Nero redivivus?

squirrelyguy

Active member
Is anyone else convinced that the most natural reading of Revelation suggests that Nero will come back to life and rule the world before Christ comes back? If so, then the idea that there will be a statue of him in Jerusalem that can speak and bewitch the world isn't so far fetched either. I think both of these are suggested by a "literal" reading of Revelation...or at least as literally as Revelation can be taken. It would also harmonize the strong points of preterism and premillennialism together into one coherent view of the tribulation...the reason that the NT so strongly suggests that Nero is the antichrist is because Nero both was and will be the antichrist. What he did to Christians and to Jerusalem leading up to 70 AD is but a foreshadowing of what he will do in the end times.

 

Yodas_Prodigy

Active member
I think your desire to harmonize two very different systems of eschatology is admirable. Nero is dead, and he ain't coming back. Yes, he was the beast of Revelation and theeeeeee Anti-Christ.

27 And as it is appointed for men to die once, but after this the judgment,

I am a Partial Preterist, that feeds a Post Millennial view. There may be a future final anti-Christ. If so, he will be the newly selected human being... He will arise for a short time and be squashed...
 

squirrelyguy

Active member
I think your desire to harmonize two very different systems of eschatology is admirable. Nero is dead, and he ain't coming back. Yes, he was the beast of Revelation and theeeeeee Anti-Christ.

27 And as it is appointed for men to die once, but after this the judgment,

I am a Partial Preterist, that feeds a Post Millennial view. There may be a future final anti-Christ. If so, he will be the newly selected human being... He will arise for a short time and be squashed...
Could Hebrews 9:27 be taken simply to mean that judgment comes after we die? We have examples of resurrections in the New Testament, and presumably each one of them died again.
 

squirrelyguy

Active member
No...

But, who caused the resurrection? And how long were the people dead?
Well, Jesus raised Lazarus after he had been dead for four days. The other resurrections that he performed were of people who presumably had died less than 24 hours before. Both Elijah and Elisha performed a resurrection apiece...and this doesn't include the dead man who sprang to life after being thrown into the grave with Elisha's bones. Peter resurrected Dorcas, and Paul resurrected Eutychus. There's also the case of the many saints whose graves were opened and their bodies came out after Christ's resurrection, and they appeared in Jerusalem to many people. This group of resurrected believers could plausibly have been raised with eternal bodies, and thus ascended to heaven at some point...but the other resurrections in the Bible were of people who would have died again (especially the ones before the book of Acts). The reason for this is that Christ is called "the firstborn from the dead", and therefore no one could have received a resurrection body before He did.
 

Timtofly

Member
Well, Jesus raised Lazarus after he had been dead for four days. The other resurrections that he performed were of people who presumably had died less than 24 hours before. Both Elijah and Elisha performed a resurrection apiece...and this doesn't include the dead man who sprang to life after being thrown into the grave with Elisha's bones. Peter resurrected Dorcas, and Paul resurrected Eutychus. There's also the case of the many saints whose graves were opened and their bodies came out after Christ's resurrection, and they appeared in Jerusalem to many people. This group of resurrected believers could plausibly have been raised with eternal bodies, and thus ascended to heaven at some point...but the other resurrections in the Bible were of people who would have died again (especially the ones before the book of Acts). The reason for this is that Christ is called "the firstborn from the dead", and therefore no one could have received a resurrection body before He did.
Jesus was 100% God. He already had a resurrection body, from birth. He showed this body on the mount of Transfiguration, before the Cross.
 

jamesh

Active member
Is anyone else convinced that the most natural reading of Revelation suggests that Nero will come back to life and rule the world before Christ comes back? If so, then the idea that there will be a statue of him in Jerusalem that can speak and bewitch the world isn't so far fetched either. I think both of these are suggested by a "literal" reading of Revelation...or at least as literally as Revelation can be taken. It would also harmonize the strong points of preterism and premillennialism together into one coherent view of the tribulation...the reason that the NT so strongly suggests that Nero is the antichrist is because Nero both was and will be the antichrist. What he did to Christians and to Jerusalem leading up to 70 AD is but a foreshadowing of what he will do in the end times.


Not only am I not convinced but it would be impossible for "Nero" to come back to life for several reasons. As noted by Yodas where he quoted Hebrews 9:27, "And inasmuch as it is appointed for men to die ONCE and after this the judgment." Nero died and will be judged just like Hitler and the rest of these antichrist killers. And btw, this verse shoots down reincarnation.

Now, I read part of the article from wikipedia. Notice it says this is a "legend" started by these so-called "pretenders." So give me a reason why I should believe them? Another couple of interesting facts is that the Apostle John wrote his books after 70AD including the book of Revelation.

