New Age Economics

Thistle

Well-known member
As a non-American. I beleive I can see things that most Americans cannot see. Its like when your in a bad relationship and cant see and your friends are trying to warn you.

As a non-Democrat-and non Republican? I have no biased. I have sided with both on different maters. I believe I'm somewhere in the center.
I am an ally of the American people(and all earthly citizens). But a foe of the super rich, corruption and those who serve it. Which I beleive belong to both parties.
Both parties are hypocrites and corrupt. When one side does it, their supporters ignore it, but when the other side does it? They start screaming foul.lol

As an Agnostic Christian, i am somewhere inbetween the Christian fanatics and Aethiests. Again, my battle is with the fanatics on both sides. Why? They are filled with mis-guided hatred.....

I am against Capitalism and against Communism(which are infact very alike) the both serve the 1% and their crony followers.......Just liike the kings and their nobles....

I believe in Socialism. A system not supported by taxes. A system not supported by debt. A system that can make money debt and tax free to pay for things like welfare, pensions, health care, education, etc...

Now if the government has access to making money? There will be no need to collect taxes for revenue.
I'm sure people will say inflation, but as long as the money supply is managed properly, there will be no inflation.
Remove the capitalist middlemen who do nothing to get paid other than being rich and voila. The cost of living drops like a rock.

I believe the communism the left(and right) are ushering in is more like communist style socialism, like a dictatorship. This is very concerning. Our right for peaceful assembly is being taken away. Most likely due to a false flag operation.....Just one of the many ways they use to fool the public.

If i thought what they were ushering in was for the benefit of mankind I would be all for it, but I am skeptical.

According to the "great reset" they will default on all global debt. I'm actually for that. Been calling for that for quite some time.

But, they say there will be strings attached. They will say people will have to give up their property rights. Hmmmmmmm not sure I agree with that.
They will introduce a universal basic income. This is also something I have supported from the beginning, with technology taking over our jobs. There is just not enough jobs to go around. But will this universal income be backed by debt and taxes? I've been calling for the opposite.

The entire world will be run by a ruthless group of 1% ers. Forgive me if I am skeptical about their intentions....They will have a monopoly on all global industry.....

The left nor the right support Soviet style communism(or monopolies). So why are they allowing it to happen? So are politicians on both sides...Thoughts?
I'm confused. What is an agnostic Christian? Can you give me an example of Communism that is not Socialism? How can you defend property rights while you cancel everyone's government bonds? And even if the 1% really can replace the GDP of the world through automation, so that with the free money we are given we can buy the stuff they produce; whose to say the 1% don't screw up, and all the UBI citizens of the world [who have now forgotten how to produce anything] starve by reason of the extinction of their enterprising faculty?
 

Electric Skeptic

Well-known member
I'm confused. What is an agnostic Christian? Can you give me an example of Communism that is not Socialism? How can you defend property rights while you cancel everyone's government bonds? And even if the 1% really can replace the GDP of the world through automation, so that with the free money we are given we can buy the stuff they produce; whose to say the 1% don't screw up, and all the UBI citizens of the world [who have now forgotten how to produce anything] starve by reason of the extinction of their enterprising faculty?
An agnostic Christian is someone who believes in God, Christ, etc., but does not believe that it is possible to know whether a god exists.
 

wiseones2cents

Well-known member
An agnostic Christian is someone who believes in God, Christ, etc., but does not believe that it is possible to know whether a god exists.
Not exactly. Maybe I am Gnostic?lol

I am a person who believes in a higher power, Believes in Jesus and His words of wisdom. But do not believe in all that supernatural stuff like the flood, parting of the red sea, etc.. those are all exagerations by the part of scribes. I believe Old testament is full of exagerated stories and is 100% NOT infallible. I believe the Jews served a mortal god/lord/King, not a supernatural one.
 

Thistle

Well-known member
An agnostic Christian is someone who believes in God, Christ, etc., but does not believe that it is possible to know whether a god exists.
Faith is the assurance of things not seen. I have a great assurance that gravity will continue to operate for the rest of my life. To say that I don't "know" that is a distinction without a difference.
 

