"Mormonism" vs "the Gospel"

Magdalena

Well-known member
Ummm...ok. Done.

You really have no idea what I've experienced, so I don't think you can understand. I'm going to follow the fruits of the Spirit, and trust not in the arm of the flesh.
When you’re following mormonism, you are following the arm of flesh... false prophets. You can delude yourself with thinking you can stay in it and just do your own thing and everything will be ok, but it’s not. You’re not following Christ unless you’re actually following Him and what He actually said.

I'm a little confused pointing to this as evidence. Satan doesn't want me to obey. He tries to use fear and intimidation to scare me out of it. He wants me to focus on perfectionism, religiosity, and forget about grace. Yet, I trust in Jesus power, and Satan flees.Thats the point.
No, Aaron. Next time you’re in the temple, listen to the actual words as he stares at you from the screen...

“I have a word to say concerning these people. If they do not walk up to every covenant they make at these altars in this temple this day, they will be in my power!“

Why would he threaten you into keeping those covenants? Why would he want you to keep them?
 

Markk

Active member
I'm a little confused pointing to this as evidence. Satan doesn't want me to obey. He tries to use fear and intimidation to scare me out of it. He wants me to focus on perfectionism, religiosity, and forget about grace. Yet, I trust in Jesus power, and Satan flees.Thats the point.
Hi Aaron,

Wow, …and perfectionism, religiosity, and forgetting about Grace, are three cardinal tenants of Mormonism. Which I believe what was Mag’s point was.

Its posts like this one that makes me really see Mormonism for what it is. There is really nothing I or Mag’s can tell you that you don’t get Aaron, other than you won’t wake up one morning and the Church will somehow be something it will never be, or something you need it to be. I know you know what I mean by this. It’s time Aaron, and it’s okay, rest in Him.
 

Aaron32

Well-known member
Hi Aaron,

Wow, …and perfectionism, religiosity, and forgetting about Grace, are three cardinal tenants of Mormonism. Which I believe what was Mag’s point was.

Its posts like this one that makes me really see Mormonism for what it is. There is really nothing I or Mag’s can tell you that you don’t get Aaron, other than you won’t wake up one morning and the Church will somehow be something it will never be, or something you need it to be. I know you know what I mean by this. It’s time Aaron, and it’s okay, rest in Him.
Markk - I'm not sure what part of my words you're not understanding, or how many times I have to repeat myself, or the different ways I have to say it, but you are correct in the point that there is nothing you can say that's going to change my mind.

I do not rely on the arm of the flesh. Whether that's you, or the Church, or my family, or my best friend. God has given me conviction in the Book of Mormon that I cannot deny. He's also given me a powerful witness of the love that He had for humanity and why He sent His Son, I've also receive a miraculous witness of the power of the priesthood and hidden treasures found in the temple, and in the midst of all this he's shown me how all major true religions teach the same message using different terms and languages and that truth is one great whole, but Mormonism theologically is the only religion that can embrace them all.
I keep giving you a different definitions from Mormonism that you simply don't want to accept. I've shared references that shows how Mormonism has moved on from the 1950's platitudes and top-down authoritarianism, but you simply reject it. And, likewise, there's nothing I can tell you to change your mind.
There is no logical flow to your definition to Mormonism. Like a mathbook, Im trying to read the front of the book breaking down the mathmatical equations and trying to figure out how things work. You using an antiquated version of Cliff's notes saying "It doesn't matter, this is how things are." I ask "Why?" And your answer is "I don't know, but the book says so." It's the difference between knowing and understanding.
Just as @BoJ has a fixed definition of what "faith-based salvation" is, your definition of Mormonism is unwavering. What would happen if we actually had common ground and we removed all of the strawman arguments and labels and trusted each other's answers and didn't care if we were right or wrong? And we took all the know about the Bible, and salvation, and righteousness, and God's holiness and found all points of agreement, and we forgot about the past of each of our religion's history and relied on the own revelations God has given us, and we focused just on what we knew, dropping all speculation - what would happen? I tend to believe we'd arrive to the Doctrine of Christ as taught in 2 Nephi 31 & 32.
And if we saw that as the fullness of the gospel, the new and everlasting covenant, and ordinances such as baptism, or marriage was part of (encapsulated into, not adding to) that, then we could see all our works are simply how we glorify God. And because we rely on the Holy Ghost and not the great and spacious building, there's no man's logic or reason that could persuade us, and we'd realize there's only two churches - the church of God or the church of the devil, and we'd see those churches is both in the world and in the Church of Jesus Christ of LDS. And the spirit of fear and contention comes from the devil, but Christ has taught us not to contend, but to have faith, hope, and charity.
Admittedly, the Church is sick, so is the world. Though you reject my message, the Church needs your understanding of the gospel, and so does the world. We could be united and on the same page, and unitedly establish peace, and we have an established structure to magnify our efforts, if your willing to take off your anti-Mormon lens and believe Mormons when they say "that's not what I believe".
But, I understand your holdbacks. I respect your understanding. All I ask is that you respect mine. If you think what I believe isn't Mormonism, then ok. It's not Mormonism. Yet, I'm fully transparent with my understanding in grace vs works, and my views of theology in deep doctrinal discussions (that usually occur outside church settings), and I've yet to be kicked out of the church, but I keep getting called to teach the youth, and they're going to be taught the gospel exactly as I teach you. I actually use some of your points that you make to ensure they will have a different understanding of Mormonism than you do.
 

