Leaving the Roman Catholic Church

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You do not know what capabilities the saints in heaven have.

The same as they had on earth, except eternal life. That does not equate omniscience.
“That eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither hath it entered into the heart of man, what things God hath prepared for them that love him." 1 Cor 2:9
This says zero about making the dead in Christ omniscient, so they can hear all of the Catholics on earth praying to them for help, salvation, refuge.

Your church bases this teaching on something that "coulda, mighta" happen--without a hint of Biblical evidence.
 
And THIS has to do with love and devotion to the saints HOW?

You think I love the saints and am devoted to them-----because-----I am anxious, or otherwise think I cannot approach the Thone of Grace with my prayers and supplications, do you? Is that what you think?

If so, you would be WRONG.
 
Perhaps romish, your own personal history of your life within the Roman Catholic religion was a strong force for good. Or, the Roman Catholic religion could have got in your way, keeping you from living fullest life possible in Christ Jesus in the present. But ultimately it depends entirely upon who or what you decide to choose now . . . . . will it be the Person of Jesus Christ, or a spurious man-made institution, namely the Roman Catholic Church?
 
Well one thing for sure the branch is not the RCC because the vine produces good fruit and maybe that is because of all its false teachings.
Yes, this is true! Without the branch, the vine can also do nothing. A vine without branches can bear no fruit. No less indispensable than the vine to the branch is branch to the vine. Such is the wonderful condescension of the grace of Jesus; just as His people are dependent on Him, He has made himself dependent on them. Without His discipes He cannot dispense His blessing to the world. It seems incredible, but it's true!
I don't understand:

Why does abiding fellowship in Christ rule out devotion to the saints and Mary? Why would the fact that we abide in Christ mean---we have absolutely nothing to do with Mary and the saints? Why does abiding fellowship in Christ mean we cannot love the saints and express that love in the form of devotion?

Put simply: why do you drive a wedge between Christ and the saints? Why do you divorce Christ from the saints? Why do you not see a connection between Christ and the saints? Why do you paint Christian living, and Christian love as zero sum and one dimensional?

Note: in 20 years here at CARM I have yet to get a substantive answer to this question.
You don't "understand" because of the indoctrinations that you have been methodically taught. The RCC doesn't want you to understand that this is God's own doing, giving such high honor to those on earth whom He has called His redeemed ones. God has designed it so that as indispensable as He is to them in acquiring fruit and winning heaven, in fact they are so indispensable to Him on earth, that through them His fruit may be found. Romish, try if you will, to meditate on this until your soul bows to worship in the presence of the mystery of the perfect union between Jesus Christ and the believer alone.
 
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Do you not get it?

I am not arguing with Jesus words about "abiding in Me." I have no dispute with that. I agree, I believe it.

What I do not understand, and what you are not explaining is what "Abide in Me" has to do with devotion to the saints and Mary. Why is devotion to the saints in Mary opposed to the statement "Abide in Me?" When did I suggest that we should abide in the saints and Mary?
Do you ever feel that If you as a Roman Catholic can begin to see the deep meaning of the truth that Jesus Christ was made to us righteousness, that it is hardly necessary then to say that you need also to have personal devotion to the "saints in Mary." You don't even need to "suggest" that "we should abide in the saints and Mary," it just oozes out of you.
 
Do you ever feel that If you as a Roman Catholic can begin to see the deep meaning of the truth that Jesus Christ was made to us righteousness, that it is hardly necessary then to say that you need also to have personal devotion to the "saints in Mary." You don't even need to "suggest" that "we should abide in the saints and Mary," it just oozes out of you.
John 15:4

4 Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit by itself, unless it abides in the vine, neither can you, unless you abide in me.

I cannot see how an RC can get Mary and the saints in that verse. I expanded the context and it is all about Jesus.

John 15:1+

I am the true vine, and my Father is the vinedresser. 2 Every branch in me that does not bear fruit he takes away, and every branch that does bear fruit he prunes, that it may bear more fruit. 3 Already you are clean because of the word that I have spoken to you. 4 Abide in me, and I in you.

