Those 'in Him' from the foundation of the world are those that believe.
we are from the foundation of the world.
Lazarus ....!
- Thread starter Howie
- Start date
Those 'in Him' from the foundation of the world are those that believe.
we are from the foundation of the world.
ReverendRV
Well-known member
I Square it by being a Sola Scripturist. I use All Scripture to come to the knowledge of the Truth. We are Elect not by Works unless we boast. Yes, we are Saved because we Believe; but we aren't Elect according to our Will...
Let's you and I start talking about Categories. Are Election and Justification two Categories or just one Category? This can be all solved if we ask the right questions. If we ask the wrong questions, nothing will ever be solved...
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American Gothic
Well-known member
are we Elect against our will?
ReverendRV
Well-known member
Human action is clearly indicated and demanded in Eph 1:4 when we are told to "be holy and without blame before Him in Love":
(Eph 1:4) according as He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before Him in love,
How can one satisfy that requirement without being a Christian who believes "in Christ"?
Christian
Well-known member
Yes
Christian
Well-known member
They cannot
The Ephesians were told that they "were without Christ" and they are "now in Christ Jesus". If they were always chosen "in Him" from before the foundation of the world (Eph 1:4) then at what point were they found to be "without Christ"? Didn't you previously tell me that "we are kept by the power of God. How much more sure can you get?"?
(Eph 2:11) Therefore remember that you, the nations, in time past were in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands;
(Eph 2:12) and that at that time you were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world.
(Eph 2:13) But now in Christ Jesus you who were once afar off are made near by the blood of Christ.
Christian
Well-known member
One is without Christ until they become saved . One is not saved prior to faith in Christ.
We are elected "in Him" when we believe "in Him" (Eph 1:4). Therefore, all elect are believers by definition. And to become a believer we make use of our heart, conscience, will, etc... So it can be said that election is according to one's will. That's why election is very much conditional on our willingness to be diligent:
(2 Pet 1:10) Therefore, brothers, rather be diligent to make your calling and election sure, for if you do these things, you shall never fall.
We can discuss Election and Justification although they do overlap significantly mostly in regard to preordained good works.
Excellent! How is it that you picked up so quickly on how critical our faith "in Christ" is and Calvinists are left way behind? We don't denigrate God when we say that. All glory goes to God. What is the mental block that impedes Calvinists from understanding these facts?
Christian
Well-known member
The Bible as we cannot be in Christ before we believe .
The saved were predestined before the foundation of the world.
Yet we were predestined IN CHRIST before the foundation of the world.
We are holy and without blame because of HIS action, not ours.
Christian
Well-known member
Yet you did not exist to be in Christ .
Please forward Bible verse that says that without conflating election and predestination.
Never mind.
How many times have I told you that. You have selective hearing and a novel theology.
Theological novelty. ^^