Markk

Active member
BoJ wrote…IOW, they are counseled to work to find out for themselves, but this creates a problem. There are those who think they have the guidance of the Holy Ghost and say the church is wrong and then there are those who think they have the Holy Ghost and say the church is right. Personal revelation doesn't seem to be working so well for some people. I personally believe that when someone decides the church is wrong and they are right that person is listening to himself.
Aaron wrote…The irony is that you're saying the Church is wrong in their counsel because it causes problems. Based on your own reasoning, this reasoning is uninspired. That's pretty hilarious!

In regards to both of you, in our conversations, when presented with a teaching that you disagree with, the personal revelation card is pulled often. Whether you agree with it, or disagree with it, personal revelation is a necessary reality of Mormonism to
Markk - I'm not sure what part of my words you're not understanding, or how many times I have to repeat myself, or the different ways I have to say it, but you are correct in the point that there is nothing you can say that's going to change my mind.

I do not rely on the arm of the flesh. Whether that's you, or the Church, or my family, or my best friend. God has given me conviction in the Book of Mormon that I cannot deny. He's also given me a powerful witness of the love that He had for humanity and why He sent His Son, I've also receive a miraculous witness of the power of the priesthood and hidden treasures found in the temple, and in the midst of all this he's shown me how all major true religions teach the same message using different terms and languages and that truth is one great whole, but Mormonism theologically is the only religion that can embrace them all.
I keep giving you a different definitions from Mormonism that you simply don't want to accept. I've shared references that shows how Mormonism has moved on from the 1950's platitudes and top-down authoritarianism, but you simply reject it. And, likewise, there's nothing I can tell you to change your mind.
There is no logical flow to your definition to Mormonism. Like a mathbook, Im trying to read the front of the book breaking down the mathmatical equations and trying to figure out how things work. You using an antiquated version of Cliff's notes saying "It doesn't matter, this is how things are." I ask "Why?" And your answer is "I don't know, but the book says so." It's the difference between knowing and understanding.
Just as @BoJ has a fixed definition of what "faith-based salvation" is, your definition of Mormonism is unwavering. What would happen if we actually had common ground and we removed all of the strawman arguments and labels and trusted each other's answers and didn't care if we were right or wrong? And we took all the know about the Bible, and salvation, and righteousness, and God's holiness and found all points of agreement, and we forgot about the past of each of our religion's history and relied on the own revelations God has given us, and we focused just on what we knew, dropping all speculation - what would happen? I tend to believe we'd arrive to the Doctrine of Christ as taught in 2 Nephi 31 & 32.
And if we saw that as the fullness of the gospel, the new and everlasting covenant, and ordinances such as baptism, or marriage was part of (encapsulated into, not adding to) that, then we could see all our works are simply how we glorify God. And because we rely on the Holy Ghost and not the great and spacious building, there's no man's logic or reason that could persuade us, and we'd realize there's only two churches - the church of God or the church of the devil, and we'd see those churches is both in the world and in the Church of Jesus Christ of LDS. And the spirit of fear and contention comes from the devil, but Christ has taught us not to contend, but to have faith, hope, and charity.
Admittedly, the Church is sick, so is the world. Though you reject my message, the Church needs your understanding of the gospel, and so does the world. We could be united and on the same page, and unitedly establish peace, and we have an established structure to magnify our efforts, if your willing to take off your anti-Mormon lens and believe Mormons when they say "that's not what I believe".
But, I understand your holdbacks. I respect your understanding. All I ask is that you respect mine. If you think what I believe isn't Mormonism, then ok. It's not Mormonism. Yet, I'm fully transparent with my understanding in grace vs works, and my views of theology in deep doctrinal discussions (that usually occur outside church settings), and I've yet to be kicked out of the church, but I keep getting called to teach the youth, and they're going to be taught the gospel exactly as I teach you. I actually use some of your points that you make to ensure they will have a different understanding of Mormonism than you do.
Aaron,

