment for a serpentine belt in a car. The belt needs to wrap around the alternator, power steering pump, tensioner, etc in order for the car to function properly. If you ever tried to change a serpentine belt, you know there is a specific/proper alignment for the belt.

Anyway, if one were to randomly throw the serpentine belt at the engine for billions or trillions of years, the belt would never randomly be attached in the proper alignment if the tensioner is in the tight position and not in a position where the belt can slide on.

In order for the belt to be placed in the proper alignment, the tensioner needs to be loose and it needs to be threaded through in the proper alignment for the car to function. This was designed by engineers.

Now to bring this to the evolution and intelligent design discussion, we need to see of there is a part of the human body that has to be in proper alignment or not. If there is, then evolution is 100% refuted based upon the Law of Proper Alignment. If there is not a part of the human body that needs to be in proper alignment, then evolution can continue to be a theory.

In fact there is a part of the body that needs to be in proper alignment for the body to function to it's fullest potential. This is the spine. Any Chiropractor will explain this to be true. Here is why:

Let's use the C1 (Cervical Spine 1). If this part of the spine is not in proper alignment, then the consequences or negative symptoms within the body are headaches, migraines, insomnia, high blood pressure, head colds, amnesia, chronic tiredness, dizziness, etc.

This is just C1. If we discuss C2, C3, C4, etc there are different negative symptoms when not in proper alignment. The same goes for T1, T2, T3, etc. The same goes for L1, L2, L3, etc.

All Doctors of Chiropractic know there is a proper alignment for the spine. When in proper alignment, the nerves attached to the spine are able to send strong signals to the corresponding organs so the organs can function at their highest potential.

When the spine is out of alignment, then the nerves get slightly or extremely cut off. When this happens, the organs do not function at their highest potential.

Anyway, since there is a proper alignment for the spine, this is 100% evidence that the spine within the human body is designed by an intelligence.

For, if there is a proper alignment for something or some being, then this something or some being is designed by an intelligence.
 

rossum

Well-known member
The Law of Proper Alignment states that if there is a proper alignment for something or some being, then this something or some being has a designer.
All hail the great Designer Mag-Net-Ism, whose name shall align for ever more. Let us praise the great one who aligns iron filings properly and who makes the lodestone align to the north.

You need a great deal more than personal opinion to show that such a 'law' is valid.

The human spine is a particularly bad example, since it evolved while our ancestors walked on four legs and is more suited to a horizontal position than our current vertical position.

A millipede or a snake would be better examples, a lot more alignment than the human spine.
 

Mr Laurier

Well-known member
The Law of Proper Alignment states that if there is a proper alignment for something or some being, then this something or some being has a designer.

Some examples of proper alignment are putting batteries into a controller. If the + is connected to the positive charge of the battery and the - is connected to the negative charge of the battery, then the controller will function properly. If the charges do not match up, then the controller will not function properly. If the batteries are not placed in the proper slots in the controller, but are laying beside the controller, then the controller will not function properly. Etc.

Another example is there is a proper alignment for a serpentine belt in a car. The belt needs to wrap around the alternator, power steering pump, tensioner, etc in order for the car to function properly. If you ever tried to change a serpentine belt, you know there is a specific/proper alignment for the belt.

Anyway, if one were to randomly throw the serpentine belt at the engine for billions or trillions of years, the belt would never randomly be attached in the proper alignment if the tensioner is in the tight position and not in a position where the belt can slide on.

In order for the belt to be placed in the proper alignment, the tensioner needs to be loose and it needs to be threaded through in the proper alignment for the car to function. This was designed by engineers.

Now to bring this to the evolution and intelligent design discussion, we need to see of there is a part of the human body that has to be in proper alignment or not. If there is, then evolution is 100% refuted based upon the Law of Proper Alignment. If there is not a part of the human body that needs to be in proper alignment, then evolution can continue to be a theory.

In fact there is a part of the body that needs to be in proper alignment for the body to function to it's fullest potential. This is the spine. Any Chiropractor will explain this to be true. Here is why:

Let's use the C1 (Cervical Spine 1). If this part of the spine is not in proper alignment, then the consequences or negative symptoms within the body are headaches, migraines, insomnia, high blood pressure, head colds, amnesia, chronic tiredness, dizziness, etc.

This is just C1. If we discuss C2, C3, C4, etc there are different negative symptoms when not in proper alignment. The same goes for T1, T2, T3, etc. The same goes for L1, L2, L3, etc.

