Open call - Questions and comments welcome

[Aaron32]

Often, I am told because I reconcile my beliefs with scripture, that my belief are not “Mormon”, and that I should not misrepresent my beliefs as being ‘ok’ with the Church.

If there are any beliefs I have posted that you feel don’t “jive” with Mormonism, and thereby mid-represent/whitewash the beliefs of my Church.

I will Zoom call my bishop and/or Stake President to discuss with them and record the video.

Here’s your chance. List anything I’ve stated, and we will see who is telling the truth and who is not.

Ready...set...go...

 

[brotherofJared]

Often, I am told because I reconcile my beliefs with scripture, that my belief are not “Mormon”, and that I should not misrepresent my beliefs as being ‘ok’ with the Church.

I get this too and I know exactly who makes these claims. What it boils down to is this, If your explanations don't match my (the critic's - who used to be a member) explanations, then your explanations are not "Mormon" beliefs which is a ludicrous statement.

Our critic gets to define what we believe which is absurd but they still make the claims as if they are the standard by which we must abide.

Ready...set...go...

Crickets... Imagine that.

 

[Aaron32]

I get this too and I know exactly who makes these claims. What it boils down to is this, If your explanations don't match my (the critic's - who used to be a member) explanations, then your explanations are not "Mormon" beliefs which is a ludicrous statement.

Our critic gets to define what we believe which is absurd but they still make the claims as if they are the standard by which we must abide.

Crickets... Imagine that.

Bingo!

 

[Theo1689]

I get this too and I know exactly who makes these claims. What it boils down to is this, If your explanations don't match my (the critic's - who used to be a member) explanations, then your explanations are not "Mormon" beliefs which is a ludicrous statement.

Our critic gets to define what we believe which is absurd but they still make the claims as if they are the standard by which we must abide.

Of course, yours is a completely fallacious argument.

If an ex-Mormon doesn't understand Mormonism, then there's no reason to think that a CURRENT Mormon understands Mormonism any better (since ex-Mormons used to be Mormons).

Especially since we have seen here first-hand that even current Mormons can't agree on what Mormonism teaches.

 

[Redeemed]

Often, I am told because I reconcile my beliefs with scripture, that my belief are not “Mormon”, and that I should not misrepresent my beliefs as being ‘ok’ with the Church.

If there are any beliefs I have posted that you feel don’t “jive” with Mormonism, and thereby mid-represent/whitewash the beliefs of my Church.

I will Zoom call my bishop and/or Stake President to discuss with them and record the video.

Here’s your chance. List anything I’ve stated, and we will see who is telling the truth and who is not.

Ready...set...go...

This should be awesome thanks for coming up with it. I don't have a question about anything You have stated in regards to Mormonism. But I was wondering if I could just ask a question about one of the things I'm studying at the moment on Mormonism?

For instance is it still taught in Mormonism that Heavenly Father was once a man?

 

[Redeemed]

What about the Adam – God theory? Is Adam God according to Mormonism or does God give Adam the ability to act on God's behalf? Like in creation. Or since were on Adam could you clarify Adam also been known as Michael the Archangel and The Ancient of Days?

 

[Aaron32]

What about the Adam – God theory? Is Adam God according to Mormonism or does God give Adam the ability to act on God's behalf? Like in creation. Or since were on Adam could you clarify Adam also been known as Michael the Archangel and The Ancient of Days?

Consider it done. Things are a little crazy now so it maybe after the holidays, but I’ll definitely make it happen. In the meantime, feel free to add as many questions as you like.

 

[brotherofJared]

This should be awesome thanks for coming up with it. I don't have a question about anything You have stated in regards to Mormonism. But I was wondering if I could just ask a question about one of the things I'm studying at the moment on Mormonism?

For instance is it still taught in Mormonism that Heavenly Father was once a man?

No. Not once a man. He's still a man, just like Jesus is still a man.

 

[brotherofJared]

What about the Adam – God theory? Is Adam God according to Mormonism or does God give Adam the ability to act on God's behalf? Like in creation. Or since were on Adam could you clarify Adam also been known as Michael the Archangel and The Ancient of Days?

Adam is the Ancient of Days spoken of in Daniel. We believe his is Michael the archangel and that he personally was involved with the formation of all creations on this earth. We don't know what he did, but he participated is some way.

As far as Adam being a god, he is a god the same as all of us are gods. He isn't God the Father and he isn't our Savior, but if Adam is the Ancient of days (the title fits him better since he is far older than Christ is), then He is the one who will turn to keys to the kingdom over to God after all God's enemies have been destroyed.

 

[Theo1689]

No. Not once a man. He's still a man, just like Jesus is still a man.