In one breath you say it is not the “arm of the flesh” and then you explain in subjective “fleshly” terms why you believe what you believe?

You say I reject your message, well, I am not sure what your message is at any given time, but generally you are correct. I respect you Aaron, I do, and I respect your right to believe what you want to believe…but I do not respect your doctrine, or your approach…but again that does not mean I do not respect you or care about you, in that I do.

The references you give from Mormonism IMO, are mostly cut up out of context self formed philosophy. If you really want to start from the beginning “mathematically” to understand Mormon Doctrine, then you need to start from the beginning, which is the Plan of Salvation, progression and eternal law, in that if you can’t understand the basic premise of a these doctrines or “eternal truths”…you can’t possible understand core LDS doctrine…it is impossible.

We can agree that what you believe is not Mormonism…okay, we will have to leave it at that.

Admittedly, the Church is sick, so is the world. Though you reject my message, the Church needs your understanding of the gospel, and so does the world. We could be united and on the same page, and unitedly establish peace, and we have an established structure to magnify our efforts, if your willing to take off your anti-Mormon lens and believe Mormons when they say "that's not what I believe".

The church needs to repent, yet you have issues with that. It can’t change until it repents. It need to start by rejecting God was a man, and man is a God in embryo…Grace will follow. It can’t understand Grace, when they believe they don’t need it because they are basically Gods. That is using your own words…sick.

You must know a lot of Mormons differently than I…that is for sure. but I assure you “the church” believes and teaches they are future Gods.

Love ya, I hope we can continue to work through this.
 

Magdalena

Well-known member
Markk - I'm not sure what part of my words you're not understanding, or how many times I have to repeat myself, or the different ways I have to say it, but you are correct in the point that there is nothing you can say that's going to change my mind.

I do not rely on the arm of the flesh. Whether that's you, or the Church, or my family, or my best friend. God has given me conviction in the Book of Mormon that I cannot deny. He's also given me a powerful witness of the love that He had for humanity and why He sent His Son, I've also receive a miraculous witness of the power of the priesthood and hidden treasures found in the temple, and in the midst of all this he's shown me how all major true religions teach the same message using different terms and languages and that truth is one great whole, but Mormonism theologically is the only religion that can embrace them all.
I keep giving you a different definitions from Mormonism that you simply don't want to accept. I've shared references that shows how Mormonism has moved on from the 1950's platitudes and top-down authoritarianism, but you simply reject it. And, likewise, there's nothing I can tell you to change your mind.
There is no logical flow to your definition to Mormonism. Like a mathbook, Im trying to read the front of the book breaking down the mathmatical equations and trying to figure out how things work. You using an antiquated version of Cliff's notes saying "It doesn't matter, this is how things are." I ask "Why?" And your answer is "I don't know, but the book says so." It's the difference between knowing and understanding.
Just as @BoJ has a fixed definition of what "faith-based salvation" is, your definition of Mormonism is unwavering. What would happen if we actually had common ground and we removed all of the strawman arguments and labels and trusted each other's answers and didn't care if we were right or wrong? And we took all the know about the Bible, and salvation, and righteousness, and God's holiness and found all points of agreement, and we forgot about the past of each of our religion's history and relied on the own revelations God has given us, and we focused just on what we knew, dropping all speculation - what would happen? I tend to believe we'd arrive to the Doctrine of Christ as taught in 2 Nephi 31 & 32.
And if we saw that as the fullness of the gospel, the new and everlasting covenant, and ordinances such as baptism, or marriage was part of (encapsulated into, not adding to) that, then we could see all our works are simply how we glorify God. And because we rely on the Holy Ghost and not the great and spacious building, there's no man's logic or reason that could persuade us, and we'd realize there's only two churches - the church of God or the church of the devil, and we'd see those churches is both in the world and in the Church of Jesus Christ of LDS. And the spirit of fear and contention comes from the devil, but Christ has taught us not to contend, but to have faith, hope, and charity.
Admittedly, the Church is sick, so is the world. Though you reject my message, the Church needs your understanding of the gospel, and so does the world. We could be united and on the same page, and unitedly establish peace, and we have an established structure to magnify our efforts, if your willing to take off your anti-Mormon lens and believe Mormons when they say "that's not what I believe".
But, I understand your holdbacks. I respect your understanding. All I ask is that you respect mine. If you think what I believe isn't Mormonism, then ok. It's not Mormonism. Yet, I'm fully transparent with my understanding in grace vs works, and my views of theology in deep doctrinal discussions (that usually occur outside church settings), and I've yet to be kicked out of the church, but I keep getting called to teach the youth, and they're going to be taught the gospel exactly as I teach you. I actually use some of your points that you make to ensure they will have a different understanding of Mormonism than you do.
You seem to have this fairy tale idea that we could all come together, meet in the middle, but that we would see that mormonism is still the only way. We’ve been where you are. We’re not going back, because it’s not Christ’s way. It’s a different gospel than the one He gave us. And He warned us about that. He warned about false prophets, Aaron.