Thistle

Well-known member
Not exactly. Maybe I am Gnostic?lol

I am a person who believes in a higher power, Believes in Jesus and His words of wisdom. But do not believe in all that supernatural stuff like the flood, parting of the red sea, etc.. those are all exagerations by the part of scribes. I believe Old testament is full of exagerated stories and is 100% NOT infallible. I believe the Jews served a mortal god/lord/King, not a supernatural one.
Thanks for the clarification. We use the word differently, but I understand what you mean.
 

wiseones2cents

Well-known member
I'm confused. What is an agnostic Christian? Can you give me an example of Communism that is not Socialism? How can you defend property rights while you cancel everyone's government bonds? And even if the 1% really can replace the GDP of the world through automation, so that with the free money we are given we can buy the stuff they produce; whose to say the 1% don't screw up, and all the UBI citizens of the world [who have now forgotten how to produce anything] starve by reason of the extinction of their enterprising faculty?
Communism was a dictatorship that benefitted the few 1%. I believe in democratic Soicalism. That benefits all citizens.

What does government bonds have to do with property rights? Elaborate and I will explain.

Huh? I want to remove the 1% from power.

Exactly. Once we become dependant on the 1% we are screwed.......Comply or starve.
 

Authentic Nouveau

Well-known member
The communist elevator pitch is failing.
In Cuba a cab driver can easily clear 60 dollars a day
1 Only 5% have cars. Dirt poor socialism
2 Cab income is capitalism. It is not controlled income.
3 Rental car companies are not there.


Doctors make 45-60 dollars a month.
 

Authentic Nouveau

Well-known member
Communism was a dictatorship that benefitted the few 1%. I believe in democratic Soicalism. That benefits all citizens.

What does government bonds have to do with property rights? Elaborate and I will explain.

Huh? I want to remove the 1% from power.

Exactly. Once we become dependant on the 1% we are screwed.......Comply or starve.
That is why socialism never works. The 1% have to apply a lot of brutal force to get people to turn in their wealth andassets to central planning.
 

wiseones2cents

Well-known member
That is why socialism never works. The 1% have to apply a lot of brutal force to get people to turn in their wealth andassets to central planning.
We are talking about capitalism. What happens when the market switches to automation and robotics? Human labour will be replaced. How are you going to support yourself if you own no significant piece of land and dont know how to farm? Thus a iniversal income. But then who is going to pay for it? Are the robots going to pay taxes?lol
 

Authentic Nouveau

Well-known member
We are talking about capitalism. What happens when the market switches to automation and robotics? Human labour will be replaced. How are you going to support yourself if you own no significant piece of land and dont know how to farm? Thus a iniversal income. But then who is going to pay for it? Are the robots going to pay taxes?lol
You are stubborn against learning economics. Our manufacturing jobs are under 20% of employment. Most industries are service industries.

We need to remind people that all the stupid socialism cases fail. Cuba is a failure. It would have been even uglier failure had they not gotten aid from Russia. Cuba got cheap gasoline from Soviet Venezuela. That has deteriorated and dried up.
Lazy and greedy want money from the high achievers.
 

wiseones2cents

Well-known member
Yawn.
The communist elevator pitch is failing.
In Cuba a cab driver can easily clear 60 dollars a day
1 Only 5% have cars. Dirt poor socialism
2 Cab income is capitalism. It is not controlled income.
3 Rental car companies are not there.


Doctors make 45-60 dollars a month.
Defelcting again. What does the fact that cabs make more money than doctors have to do with quality of health care and doctors get paid well??

Cuba's main income I would imagine is Tourism. I'd also imagine that cab drivers are probably part of the crony communist system. They pay a tax to get their license and away they go.

Doctors that cater to foreign patients also get paid more, since they are charged more than the public for service.

Hmmmmmm dense populations on small islands limit cars. How many Islands have you been to with gridlock?lol Do you even need a car? I'd imagine transportation is free or cheap in a socialist economy. :)

I'm still waiting for you to answer if America should give the Queen her land back that they stole?lol
 

wiseones2cents

Well-known member
You are stubborn against learning economics. Our manufacturing jobs are under 20% of employment. Most industries are service industries.

We need to remind people that all the stupid socialism cases fail. Cuba is a failure. It would have been even uglier failure had they not gotten aid from Russia. Cuba got cheap gasoline from Soviet Venezuela. That has deteriorated and dried up.
Lazy and greedy want money from the high achievers.
Service? You mean as government jobs or service as in servers working at McDonalds, the country's second biggest employer after the government?lol

Or service as in selling and logistics for all the stuff you are getting from communist China?

