No sacrifice from Hypostatic Jesus

I believe Jesus has one nature. But whereas God created a human spirit and soul for each of us, God himself as the Word became the human spirit and soul of Jesus.

To say someone had two natures would simply be a new type of nature. So you would still have one nature IMO. In other words, if there was such a thing as a dog-cat, you would not say it has a dog nature and a cat nature. Rather, it has a dog-cat nature making it one of a kind. Not another dog and another cat.

P.S. Here is an overview of what I believe...

For this creation, YHWH God (the only one who transcends all creations) determined to create a universe with a kingdom of redeemed humans (living souls) for his glory where he would reign as a living soul himself. The Scriptures describe how God would accomplish his plan. In an instant, transcendent God (called God the Father) created the supernatural and space-time of this universe and also became immanent as a spirit (called the Spirit of God) and in the form of a living soul (called the Word of God) with a glorious body. God the Father then created all things within the universe by the power of the Spirit of God commanded by the Word of God. But whereas God created a human spirit and soul for each of us, God himself as the Word became the human spirit and soul of Jesus. At his conception, Jesus' glorious body was changed to a mortal body to be made like us so he could make reconciliation for our sins. At his resurrection, Jesus' mortal body was changed back to a glorious body and he will also give each of his elect a glorious body when he returns to reign in his kingdom forever.
 
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Norga

New member
I believe Jesus has one nature. But whereas God created a human spirit and soul for each of us, God himself as the Word became the human spirit and soul of Jesus.

To say someone had two natures would simply be a new type of nature. So you would still have one nature IMO. In other words, if there was such a thing as a dog-cat, you would not say it has a dog nature and a cat nature. Rather, it has a dog-cat nature making it one of a kind. Not another dog and another cat.

P.S. Here is an overview of what I believe...

For this creation, YHWH God (the only one who transcends all creations) determined to create a universe with a kingdom of redeemed humans (living souls) for his glory where he would reign as a living soul himself. The Scriptures describe how God would accomplish his plan. In an instant, transcendent God (called God the Father) created the supernatural and space-time of this universe and also became immanent as a spirit (called the Spirit of God) and in the form of a living soul (called the Word of God) with a glorious body. God the Father then created all things within the universe by the power of the Spirit of God commanded by the Word of God. But whereas God created a human spirit and soul for each of us, God himself as the Word became the human spirit and soul of Jesus. At his conception, Jesus' glorious body was changed to a mortal body to be made like us so he could make reconciliation for our sins. At his resurrection, Jesus' mortal body was changed back to a glorious body and he will also give each of his elect a glorious body when he returns to reign in his kingdom forever.
. Hypostatic Jesus was a new species altogether-Godman
Are you Modalist?
 

Stephen

Active member

If you believe that Jesus needed to be God to save us from our sins, there really isn't a path in which that is true when the question is thought about more deeply.

It becomes a question of "what" died for you sins versus "who" died for your sins. And the "what" part isn't the "God" part.
 

Bob Carabbio

Active member
If you believe that Jesus needed to be God to save us from our sins, there really isn't a path in which that is true when the question is thought about more deeply.

It becomes a question of "what" died for you sins versus "who" died for your sins. And the "what" part isn't the "God" part.
Simplest thing in the world!!!! The Sacrifice for SIN had to be a PERFECT HUMAN MAN. nothing more. the blood of a cow could "HIDE" SIn for a season, but only PERFECT Human Blood could cleanse it. Perfect humans have always been a bit hard to find. There was only one-
 

Stephen

Active member
Simplest thing in the world!!!! The Sacrifice for SIN had to be a PERFECT HUMAN MAN. nothing more. the blood of a cow could "HIDE" SIn for a season, but only PERFECT Human Blood could cleanse it. Perfect humans have always been a bit hard to find. There was only one-

Yes it is Bob. Yet some insist on mucking it up. They deny that Jesus is a "perfect human, nothing more" but rather say "that without Jesus being both God and man, he could not make a sacrifice of sufficient value to please God the Father. " (https://carm.org/jesus-christ/is-jesus-god)

It seems that we are in agreement rejecting the latter and embracing the former.
 

herman

Member
I believe Jesus has one nature. But whereas God created a human spirit and soul for each of us, God himself as the Word became the human spirit and soul of Jesus.