You can’t be in mormonism and just declare yourself separate from it. You can’t departmentalize it and think that’s ok with Christ. You can’t pick one from column A and one from column B, like a Chinese food menu, when it comes to following Christ. You can’t say ok, I pick the Book of Mormon and the priesthood, but the rest of it is sick. It’s all sick. It’s all false. It has been from the beginning. It did not come from Christ.

You can’t stand in a festering swamp and declare you’re on the right road. If you want to follow Him, you have to leave false prophets and false doctrines behind.
 

Markk

Active member
You seem to have this fairy tale idea that we could all come together, meet in the middle, but that we would see that mormonism is still the only way. We’ve been where you are. We’re not going back, because it’s not Christ’s way. It’s a different gospel than the one He gave us. And He warned us about that. He warned about false prophets, Aaron.

You can’t be in mormonism and just declare yourself separate from it. You can’t departmentalize it and think that’s ok with Christ. You can’t pick one from column A and one from column B, like a Chinese food menu, when it comes to following Christ. You can’t say ok, I pick the Book of Mormon and the priesthood, but the rest of it is sick. It’s all sick. It’s all false. It has been from the beginning. It did not come from Christ.

You can’t stand in a festering swamp and declare you’re on the right road. If you want to follow Him, you have to leave false prophets and false doctrines behind.
Well said…
 

Aaron32

Well-known member
You seem to have this fairy tale idea that we could all come together, meet in the middle,
Believing you to possess the fruits of a Christian: being meek, humble, merciful, peacekeeping, hungering and thirsting for righteousness, and having charity, agreeing with thine adversary quickly. I don't know why we couldn't come to a middle ground.
butut that we would see that mormonism is still the only way.
There is only one way. But that's not Mormonism as you understand it.
We’ve been where you are. We’re not going back, because it’s not Christ’s way.
No, if you agree with Markk that Mormonism is fear, perfectionism, and intimidation you have certainly not been where I have.
It’s a different gospel than the one He gave us. And He warned us about that. He warned about false prophets, Aaron.
It really makes no difference what I say does it? But ok. Just ignore everything I said, and repeat your dead talking point.
You can’t be in mormonism and just declare yourself separate from it. You can’t departmentalize it and think that’s ok with Christ. You can’t pick one from column A and one from column B, like a Chinese food menu, when it comes to following Christ. You can’t say ok, I pick the Book of Mormon and the priesthood, but the rest of it is sick. It’s all sick. It’s all false. It has been from the beginning. It did not come from Christ.
The only reason you think I compartmentalize is because you assume I agree with your definition of Mormonism, which you cant even explain or defend. If you ever get stumped, you just use that as evidence of how corrupt it is.
My reasoning is perfectly congruent, and it requires the Holy Ghost to understand.
You can’t stand in a festering swamp and declare you’re on the right road. If you want to follow Him, you have to leave false prophets and false doctrines behind.
That door swings both ways. Maybe you ought to consider your ways before placing judgment.
 