All Doctors of Chiropractic know there is a proper alignment for the spine. When in proper alignment, the nerves attached to the spine are able to send strong signals to the corresponding organs so the organs can function at their highest potential.

When the spine is out of alignment, then the nerves get slightly or extremely cut off. When this happens, the organs do not function at their highest potential.

Anyway, since there is a proper alignment for the spine, this is 100% evidence that the spine within the human body is designed by an intelligence.

For, if there is a proper alignment for something or some being, then this something or some being is designed by an intelligence.
If the human spine was designed by an intelligence, that intelligence was insane and cruel.
You also characterize evolution is being entirely random. While mutation is random, the selection process in anything but.
 
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Neo

Member
All hail the great Designer Mag-Net-Ism, whose name shall align for ever more. Let us praise the great one who aligns iron filings properly and who makes the lodestone align to the north.

You need a great deal more than personal opinion to show that such a 'law' is valid.

The human spine is a particularly bad example, since it evolved while our ancestors walked on four legs and is more suited to a horizontal position than our current vertical position.

A millipede or a snake would be better examples, a lot more alignment than the human spine.
If the Law of Proper Alignment does not exist, then provide an example where something has to be in a specific/proper alignment that does not arise from a designer/intelligence.
 

Neo

Member
If the human spine was designed by an intelligence, that intelligence was insane and cruel.
You also characterize evolution is being entirely random. While mutation is random, the selection process in anything but.
Are you saying natural selection is not a random process, but uses intelligence to select?
 

Neo

Member
If the human spine was designed by an intelligence, that intelligence was insane and cruel.
You also characterize evolution is being entirely random. While mutation is random, the selection process in anything but.
Why is the design of the spine cruel? Back pain arises when certain parts of the spine are misaligned, such as when any or all T1-T12 are in misalignment.

It is a great design to have pain receptors to let one know when the spine is in misalignment in order that one does not further hurt oneself.

Have you studied much of the medical science of Chiropractic?
 

Mr Laurier

Well-known member
Why is the design of the spine cruel? Back pain arises when certain parts of the spine are misaligned, such as when any or all T1-T12 are in misalignment.

It is a great design to have pain receptors to let one know when the spine is in misalignment in order that one does not further hurt oneself.

Have you studied much of the medical science of Chiropractic?
The human spine is prone to failure. Only a sadist would deliberately design it the way it is.

And a poor design to have a structure that fails regularly. Even worse, the human spine works best is we hold it horizontally. Our upright posture places too much stress on the spine.

Not a lot. But I know poor design when I see it.
The human spine is a poorly adapted primate spine.
 

Neo

Member
The human spine is prone to failure. Only a sadist would deliberately design it the way it is.

And a poor design to have a structure that fails regularly. Even worse, the human spine works best is we hold it horizontally. Our upright posture places too much stress on the spine.

Not a lot. But I know poor design when I see it.
The human spine is a poorly adapted primate spine.
No, you are incorrect. There are discs between the vertebrae. These provide cushions between the vertebrae. When one becomes overweight or over uses the spine and does not keep the spine in proper alignment, this is when disc degeneration, pain, organs not functioning to the highest potential, etc. occur.

If one lays in a horizontal position for long periods of time, then the muscles surrounding the spine become weak and the proper curve within the spine slowly disappears. When the proper curves, seen from the lateral position on X-rays, start to become strait rather than curved, then disc degeneration, pain, etc occur until the proper curves are restored.

Humans are designed to walk upright, not be in a horizontal position.

I highly recommend you study the medical science of Chiropractic.
 

Mr Laurier

Well-known member
No, you are incorrect. There are discs between the vertebrae. These provide cushions between the vertebrae. When one becomes overweight or over uses the spine and does not keep the spine in proper alignment, this is when disc degeneration, pain, organs not functioning to the highest potential, etc. occur.

If one lays in a horizontal position for long periods of time, then the muscles surrounding the spine become weak and the proper curve within the spine slowly disappears. When the proper curves, seen from the lateral position on X-rays, start to become strait rather than curved, then disc degeneration, pain, etc occur until the proper curves are restored.

Humans are designed to walk upright, not be in a horizontal position.

I highly recommend you study the medical science of Chiropractic.
So I am in fact correct. Thankyou

And? Water is wet. You are not telling me anything I did not already know.