John 15:7+

7 If you abide in me, and my words abide in you, ask whatever you wish, and it will be done for you. 8 By this my Father is glorified, that you bear much fruit and so prove to be my disciples. 9 As the Father has loved me, so have I loved you. Abide in my love. 10 If you keep my commandments, you will abide in my love, just as I have kept my Father's commandments and abide in his love. 11 These things I have spoken to you, that my joy may be in you, and that your joy may be full.
 
The same as they had on earth, except eternal life. That does not equate omniscience.

This says zero about making the dead in Christ omniscient, so they can hear all of the Catholics on earth praying to them for help, salvation, refuge.

Your church bases this teaching on something that "coulda, mighta" happen--without a hint of Biblical evidence.
Scripture verse please. That we will be largely UNCHANGED in heaven is a dismal thought that makes me glad I'm not Protestant. I guess glorified bodies have been overhyped, huh?
 
When a baptized and indoctrinated Roman Catholic person decides to leave the Roman Catholic Church, do they lose all of the 'blessings' they supposedly had gained as a member of the Roman Catholic Church?

What happens? Considering that Outside the Church there is no Salvation, its not going to be anything good.

JoeT
 
What happens? Considering that Outside the Church there is no Salvation, its not going to be anything good.

JoeT
Show us where the Bible says that there is no salvation outside of the Roman Catholic Church....

Instead, your supposed first pope, Peter, said in Acts 4, of Jesus Christ "There is no other name under heaven given among men, by which we MUST be saved."

He was talking about Jesus Christ--not the Roman Catholic Church. There is no salvation outside of HIM. But there certainly is outside of YOUR church! Those who are in Christ Jesus by grace through faith in Him have salvation, great and free.
 
Do you not get it?

Yes--but YOU don't.
I am not arguing with Jesus words about "abiding in Me." I have no dispute with that. I agree, I believe it.

Do you?
What I do not understand, and what you are not explaining is what "Abide in Me" has to do with devotion to the saints and Mary. Why is devotion to the saints in Mary opposed to the statement "Abide in Me?" When did I suggest that we should abide in the saints and Mary?
Because Jesus said to abide in HIM, NOT in Mary or Peter or Paul or St. Catherine of Siena, or St. Ignatius, or any other RC saint. Catholic devotions to saints in the RCC--as JPII was to Mary--means that Catholics are "abiding" in them, and taking their eyes off Jesus Christ. I mean, look at the garbage diLiguori spews in his wretched book The Glories of Mary!
 
Yep you are right once again you ignore what the poster was posting. Answered what you wanted her to say. You are right only because you answer you own question. You batted nothing out of the ball park, and it make that comment is not being humble at all. It was not a strange question either.
So wisely and perfectly said balshan!

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And THIS has to do with love and devotion to the saints HOW?

You think I love the saints and am devoted to them-----because-----I am anxious, or otherwise think I cannot approach the Thone of Grace with my prayers and supplications, do you? Is that what you think?

If so, you would be WRONG.
Somehow I don't perceive your love and devotion to me or to others redeemed by the Blood of the Lamb. Maybe you're using a coded vernacular I'm not familiar with.
 
Show us where the Bible says that there is no salvation outside of the Roman Catholic Church....

It is always hilarious as Catholics insist on this, but in the same breath they proudly proclaim that pagans, Muslims, Buddhists, Hindus, Wiccans, and atheists can all be saved apart from repentance and faith in Jesus Christ.

It seems the only ones Catholics struggle with being saved are Christ followers who put all their faith in the Savior.

I wonder where they got that from...
 
It is always hilarious as Catholics insist on this, but in the same breath they proudly proclaim that pagans, Muslims, Buddhists, Hindus, Wiccans, and atheists can all be saved apart from repentance and faith in Jesus Christ.

It seems the only ones Catholics struggle with being saved are Christ followers who put all their faith in the Savior.

I wonder where they got that from...
They have a worse problem with ex RCs, we make them see red, because we have had our eyes and ears opened and know the truth. Jesus pulled us out of the RCC and revealed His truth and their lies. We now know He is our saviour and our mediator. The dislike non RCs believers for knowing Jesus.
 
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