Markk

Active member
No, if you agree with Markk that Mormonism is fear, perfectionism, and intimidation you have certainly not been where I have.
Just to be clear I do believe th fruit Mormonism is all three of those, and more to most of its TBM membership. I would venture to say that you would define the ‘sick” part of Mormonism using the same terms.

A few examples…

1. Fear…the fear that it is not true, and hanging on, even though you know there are issues.
2. Perfectionism… we already agreed how we feel about the word worthy. The end goal is becomeing perfect like HF is perfect, and the by product of that is depression for far too many good people.
3. Intimidation…if you don’t what you are told, no temple, no forever family
 

Magdalena

Well-known member
Believing you to possess the fruits of a Christian: being meek, humble, merciful, peacekeeping, hungering and thirsting for righteousness, and having charity, agreeing with thine adversary quickly. I don't know why we couldn't come to a middle ground.
Because there is no middle ground. There’s only Christ’s way. Those qualities don’t mean you have to accept false prophets and false doctrines just to “get along.”

There is only one way. But that's not Mormonism as you understand it.
The one way is not mormonism at all, no matter how you understand it.

No, if you agree with Markk that Mormonism is fear, perfectionism, and intimidation you have certainly not been where I have.
We’ve been mormons. You are a Mormon. No matter what you think it is, you’re still following false prophets.

It really makes no difference what I say does it? But ok. Just ignore everything I said, and repeat your dead talking point.
Christ’s gospel is not a “dead talking point.”

The only reason you think I compartmentalize is because you assume I agree with your definition of Mormonism, which you cant even explain or defend. If you ever get stumped, you just use that as evidence of how corrupt it is.
No, I think you do that because of what you say here.

My reasoning is perfectly congruent, and it requires the Holy Ghost to understand.
No, it’s not. It’s jumbled, disjointed, made up. The Holy Ghost doesn’t inspire chaos.

That door swings both ways. Maybe you ought to consider your ways before placing judgment.
It’s not judgment. It’s reality.
 

Aaron32

Well-known member
Because there is no middle ground. There’s only Christ’s way. Those qualities don’t mean you have to accept false prophets and false doctrines just to “get along.”
We’ve been mormons. You are a Mormon. No matter what you think it is, you’re still following false prophets.
Christ’s gospel is not a “dead talking point.”


No, I think you do that because of what you say here.


No, it’s not. It’s jumbled, disjointed, made up. The Holy Ghost doesn’t inspire chaos.


It’s not judgment. It’s reality.
Not much substance here.
 

brotherofJared

Well-known member
One problem I have going and finding a church that is right is that there isn't one.
That's great. Then find one that you feel is the most correct. And when you find that one, keep your eye out for one that is even more correct until you find the one true church. There can only be one.
 

brotherofJared

Well-known member
On a personal level it's the greatest authority.
But zero doctrinal value.
Deny Him is the only sin we can't be forgiven.
irrelevant. We aren't talking about sin, we're talking about establishing doctrine.
Sorry. John 14:26
Thanks for the clarification: "But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, he will teach you all things and bring to your remembrance all that I have said to you." As I said before, whether or not someone receives help from the Holy Ghost is extremely subjective.
The irony is that you're saying the Church is wrong in their counsel because it causes problems.
:ROFLMAO: :ROFLMAO: :ROFLMAO:
The real irony is that you think I'm saying the church is wrong. I'm not. I'm saying your wrong about what the church teaches and I gather you came to these conclusions through the influence of the Holy Ghost. Hopefully, you can sew why personal revelation isn't the basis for doctrine.
But how is false doctrine identified?
If it differs from true doctrine, it is false, like faith-alone is a false doctrine.
Because polygamy is such a vital doctrine to be in agreement on, right?
It is. We still practice it, serially. It can' the avoided as long as there is eternal marriage and I'd say that is a "vital" doctrine, wouldn't you?
Even though Wilford Woodruff ended the practice.
Ahhh. but he didn't end the practice. He conformed the practice to work within the confines of the law.
Have you considered Mormon Fundamentalism? That might be a better fit for you. 😂
:ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:
Wake up.
 

Fenuay

Well-known member
That's great. Then find one that you feel is the most correct. And when you find that one, keep your eye out for one that is even more correct until you find the one true church. There can only be one.
I'm trying but it's between two and they lack one major thing I believe is Biblical. 😢
 

Fenuay

Well-known member
But zero doctrinal value.

irrelevant. We aren't talking about sin, we're talking about establishing doctrine.