Look what 1 John 1:18 says, "Children, it is the last hour and just as you heard that antichrist (singular) is coming, even now many antichrist have arisen; from this we know it is the last hour." Notice John says "antichrist" is coming. Also notice that if Nero was "THE" antichrist why did not John or even others point out this cataclysmic event where Jesus appears where everyone will see Him?

Now, one of the reasons I'm a post-tribulationist is because of what John stated at 1 John 1:18. If the Church is raptured before the tribulation then why does John tell us to look for the antichrist if were not going to be here? Forget about "Nero!"

In Him,
herman
 

En Hakkore

Well-known member
Is anyone else convinced that the most natural reading of Revelation suggests that Nero will come back to life and rule the world before Christ comes back?
While there are some dissenters, it is generally accepted within New Testament scholarship that the Nero redivivus myth provides the proper background to understanding chapters 13 and 17 in Revelation (Klauck 690). It should be noted, however, that this myth developed over time and began with the idea that Nero survived the stab wound to the neck by which he intended to die and would come out of his present place of hiding in the East where he was thought to be. In 13:3 this head of the beast receives a blow like being slain to death, but that it is healed. Further along in the chapter there are glances back to this... there is reference to the beast whose death blow was healed (13:12) and who lived despite having a sword blow (13:14). It was only when Nero failed to materialize that the legend accrued the idea of a return from the dead. In chapter 17, now the beast was, is not and will soon ascend from the abyss (17:8). That both points along the tradition's trajectory are found in Revelation lend support to compositional layers within the text dating to different decades of the late first century (Friesen 136-37).

Kind regards,
Jonathan


Works cited:
Friesen, Steven J. Imperial Cults and the Apocalypse of John: Reading Revelation in the Ruins. Oxford University Press, 2001.
Klauck, Hans-Josef. "Do They Never Come Back? Nero Redivivus and the Apocalypse of John." The Catholic Biblical Quarterly 63.4 (2001) 683-98.
 

squirrelyguy

Active member
Not only am I not convinced but it would be impossible for "Nero" to come back to life for several reasons. As noted by Yodas where he quoted Hebrews 9:27, "And inasmuch as it is appointed for men to die ONCE and after this the judgment." Nero died and will be judged just like Hitler and the rest of these antichrist killers. And btw, this verse shoots down reincarnation.
There are two reasons why Hebrews 9:27 isn't to be taken as in the way that you're using it:

1. There are people in the Bible who died twice. Those who were resurrected from the dead (especially the ones before Christ's own resurrection) would have been raised in natural bodies, and would therefore have died again.
2. The Bible mentions others who never die at all. Paul speaks of those who are alive and remain at Christ's return being caught up into the air with those who are resurrected (1 Thess. 4:15-17). And although Enoch and Elijah never died, I don't include them in this number since I believe they will come back to earth as the two witnesses of Revelation 11.
 

squirrelyguy

Active member
While there are some dissenters, it is generally accepted within New Testament scholarship that the Nero redivivus myth provides the proper background to understanding chapters 13 and 17 in Revelation (Klauck 690). It should be noted, however, that this myth developed over time and began with the idea that Nero survived the stab wound to the neck by which he intended to die and would come out of his present place of hiding in the East where he was thought to be. In 13:3 this head of the beast receives a blow like being slain to death, but that it is healed. Further along in the chapter there are glances back to this... there is reference to the beast whose death blow was healed (13:12) and who lived despite having a sword blow (13:14). It was only when Nero failed to materialize that the legend accrued the idea of a return from the dead. In chapter 17, now the beast was, is not and will soon ascend from the abyss (17:8). That both points along the tradition's trajectory are found in Revelation lend support to compositional layers within the text dating to different decades of the late first century (Friesen 136-37).

Kind regards,
Jonathan


Works cited:
Friesen, Steven J. Imperial Cults and the Apocalypse of John: Reading Revelation in the Ruins. Oxford University Press, 2001.
Klauck, Hans-Josef. "Do They Never Come Back? Nero Redivivus and the Apocalypse of John." The Catholic Biblical Quarterly 63.4 (2001) 683-98.
My theory is that early Christian belief influenced broader (non-Christian) superstition about the subject, rather than the other way around. I don't know that the Romans believed Nero would come back to life (the notion of resurrection was incredulous to them), but they believed instead that he had been preserved alive and was in hiding.
 

Arkycharlie

Active member
2 Thessalonians 2:8
Then that lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will eliminate with the breath of His mouth and bring to an end by the appearance of His coming;​

So, for those who believe that they understand what Scripture reveals about the rise of the antichrist, can you tell us where, according to Scripture, he will be destroyed?

Bonus question: Where in Scripture does it reveal his nationality?

PS
He is alive and on the rise as I type these words.
 

timtams

Member
The idea of Nero coming back as the Antichrist was very common in the early church, but I can't see that Revelation requires it.
 
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