To say someone had two natures would simply be a new type of nature. So you would still have one nature IMO. In other words, if there was such a thing as a dog-cat, you would not say it has a dog nature and a cat nature. Rather, it has a dog-cat nature making it one of a kind. Not another dog and another cat.

P.S. Here is an overview of what I believe...

For this creation, YHWH God (the only one who transcends all creations) determined to create a universe with a kingdom of redeemed humans (living souls) for his glory where he would reign as a living soul himself. The Scriptures describe how God would accomplish his plan. In an instant, transcendent God (called God the Father) created the supernatural and space-time of this universe and also became immanent as a spirit (called the Spirit of God) and in the form of a living soul (called the Word of God) with a glorious body. God the Father then created all things within the universe by the power of the Spirit of God commanded by the Word of God. But whereas God created a human spirit and soul for each of us, God himself as the Word became the human spirit and soul of Jesus. At his conception, Jesus' glorious body was changed to a mortal body to be made like us so he could make reconciliation for our sins. At his resurrection, Jesus' mortal body was changed back to a glorious body and he will also give each of his elect a glorious body when he returns to reign in his kingdom forever.
Since you believe that Jesus Christ is a man only with only one nature, i.e human being then please explain what the Apostle Paul stated at Philippians 2:7-8? "but emptied Himself, taking the form of a bond-servant, and being made in the likeness of men. Verse 8, And being found in appearance as a man, He humbled Himself by becoming obedient to the point of death, even death on a cross."

Moreover, since Jesus is a 100% human being why does the writer of Hebrews at Hebrews 5:7 say, "In the days of His flesh." Or at Hebrews 10:5, "Therefore, when He comes into the world, He says, "Sacrifice and offering Thou hast not desired, But a Body Thou hast prepared for Me."

So to sum up! You say Jesus is a 100% human man with only one nature, that is human being. Why is it regarding the verses I posted have to explain this man Jesus becoming a human being and had to have a body prepared for Him?

In Him
herman
 

Newbirth

Member
Total rubbish and not in the scripture. Here are some questions for you, did a human being die to pay for your sins? or did God die to pay for your sins? In your chart, Jesus is nature B Clearly Jesus is not God. Also, person A is not God. if your whole argument is to prove Jesus is God it fails you proved him to be flesh...if it is to prove God is a trinity it fails also because. Person A is not nature B but nature B must be a person also since Nature B is (Jesus) who died.
 

Bob Carabbio

Active member
Yes it is Bob. Yet some insist on mucking it up. They deny that Jesus is a "perfect human, nothing more".
And SOME fools think the earth is flat. Whether you or your pathetic CULT don't believe that Jesus is the incarnation of the WORD who is God, and that in Jesus dwells the fullness of the Godhead bodi;y or not couldn't be less important. Jesus could only BE the Perfect SIN OFFERING because of who He is,
 

Newbirth

Member
And SOME fools think the earth is flat.
And some fools think that the earth is a spinning ball in space. With curving water.
Whether you or your pathetic CULT don't believe that Jesus is the incarnation of the WORD who is God, and that in Jesus dwells the fullness of the Godhead bodi;y or not couldn't be less important.
Whether you or your pathetic CULT don't believe that Jesus is the Son of God couldn't be less important.
Jesus could only BE the Perfect SIN OFFERING because of who He is,
Jesus could only BE the Perfect SIN OFFERING because of who his Father is.
John 5:30
I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me.
John 5:19
Then answered Jesus and said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do: for what things soever he doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise.
 

Newbirth

Member
Total rubbish and not in the scripture. Here are some questions for you, did a human being die to pay for your sins? or did God die to pay for your sins? In your chart, Jesus is nature B Clearly Jesus is not God. Also, person A is not God. if your whole argument is to prove Jesus is God it fails you proved him to be flesh...if it is to prove God is a trinity it fails also because. Person A is not nature B but nature B must be a person also since Nature B is (Jesus) who died.
Attachment is nonsense
 

Stephen

Active member
And SOME fools think the earth is flat. Whether you or your pathetic CULT don't believe that Jesus is the incarnation of the WORD who is God, and that in Jesus dwells the fullness of the Godhead bodi;y or not couldn't be less important. Jesus could only BE the Perfect SIN OFFERING because of who He is,

I see, so you retract you belief that he "had to be a PERFECT HUMAN MAN. nothing more", but now believe he must be God.
 