Thanks for the clarification: "But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, he will teach you all things and bring to your remembrance all that I have said to you." As I said before, whether or not someone receives help from the Holy Ghost is extremely subjective.

:ROFLMAO: :ROFLMAO: :ROFLMAO:
The real irony is that you think I'm saying the church is wrong. I'm not. I'm saying your wrong about what the church teaches and I gather you came to these conclusions through the influence of the Holy Ghost. Hopefully, you can sew why personal revelation isn't the basis for doctrine.

If it differs from true doctrine, it is false, like faith-alone is a false doctrine.

It is. We still practice it, serially. It can' the avoided as long as there is eternal marriage and I'd say that is a "vital" doctrine, wouldn't you?

Ahhh. but he didn't end the practice. He conformed the practice to work within the confines of the law.

:ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:
Wake up.
BoJ were you born a member or did you convert. I'm asking just because I'm wondering what testified to you of the truth you believe the Church holds. I often find it's different between born members or converts. Most converts I've spoken with have a definitive moment they felt the testimony of the Spirit whereas I've often heard members say that they already felt the church had the truth and that the Holy Spirit always testified of it to them or that they felt that the Holy Spirit convicted them later before their mission or when they became aware of other churches. But I often hear of the burning in the bottom that is said to be the Holy Spirit testifying the truth. So perhaps some feeling is important as part of our testimony? If that is how the Spirit communicates to us. But also them isn't it personal revelation that tells us these truths through the Spirit? So I think personal revelation is important provided we measure it against the scriptures.
 

Aaron32

Well-known member
But zero doctrinal value.
So I guess that means I care more about what God says than what you consider "doctrinal value". If you care about doctrine, the only doctrine you should concern yourself with is the doctrine of Christ which is faith based.
irrelevant. We aren't talking about sin, we're talking about establishing doctrine.
LoL! The established doctrine is to be led by the Holy Ghost!
Thanks for the clarification: "But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, he will teach you all things and bring to your remembrance all that I have said to you." As I said before, whether or not someone receives help from the Holy Ghost is extremely subjective.
Yes. As it was meant to be. That's why Jesus taught in parables.
:ROFLMAO: :ROFLMAO: :ROFLMAO:
The real irony is that you think I'm saying the church is wrong. I'm not. I'm saying your wrong about what the church teaches and I gather you came to these conclusions through the influence of the Holy Ghost. Hopefully, you can sew why personal revelation isn't the basis for doctrine.

If it differs from true doctrine, it is false, like faith-alone is a false doctrine.
Which you have yet to prove. I'm only wrong according to you based on your definition of loaded phrases, and implied arguments you think I'm making, but I'm not.
It is. We still practice it, serially. It can' the avoided as long as there is eternal marriage and I'd say that is a "vital" doctrine, wouldn't you?
I suppose it depends on how much you want to get to the truth of the matter. Can you accept nuance, or do you want to argue on literal terms. If we still practice it, then I guess we should get arrested, since it's illegal.
Ahhh. but he didn't end the practice. He conformed the practice to work within the confines of the law.
So rather than a man be called to practice polygamy, a man is automatically called to polygamy upon his wife's death? Is that it?
Smh
 

brotherofJared

Well-known member
BoJ were you born a member or did you convert.
I haven't answered that question and I don't believe I ever will.
I'm asking just because I'm wondering what testified to you of the truth you believe the Church holds.
Do you mean what convinced me it was true? The Holy Ghost.
I often find it's different between born members or converts
No. It's the same. There may be born members who haven't had that witness yet, but when they do, it's always the Holy Ghost.
Most converts I've spoken with have a definitive moment they felt the testimony of the Spirit whereas I've often heard members say that they already felt the church had the truth and that the Holy Spirit always testified of it to them or that they felt that the Holy Spirit convicted them later before their mission or when they became aware of other churches. But I often hear of the burning in the bottom that is said to be the Holy Spirit testifying the truth
There was no burning in my bosom sensation for me, it went way beyond that. For me, it was more like being taken into the 3rd heaven, whether in the body or out, I know not.
But also them isn't it personal revelation that tells us these truths through the Spirit?
We can receive truth through the witness of the Holy Spirit, but that doesn't make it doctrine.
 
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