in that catholics are nothing like her.
Mother Mary
- Thread starter dingoling.
- Start date
what gospel did he 'preach'?
what is the true Gospel of Jesus Christ from the Bible?
he had more authority than the rcc did or does.
He did and the rcc blew a gasket!
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hardly. no believer would even want to do that - it's contrary to scripture.
the rcc/pope was massively ticked 'cause he exposed lies of the rcc. same thing here - catholics get ticked when we post His truth - which doesn't agree with rcc false teachings.
Bonnie
Super Member
That is false. Luther wasn't perfect, heaven knows, but he never got over the wonder of Jesus Christ saving Him and us on account of His love and mercy towards us. He never got over having eternal life on account of grace through faith and not by any works on our account, that while the "wages of sin is death", the "free give of God is life eternal in Christ Jesus our Lord." (Romans. 6:23)
What part of "free gift" don't Catholics understand?
Bonnie
Super Member
Depends upon the church. But with the more conservative churches, they agree about the same core doctrines as my church:
1. triune Godhead
2. Virgin birth
3. Jesus is fully God and fully man
4. Vicarious atonement
5. Forgiveness of sins
6. Salvation by grace through faith in Jesus and not by our works
7. Resurrection of the dead
This is all I will say about other churches, for discussing other churches and what they believe is off topic for this board.
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Especially when it goes against Scripture!
romishpopishorganist
Well-known member
What part of "Catholics believe salvation is a free gift" don't YOU understand?
A new day
Super Member
It is well known already that the Rcc teaches adherent's of the Rcc they are NOT to rely on God's mercy for salvation. Its all about what Rc's themselves do, by their own will, strength, and power. So substantially, it takes God out of the equation. The Rcc magisterium, speaks out of both sides of its mouth.
If you have to earn the gift or deserve the gift, then it is not a free gift is it? God says our attempts at righteousness will not cut it, and the reason HE sent His son to die for us.
the part that adds works into it - depending on things they must do, according to the rcc teachings, not according to scripture.
Bonnie
Super Member
Oh, really? What is free about salvation being based upon grace through faith in Jesus, plus our good works? If we must DO works to help us be saved, then that is not a gift.
dingoling.
Well-known member
The nCCs never get it. For about the 1000th time, it is not our good works it is God's work in us causing us to walk in his statutes....
organgrinder
Well-known member
We understand it quite well. What you and your church say it is and how it is actually practiced and reinforced at the local parish level is different. Catholic friend of mine (I was Catholic at the time) was doing lotrs of social justice stuff to get closer to God so he would be accepted. He finally quit because that wasn't working for him. He wasn't taught about the "free gift" apart from works. His understanding of what he was taught was that he needed works so God would accept him.
That is the problem.
dingoling.
Well-known member
The problem then is that of proper catechism.
Bonnie
Super Member
I think the CCC disagrees with that. Here are the "anathemas" from Trent, from a Reformed website:
The Anathema's from Trent on justification by faith alone | Reformed Theology at Semper Reformanda
Concerning justification Canon 1. "If any one saith, that man may be justified before God by his own works, whether done through the teaching of human nature, or that of the law, without the grace of God through Jesus Christ; let him be anathema." Canon 4. "If any one saith, that ...
www.semperreformanda.com
Of course the good works we do IN Christ Jesus we do IN faith, and IN salvation, not FOR salvation. And it is God Who enables us to do them and walk in them. But they do not help--note, I said HELP--to save us, or keep us saved or increase our justification before God.
"He saved us NOT on account of works which we have done IN righteousness, but on account of His mercy..." (Titus 3)
What are "works done in righteousness"?
Really is that true, have you read what some RCs post in this and other threads about salvation.
Yep we are still waiting for you to tell us what are the works that save. You said it is not faith that saves and add the word alone. Yet you never actually clearly state what else is needed. You just answer with not works of law, which means absolutely nothing. I mean are you saying all works of law are evil works?
Which is lacking in your posts.
Well maybe that is because you avoid answering questions asked. You make vague statements and answer non questions but never answer. What works are needed? according to dingoling. Just tell us all, what they are and then we will know.
Bob Carabbio
Well-known member
Any Church that DARES to teach salvation by Jesus Blood "AND" anything else are DEAD WRONG, making the SIN OFFERING of Jesus of no effect through their Traditions.