Attachment is nonsense
Jesus is God
Then said I, Woe is me! for I am undone; because I am a man of unclean lips, and I dwell in the midst of a people of unclean lips: for mine eyes have seen the King, the LORD of hosts.

It says right here who Jesus is. GOD MY SAVIOUR
Acknowledged by Mary, Elisabeth the mother of the Baptist and John himself.

42 And she spake out with a loud voice, and said, Blessed art thou among women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb.
43 And whence is this to me, that the mother of my Lord should come to me?
44 For, lo, as soon as the voice of thy salutation sounded in mine ears, the babe leaped in my womb for joy.
45 And blessed is she that believed: for there shall be a performance of those things which were told her from the Lord.
46 ¶ And Mary said, My soul doth magnify the Lord,
47 And my spirit hath rejoiced in God my Saviour.
 
I believe Jesus has one nature. But whereas God created a human spirit and soul for each of us, God himself as the Word became the human spirit and soul of Jesus.
Please explain the distinction between soul and spirit and where I can find the scriptures from which you draw your conclusions. Thanks.
 
Please explain the distinction between soul and spirit and where I can find the scriptures from which you draw your conclusions. Thanks.

The scriptures distinguish between spirit and soul here...

1 Thessalonians 5:23... And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Hebrews 4:12... For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

I am not sure the Bible tells us the distinction.
 

Newbirth

Member
Jesus is God
Then said I, Woe is me! for I am undone; because I am a man of unclean lips, and I dwell in the midst of a people of unclean lips: for mine eyes have seen the King, the LORD of hosts.
If you are using this verse to prove Jesus is God then you are proving that Jesus is a liar. Here is Jesus saying that he is the only man who has seen God.
John 1:18
No man hath seen God at any time, the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him.
It says right here who Jesus is. GOD MY SAVIOUR
Acknowledged by Mary, Elisabeth the mother of the Baptist and John himself.

42 And she spake out with a loud voice, and said, Blessed art thou among women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb.
43 And whence is this to me, that the mother of my Lord should come to me?
44 For, lo, as soon as the voice of thy salutation sounded in mine ears, the babe leaped in my womb for joy.
45 And blessed is she that believed: for there shall be a performance of those things which were told her from the Lord.
46 ¶ And Mary said, My soul doth magnify the Lord,
47 And my spirit hath rejoiced in God my Saviour.
Are you saying that she was rejoicing because God was in her belly. The angel did not say God was in her belly.
 
If you are using this verse to prove Jesus is God then you are proving that Jesus is a liar. Here is Jesus saying that he is the only man who has seen God.
John 1:18
No man hath seen God at any time, the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him.

Are you saying that she was rejoicing because God was in her belly. The angel did not say God was in her belly.
You obviously don’t know Jesus.
The Lord came down from Heaven and became a human for us.

John was speaking of not knowing the Father, Jesus came to reveal Him.
So who did they see in the OT.
Answer is:
John 1 the WORD

Exodus 24:10 (KJV)
And they saw the God of Israel: and [there was] under his feet as it were a paved work of a sapphire stone, and as it were the body of heaven in [his] clearness.

Exodus 24:11 (KJV)
And upon the nobles of the children of Israel he laid not his hand: also they saw God, and did eat and drink.

Numbers 24:4 (KJV)
He hath said, which heard the words of God, which saw the vision of the Almighty, falling [into a trance], but having his eyes open:

Numbers 24:16 (KJV)
He hath said, which heard the words of God, and knew the knowledge of the most High, [which] saw the vision of the Almighty, falling [into a trance], but having his eyes open:

Ezekiel 1:1 (KJV)
Now it came to pass in the thirtieth year, in the fourth [month], in the fifth [day] of the month, as I [was] among the captives by the river of Chebar, [that] the heavens were opened, and I saw visions of God.

Ezekiel 10:20 (KJV)
This [is] the living creature that I saw under the God of Israel by the river of Chebar; and I knew that they [were] the cherubims.

Judges 13:22 (KJV)
And Manoah said unto his wife, We shall surely die, because we have seen God.

Then said I, Woe is me! for I am undone; because I am a man of unclean lips, and I dwell in the midst of a people of unclean lips: for mine eyes have seen the King, the LORD of hosts.
 
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