No. Humans EVOLVED to walk upright, despite a spine that, had it been designed, would be better suited for walking on all fours.
A kludge. A poor adaptation that barely works. But which make perfect sense if we accept that humans evolved from ancestors who walked on all fours.

I don't have 4 years to spend in college. Lets not demand the absurd.
 

Neo

Member
The alignment of sodium and chloride ions in a salt crystal. They are ordered from precisely, alternating sodium-chloride-sodium-chloride-

Image here if it helps:
Exactly. If they are not properly ordered/aligned, then it will not be salt crystals. Proper orders of things indicates there was a designer, not a random process. In all observed cases, having a proper order of things indicates an intelligence created such an order.

Thus, we can conclude salt crystals are created by a designer.
 

Neo

Member
So I am in fact correct. Thankyou

And? Water is wet. You are not telling me anything I did not already know.

No. Humans EVOLVED to walk upright, despite a spine that, had it been designed, would be better suited for walking on all fours.
A kludge. A poor adaptation that barely works. But which make perfect sense if we accept that humans evolved from ancestors who walked on all fours.

I don't have 4 years to spend in college. Lets not demand the absurd.
No, the design of the spine is designed to walk upright. If evolution disagrees with the medical science of Chiropractic, that's unfortunate for evolution.

There is merit to intelligent design science, but I agree there are limitations to it. The spine and the body having the ability to deteriorate seems like a bad design. However, from the perspective of Creation science, combined with the medical science of Chiropractic we know the spine is intelligently designed as well as designed to eventually die.

This is due to the fall of Adam and Eve. The wages of sin is death.

When examining the medical science of Chiropractic, the only scientific model that fits all the evidence is creation science.

Intelligent design science fails because the spine can get disc degeneration, etc.

Evolution science fails because the medical science of Chiropractic states we are meant to walk upright, not to be slouched over, or lay horizontal for long periods of time.

Only Creation science lines up with the medical science of Chiropractic.
 

Whateverman

Well-known member
Exactly. If they are not properly ordered/aligned, then it will not be salt crystals. Proper orders of things indicates there was a designer
So, when you asked for "an example where something has to be in a specific/proper alignment that does not arise from a designer/intelligence", you were going to assume that such things prove design?

Why ask for an example of something that doesn't require design, and then assume that it does? Seems a bit dishonest.
 

rossum

Well-known member
If the Law of Proper Alignment does not exist, then provide an example where something has to be in a specific/proper alignment that does not arise from a designer/intelligence.
The Law of Proper Alignment may or may not exist. Currently there is insufficient scientific evidence to support such a law.

If you want an example, then varves on a lake bed, which are aligned vertically by the seasons and gravity. Are you trying to say that gravity is a designer?

Are you saying natural selection is not a random process, but uses intelligence to select?
Natural selection is certainly not a random process. Nor does it use intelligence to select. It acts somewhat like a sieve, only certain size grains will pass the selection in a sieve, and a sieve does not need intelligence.

Natural selection sorts on the number of grandchildren rather than size of sand grain, but no intelligence is required. If you have more grandchildren then there are more copies of your genes in future generations.

You are using a false dichotomy here.
 

Neo

Member
So, when you asked for "an example where something has to be in a specific/proper alignment that does not arise from a designer/intelligence", you were going to assume that such things prove design?

Why ask for an example of something that doesn't require design, and then assume that it does? Seems a bit dishonest.
So, you agree salt crystals have to be properly arranged, right?
 

Neo

Member
The Law of Proper Alignment may or may not exist. Currently there is insufficient scientific evidence to support such a law.

If you want an example, then varves on a lake bed, which are aligned vertically by the seasons and gravity. Are you trying to say that gravity is a designer?


Natural selection is certainly not a random process. Nor does it use intelligence to select. It acts somewhat like a sieve, only certain size grains will pass the selection in a sieve, and a sieve does not need intelligence.

Natural selection sorts on the number of grandchildren rather than size of sand grain, but no intelligence is required. If you have more grandchildren then there are more copies of your genes in future generations.

You are using a false dichotomy here.
A sieve is designed for a purpose.
 

Neo

Member
Wrong. In a solution with randomly placed molecules, those that happen to be correctly aligned will crystallise.
Yes, they have to be properly aligned to crystalize. If they do not properly align, then they do not crystallize.
 
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