Making God the author of sin

Sketo

Well-known member
How is decreeing all sin and then taking steps to make it happen not being the author of it

Gods foreknowledge is Gods perfect knowledge of the results of his own actions!

Gods “foreknowledge” is God knowing his work in the meticulous design of Lucifer, Adam, Eve, The Garden of Eden, The Tree of Life, The Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil, the timing before he works the placement of all of them together!

Act 15:18 Known unto God are all his works from the beginning of the world.

All of this, meticulous orchestration, was what shaped Gods foreknowledge!

God knew Lucifers strengths and weaknesses because he designed him!
God knew Adams weaknesses because he designed him!
God knew Eves weaknesses because he designed her!
God knew the definite outcome when allowing Satan into the Garden!

God knew the consequences of the fall because he designed the consequences! (see Rom 5:18-19)

Adam played his part precisely how God designed him to play his part!

There was no “possibility” of any other outcome because God is in control... not man!

God “foreknows” because...“Known unto God are all his works from the beginning of the world.” - Acts 15:18

Isa 14:24 The LORD of hosts hath sworn, saying, Surely as I have thought, so shall it come to pass; and as I have purposed, so shall it stand:

Eph 1:11 In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will:

Psa 33:11 The counsel of the LORD standeth for ever, the thoughts of his heart to all generations.

Psa 115:3 But our God is in the heavens: he hath done whatsoever he hath pleased.

Psa 135:6 Whatsoever the LORD pleased, that did he in heaven, and in earth, in the seas, and all deep places.

Deu 32:39 See now that I, even I, am he, and there is no god with me: I kill, and I make alive; I wound, and I heal: neither is there any that can deliver out of my hand.

1Sa 2:6-8 The LORD killeth, and maketh alive: he bringeth down to the grave, and bringeth up. The LORD maketh poor, and maketh rich: he bringeth low, and lifteth up. He raiseth up the poor out of the dust, and lifteth up the beggar from the dunghill, to set them among princes, and to make them inherit the throne of glory: for the pillars of the earth are the LORD'S, and he hath set the world upon them.

Job 9:12 Behold, he taketh away, who can hinder him? who will say unto him, What doest thou?

 

Theo1689

Well-known member

John Calvin’s Reign of Terror:


First of all, who cares about "John Calvin"?
You guys are SO obsessed with him!

We get our theology from the BIBLE, not from "John Calvin".
You can try to make Calvin sound worse than Hitler, but that does not change what the BIBLE teaches!

Second, Calvin was not a 21st century American. In the day he lived, ALL Christians believed that heretics were to be put to death. And if you lived back then, YOU would have held the same view. I'm not trying to justify his actions, but you can't presume to judge him based on a time frame he wasn't living in.

Third, the word, "murder" is very easily thrown around. Servetus wasn't "murdered", he was a convicted criminal who was executed. You may disagree with the validity of the law, but you can't deny that the law existed.

  • He had Servetus burned at the stake on October 27, 1553,

This is a false claim.
I encourage everyone to read the very source that Predestined provided, because apparently he didn't even bother to read it himself.


According to his own source, it is stated:

"Calvin agreed with the sentence of death passed on Servetus; however, he urged that in mercy Servetus be executed by the sword, not by burning. The council rejected his suggestion."

So much for Calvin's "power".

  • Gentile beheaded in 1566,
  • 34 women burned at the stake after accusing them of being witches who caused a plague that had swept through Geneva in 1545,
  • “Freckles” Dunant dies under torture in February 1545 without admitting to the crime of spreading the plague,
  • Several men and women are apprehended including a barber and a hospital supervisor who had “made a pact with the devil” in 1545,
  • 2 women executed by burning at the stake for sorcery by spreading the plague in March 7, 1545,
  • Belot (an Anabaptist) chained and tortured – against infant baptism in 1545,
  • 7 men executed concerning the plague outbreak in May 16, 1545,
  • a child was whipped publicly for calling his mother a thief,
  • a girl who struck her parents was beheaded,
  • Jacques Gruet accused of writing a poster against Calvin, was arrested, tortured, then executed in July 1546,
  • and the list goes on, his victims ranging in age from 16-80.

And there is no mention here that "Calvin" was responsible for any of the above. Again, from the same source:

"Michael Servetus was the only heretic ever executed in Geneva in Calvin’s lifetime. In comparison, between 3,000 and 10,000 people were executed by Catholics in Spain alone during the Inquisition. As tragic as Servetus’s death was, it should be kept in perspective."