Sounds like Enron is doing the accounting in the US government.LOL

I can't remember what giant corporation claimed there is more money in trading stocks than there is in manufacturing. Now can you imagine if everyone bought and sold stocks and no one manufactured?lol

Someone has to be manufacturing somewhere. Capitalism needs to make money off the backs of the working class somewhere.
 

wiseones2cents

Well-known member
Is that why China will become the major economy in the not too distant future?
Man if I was a capitalist? I'd be licking my chops at China's 1.6 Billion and India's 1 Billion plus consumers........America and their measily 360 million would end up like England. The rich(who invested in China) and poor(who couldnt afford to invest) divide would be massive......

If the poor revolt, they will just gun them down, or move to another place and leave them to their own demise.
 

Thistle

Well-known member
Communism was a dictatorship that benefitted the few 1%. I believe in democratic Soicalism. That benefits all citizens.
According to Vladimir Lenin replied, "Communism is Socialism in a hurry." Can you name an example where Socialism works as you describe?
What does government bonds have to do with property rights? Elaborate and I will explain.
You and I both have $1,000, and you buy $1,000 worth of ice cream, and I buy a $1,000 government bond. The government cancels their debt, now you have $1,000 of ice cream, and I have nothing. Is that how socialism is supposed to work?
Huh? I want to remove the 1% from power.
So you want the Stalin Socialism not the Hitler Socialism. Neither one worked.
Exactly. Once we become dependant on the 1% we are screwed.......Comply or starve.
What percent do you figure are running Venezuela?
 

wiseones2cents

Well-known member
According to Vladimir Lenin replied, "Communism is Socialism in a hurry." Can you name an example where Socialism works as you describe?

Sparta for one. I've named others but most socialist countries still under the thumb of the capitalist empire. When they try to free themselves they wage war on them.

This is a good quote that describes the empires. Including American.

Micah 3:5
This is what the Lord says: “As for the prophets who lead my people astray, they proclaim ‘peace’ if they have something to eat, but prepare to wage war against anyone who refuses to feed them.

You and I both have $1,000, and you buy $1,000 worth of ice cream, and I buy a $1,000 government bond. The government cancels their debt, now you have $1,000 of ice cream, and I have nothing. Is that how socialism is supposed to work?
I think thats called bankruptcy, it happens all the time. People lose money(someone else gains it). Even Stocks drop like a rock. Is it fair? Its part of the risk. :)


So you want the Stalin Socialism not the Hitler Socialism. Neither one worked.
I want MY democratic Socialism.

What percent do you figure are running Venezuela?
Not sure but Chavez was loved by his people, especially those that suffered from the calapse of the capitalist funded economy.
 

Electric Skeptic

Well-known member
Faith is the assurance of things not seen. I have a great assurance that gravity will continue to operate for the rest of my life. To say that I don't "know" that is a distinction without a difference.
No, it's not. Many Christians claim they know; agnostic Christians do not make that claim.
 

Thistle

Well-known member
Sparta for one.
It collapsed. But it was a matriarchy where property passed from generation to generation through the women. How is that socialism?
I've named others but most socialist countries still under the thumb of the capitalist empire. When they try to free themselves they wage war on them.
If I have the means of production and the government takes it, how am I thereby freed?
This is a good quote that describes the empires. Including American.

Micah 3:5
This is what the Lord says: “As for the prophets who lead my people astray, they proclaim ‘peace’ if they have something to eat, but prepare to wage war against anyone who refuses to feed them.
America is a net food exporter and a net energy exporter. That citation in no way describes America.
I think thats called bankruptcy,
No it's called theft. The government did not have to lie on their bond covenant to me. They had an absolute obligation to keep their commitment. They took my $1,000 I gave in exchange for their promise, and having collected my money, they refuse to keep their promise. Would it be okay if they government took your $1,000 of food that you purchased?
it happens all the time. People lose money(someone else gains it). Even Stocks drop like a rock.
Stocks are a risk asset, and everyone knows it. US Bonds are a no risk asset, and everyone knows that too. Nothing can be less alike.
Is it fair? Its part of the risk. :)
There is no risk in a no risk asset. You by a no risk asset when you demand your money back plus the no risk rate of return. If you are willing to take a risk greater than zero then you stand to make a better return.
I want MY democratic Socialism.
Hitler and Stalin gave everyone a chance to vote to stop voting too. It's all voluntary, until it's not voluntary any more.
Not sure but Chavez was loved by his people,
They think he is swell, at least those who haven't passed out from starvation.
especially those that suffered from the calapse of the capitalist funded economy.
There was no collapse under capitalism.
 
Top