Look for God in the ONLY way and place that He can known to occur to you.

Whateverman

Well-known member
You are pretending that the truth and reality can be known to exist and occur outside of a believing mind, when it is ONLY a believing mind that can even know of its existence and occurrence to begin with.
Your POV is unbiblical and unChristian. This is why you stick to the Secular forums: the Christians here are having none of it.
 

Tercon

Well-known member
Your POV is unbiblical and unChristian.

False and illogical. God uses belief to make His truth and reality known to believers only. That's why you don't know God, because your unbelief can't make the truth and reality known to you.

481 times Belief, Believe and Faith is mentioned in the Bible. They are mentioned so many times because this is the way and mode by which God makes His truth and reality known to anyone who wants to know IT.

This is why you stick to the Secular forums: the Christians here are having none of it.

More lies. Here a few live threads I have in the Christians Forums right now.

What do followers of Arminianism & Calvinism think about Logical Truths & Arguments?

What do people of the Arminian & Calvinist persuasion think the Bible's intent and context is?

Where does God's truth and reality reside?
 

Whatsisface

Well-known member
False and illogical. God uses belief to make His truth and reality known to believers only. That's why you don't know God, because your unbelief can't make the truth and reality known to you.

481 times Belief, Believe and Faith is mentioned in the Bible. They are mentioned so many times because this is the way and mode by which God makes His truth and reality known to anyone who wants to know IT.



More lies.
Here a few live threads I have in the Christians Forums right now.

What do followers of Arminianism & Calvinism think about Logical Truths & Arguments?

What do people of the Arminian & Calvinist persuasion think the Bible's intent and context is?

Where does God's truth and reality reside?
I had a look at the first thread, the Christians are objecting to what you're saying as much as the atheists. Whateverman was right.
 

Tercon

Well-known member
Right, all the Christians here don't know God because they disagree with you.

Strawman. Everyone who knows God believes that their belief and faith originated in and with God. And if they don't, then they don't know God and are just pretenders. Or as they are called in the Bible "false prophets" and "wolves".

QM even entails the necessity of a Believing Mind in order for WFC and entanglement to occur.

And if nothing can be known to exist or occur outside or without a believing mind, then everything that exists and occurs must be the result of a Believing Mind.
 

Whatsisface

Well-known member
Strawman. Everyone who knows God believes that their belief and faith originated in and with God. And if they don't, then they don't know God and are just pretenders. Or as they are called in the Bible "false prophets" and "wolves".

QM even entails the necessity of a Believing Mind in order for WFC and entanglement to occur.

And if nothing can be known to exist or occur outside or without a believing mind, then everything that exists and occurs must be the result of a Believing Mind.
QM does not require a believing mind.
 

Tercon

Well-known member
QM does not require a believing mind.

Sure it does. And no-one including you as shown otherwise.

All QM models entail and require a believing mind in to observe and measure.
So, a believing mind gives WFC and entanglement a way and place to occur. And quite frankly a believing mind is the ONLY way and place WFC and entanglement can be known to occur.

Now, if you know of another way or place outside of a believing mind that WFC and entanglement can be known to occur, then say what that other way and place is. And if you don't know, then don't pretend you do.

And the truth is that logically a believing mind works just fine in and for QM, so I see no need of another way or place, when a believing mind is capable of making the truth and reality known to everyone.
 

bigthinker

Well-known member
Evasion. If it isn't truthful or illogical, then you shouldn't have any problem telling me how and why it is false or illogical?
I have no problem telling you (again and again). Eventually I get tired because you lack ears to hear.
False:
because there is only one reason that unbelievers don't know God

False AND illogical:
Since outside of a believing mind nothing can be known to occur or exist.
 

Tercon

Well-known member
I have no problem telling you (again and again). Eventually I get tired because you lack ears to hear.
False:


False AND illogical:

Okay. Name one other way or place outside of a believing mind that can embody the truth and make it known to you at the same time?
 

Tiburon

Well-known member
Sure it does. And no-one including you as shown otherwise.

All QM models entail and require a believing mind in to observe and measure.
So, a believing mind gives WFC and entanglement a way and place to occur. And quite frankly a believing mind is the ONLY way and place WFC and entanglement can be known to occur.

Now, if you know of another way or place outside of a believing mind that WFC and entanglement can be known to occur, then say what that other way and place is. And if you don't know, then don't pretend you do.

And the truth is that logically a believing mind works just fine in and for QM, so I see no need of another way or place, when a believing mind is capable of making the truth and reality known to everyone.
According to you there is already a believing mind that gives WFC and entanglement a way and place to occur. God's. So why would our believing minds have any effect?
 

Tercon

Well-known member
According to you there is already a believing mind that gives WFC and entanglement a way and place to occur. God's.

Strawman. No, that's according to the truth and reality. According to the truth and reality the only way and place anything can be known to exist and occur is in and with a believing mind. And outside of a believing mind nothing is able to be known to exist or occur.

So why would our believing minds have any effect?

If we believe and trust the truth and reality we get to know and participate in and with it like a close relationship, like a Father and child relationship. But if we disbelieve the truth and reality and don't know nor participate in and with it, you start working against it, rather than with it. And then the truth and reality becomes a dangerous place to be, because unbelievers still fall under its consequences, AKA its wrath. The truth and reality becomes your enemy instead of your friend and ally. It destroys rather than helps you, not because of anything it does to you intentionally, but because you oppose it and make it your enemy. And all because you refuse to believe it.

So, the truth and reality originated and is the result of a Believing Mind. But the Original Believing Mind is God's, Good old Dad is in the driver seat and us believers are just along for the ride, for now anyway.
 

Nouveau

Well-known member
So, you believe "'object permanence" can exist and occur outside of your believing mind?
No, object permanence is the means by which I know that things can occur and exist without being dependent upon any mind. Have you bothered to learn what object permanence is yet?
 

Tercon

Well-known member
No, object permanence is the means by which I know that things can occur and exist without being dependent upon any mind. Have you bothered to learn what object permanence is yet?
So, the thing ("object permanence") that makes reality known to you can be known to "occur and exist without being dependent upon any mind". But at the same time that thing ("object permanence") that you say makes the truth and reality known to you can't be known to exist nor occur without a believing mind to make it known to occur and give it its existence? Quite illogical and false.

Your "object permanence" is a phantasm and just the product of deluded minds. AKA a lie and you find yourself self-deceived.
 
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