If John Calvin was Elect, then so was Hitler! 58 murders is as good as 6 million.

Okay, let's say (for the sake of argument) that Calvin was the most evil man who ever lived.

Yet the Bible STILL teaches Calvinism.
So I will STILL continue to believe the BIBLE.
 

SovereignGrace

Well-known member
First of all, who cares about "John Calvin"?
You guys are SO obsessed with him!

We get our theology from the BIBLE, not from "John Calvin".
You can try to make Calvin sound worse than Hitler, but that does not change what the BIBLE teaches!

Second, Calvin was not a 21st century American. In the day he lived, ALL Christians believed that heretics were to be put to death. And if you lived back then, YOU would have held the same view. I'm not trying to justify his actions, but you can't presume to judge him based on a time frame he wasn't living in.

Third, the word, "murder" is very easily thrown around. Servetus wasn't "murdered", he was a convicted criminal who was executed. You may disagree with the validity of the law, but you can't deny that the law existed.



This is a false claim.
I encourage everyone to read the very source that Predestined provided, because apparently he didn't even bother to read it himself.


According to his own source, it is stated:

"Calvin agreed with the sentence of death passed on Servetus; however, he urged that in mercy Servetus be executed by the sword, not by burning. The council rejected his suggestion."

So much for Calvin's "power".



And there is no mention here that "Calvin" was responsible for any of the above. Again, from the same source:

"Michael Servetus was the only heretic ever executed in Geneva in Calvin’s lifetime. In comparison, between 3,000 and 10,000 people were executed by Catholics in Spain alone during the Inquisition. As tragic as Servetus’s death was, it should be kept in perspective."



Okay, let's say (for the sake of argument) that Calvin was the most evil man who ever lived.

Yet the Bible STILL teaches Calvinism.
So I will STILL continue to believe the BIBLE.
It's a smear campaign using smear tactics. I am amazed that someone who is so opposed to predestination and election has "Predestined" as a username. He's been duped.
 

e v e 21

Well-known member
The Title of the Thread involves a Category Mistake; a Bait and Switch...

Your quotes do not mention the word Sin but one time mentions God Authoring Evil. God is not the Author of Sin, but the Bible says God does Create Evil. Posters need to pay attention to the OP's Shell Game of using the word Sin in the Title but using different words in the Quotes...

The Categories of Sin and Evil do not Conflate. I say this just as an influence for anyone else who may want to Post here. This is THE answer, but if you want to feed him; Y'all have fun...
God does not create evil.

sin is an expression of evil.
 

e v e 21

Well-known member
some believe (incorrectly) that the prince of the air
(who is definitely evil to the core)
is their god…
 

e v e 21

Well-known member
^^^ horrible.


this earth is ruled by the prince of the air…

a horrible monster.

blame him for evil not God.
 

ReverendRV

Well-known member
Yes seems the "C" vaccine is working well.:sneaky:
Doxology - by ReverendRV

Jude 1:24-25 NIV
; To him who is able to keep you from stumbling and to present you before his glorious presence without fault and with great joy-- to the only God our Savior be glory, majesty, power and authority, through Jesus Christ our Lord, before all ages, now and forevermore! Amen.

A Doxology is a Liturgical expression of praise to God. This is exactly what our verses are; an outpouring of Praise from Saint Jude. At the end of the Epistle of Jude, his Soul was magnified when God used him to communicate to us; and he praised the Lord! Paul would often interrupt his teaching in an Epistle and break out in Praise to God, then continue on with his teaching; like in 1st Timothy 1:17. ~ The Church has a Doctrine called ‘Sola Deo Gloria’, which means “Glory to God Alone”. This Doctrine is embraced by every Evangelical; how could it not be? It means ‘To the only God and Savior be the Authority, Majesty, Power and Glory!’ ~ Saint John said our Heavenly reward will be a crown and we will lay it at Gods feet…

Laying our crown at the Feet of God may just be the most unimaginable thing we can think of; after all it is our reward! ~ Have you ever stolen anything that belonged to someone else? What do you call people who steal? You object, “Wait a minute! Keeping my reward makes me a Thief?” No; keeping the Glory of your reward makes you a Thief; remember, to the only God be the glory. Have you ever had another god other than the God of the Bible? If you think that you are glorious, you have; right? This makes you an Idolater at heart; being glorious suits yourself. These were just three of the Ten Commandments, do we need more? We do?? Have you ever told a Lie? What would you call a person that Lied to you? Just how glorious are you now that you’re a Liar? If God judged you by all Ten Commandments, would you be innocent or guilty? Would you go to Heaven or to Hell? Does this bother you?? If it doesn’t, it should…

But God, who is rich in Mercy even when we are dead in Trespasses and Sins, makes us alive in Jesus Christ; it is by Grace we are Saved! For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believes in him shall not perish but have everlasting Life. Behold the Lamb of God that takes away the Sin of the world; Jesus Christ! If you make his Soul and offering for Sin, God shall see the Labor of his Soul and be satisfied. God made him who had no sin to be sin for us so that in him we can become the Righteousness of God. According to the Bible, Christ died for our Sins, was buried but was raised on the Third Day! We’re Saved by God’s Grace thru Faith in the risen Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, without our power, majesty, authority or glory. Repent of your Sins, Confess Jesus Christ as your Lord God, and find a Church that always preaches the Bible. ~ We are not Saved by good Works but we are Born Again for Good Works, these go to our Heavenly Reward. But Jesus is our great reward and deserves all Glory. We no longer look at our laying our crowns at his feet as unimaginable, but as giving God all the Glory…

Genesis 15:1; After these things the word of the LORD came unto Abram in a vision, saying, Fear not, Abram: I am thy shield, and thy exceeding great reward.
 

ReverendRV

Well-known member
I wonder why we always get mocked for “ cut n paste “ and you get a free pass ?

is that a double standard in your opinion ?

and for the record I like your posts .
Probably because I wrote it. Maybe someone could report it and see what happens. Maybe it's because of the Likes?
 

Predestined

Well-known member
Doxology - by ReverendRV

Jude 1:24-25 NIV
; To him who is able to keep you from stumbling and to present you before his glorious presence without fault and with great joy-- to the only God our Savior be glory, majesty, power and authority, through Jesus Christ our Lord, before all ages, now and forevermore! Amen.

A Doxology is a Liturgical expression of praise to God. This is exactly what our verses are; an outpouring of Praise from Saint Jude. At the end of the Epistle of Jude, his Soul was magnified when God used him to communicate to us; and he praised the Lord! Paul would often interrupt his teaching in an Epistle and break out in Praise to God, then continue on with his teaching; like in 1st Timothy 1:17. ~ The Church has a Doctrine called ‘Sola Deo Gloria’, which means “Glory to God Alone”. This Doctrine is embraced by every Evangelical; how could it not be? It means ‘To the only God and Savior be the Authority, Majesty, Power and Glory!’ ~ Saint John said our Heavenly reward will be a crown and we will lay it at Gods feet…

Laying our crown at the Feet of God may just be the most unimaginable thing we can think of; after all it is our reward! ~ Have you ever stolen anything that belonged to someone else? What do you call people who steal? You object, “Wait a minute! Keeping my reward makes me a Thief?” No; keeping the Glory of your reward makes you a Thief; remember, to the only God be the glory. Have you ever had another god other than the God of the Bible? If you think that you are glorious, you have; right? This makes you an Idolater at heart; being glorious suits yourself. These were just three of the Ten Commandments, do we need more? We do?? Have you ever told a Lie? What would you call a person that Lied to you? Just how glorious are you now that you’re a Liar? If God judged you by all Ten Commandments, would you be innocent or guilty? Would you go to Heaven or to Hell? Does this bother you?? If it doesn’t, it should…

But God, who is rich in Mercy even when we are dead in Trespasses and Sins, makes us alive in Jesus Christ; it is by Grace we are Saved! For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believes in him shall not perish but have everlasting Life. Behold the Lamb of God that takes away the Sin of the world; Jesus Christ! If you make his Soul and offering for Sin, God shall see the Labor of his Soul and be satisfied. God made him who had no sin to be sin for us so that in him we can become the Righteousness of God. According to the Bible, Christ died for our Sins, was buried but was raised on the Third Day! We’re Saved by God’s Grace thru Faith in the risen Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, without our power, majesty, authority or glory. Repent of your Sins, Confess Jesus Christ as your Lord God, and find a Church that always preaches the Bible. ~ We are not Saved by good Works but we are Born Again for Good Works, these go to our Heavenly Reward. But Jesus is our great reward and deserves all Glory. We no longer look at our laying our crowns at his feet as unimaginable, but as giving God all the Glory…

Genesis 15:1; After these things the word of the LORD came unto Abram in a vision, saying, Fear not, Abram: I am thy shield, and thy exceeding great reward.
Best Track ever! :love: Great way to start the day.
 
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