Then you're claiming that Joseph Smith, was wrong:

"These ideas are incomprehensible to some, but they are simple. It is the first principle of the gospel to know for a certainty the character of God, and to know that we may converse with Him as one man converses with another, and that He was once a man like us; yea, that God himself, the Father of us all, dwelt on an earth, the same as Jesus Christ Himself did; and I will show it from the Bible."
-- Joseph Smith, The King Follett Sermon, "Ensign", April 1971

 

[Bonnie]

Adam is the Ancient of Days spoken of in Daniel. We believe his is Michael the archangel and that he personally was involved with the formation of all creations on this earth. We don't know what he did, but he participated is some way.

The Ancient of Days is God Almighty, more specifically. God the Father.

As far as Adam being a god, he is a god the same as all of us are gods. He isn't God the Father and he isn't our Savior, but if Adam is the Ancient of days (the title fits him better since he is far older than Christ is), then He is the one who will turn to keys to the kingdom over to God after all God's enemies have been destroyed.

Wrong!! Jesus is the eternal Word of God, Who IS and WAS God, and predates everyone and everything, since all that has been made, Adam included, was created by the Word of God!

God CREATED Adam from the dust of the ground...That was his beginning of existence. Man is NOT eternal--God is,

 

[brotherofJared]

Then you're claiming that Joseph Smith, was wrong:

"These ideas are incomprehensible to some, but they are simple. It is the first principle of the gospel to know for a certainty the character of God, and to know that we may converse with Him as one man converses with another, and that He was once a man like us; yea, that God himself, the Father of us all, dwelt on an earth, the same as Jesus Christ Himself did; and I will show it from the Bible."
-- Joseph Smith, The King Follett Sermon, "Ensign", April 1971

Thank you for proving you don't know what you're reading.

 

[brotherofJared]

The Ancient of Days is God Almighty, more specifically. God the Father.

Prove it.

 

[Magdalena]

Thank you for proving you don't know what you're reading.

That is what it says.

 

[Magdalena]

Prove it.

More to the point, since this is the mormonism forum, prove that Adam is the Ancient of Days.

 

[kpasa]

I get this too and I know exactly who makes these claims. What it boils down to is this, If your explanations don't match my (the critic's - who used to be a member) explanations, then your explanations are not "Mormon" beliefs which is a ludicrous statement.

Our critic gets to define what we believe which is absurd but they still make the claims as if they are the standard by which we must abide.

Crickets... Imagine that.

Did not one of your former prophets state that the jesus of which Mormons speak was not the same Jesus of which many Christians speak; or words to that effect? This was an overt admission that Mormons and many Christians don't believe in the same deities on any level. While Mormons claim to be living according to the commandments of their jesus, they fail to live up to some of the commandments of the Christian Jesus. We don't believe in the same deities. The Judeo-Christian Godhead is transcendent, while the Mormon deities are merely lower forms of intelligences confined to this universe. Simply put, there are some huge differences in our belief systems.

 

[Theo1689]

Did not one of your former prophets state that the jesus of which Mormons speak was not the same Jesus of which many Christians speak; or words to that effect? This was an overt admission that Mormons and many Christians don't believe in the same deities on any level.

"... do not believe in the traditional Christ. No, I don't. The traditional Christ of whom they speak is not the Christ of whom I speak. For the Christ of whom I speak has been revealed in this the Dispensation of the Fulness of Times. He, together with His Father, appeared to the boy Joseph Smith in the year 1820, and when Joseph left the grove that day, he knew more of the nature of God than all the learned ministers of the gospel of the ages."
-- Gordon B. Hinckley, "President", LDS Church (1995-2008)

 

[brotherofJared]

Did not one of your former prophets state that the jesus of which Mormons speak was not the same Jesus of which many Christians speak; or words to that effect?

Yep. If you didn't get the message, I'll explain it to you. The Jesus you worship isn't the Jesus of the Bible. That was the point he was making.

While Mormons claim to be living according to the commandments of their jesus, they fail to live up to some of the commandments of the Christian Jesus.

I believe that is a false statement. Jesus said to follow him. He taught us to love one another and to keep the commandments. That's what we do. That's what's taught in the Bible. If you're complaining that we're doing more than what is taught in the Bible, then I'm sorry, but I don't see where that's bad, evil, or wrong.

We don't believe in the same deities.

I think we believe in the same being. But we disagree one what he taught which is the problem in all Christianity. Everyone has a different idea of what he taught and so there are now thousands of Christian religions none of which teach the same thing. We believe that you all teach things that the Bible doesn't teach, like faith alone salvation. Like, the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost are the same being and from there, the teachings that are present in the Bible that you all teach incorrectly just get worse.

The Judeo-Christian Godhead is transcendent, while the Mormon deities are merely lower forms of intelligences confined to this universe.

Do you mean in space and time? LOL. Okay, but like other things that you all teach incorrectly, this one isn't found in the Bible either. It's a made-up belief to make God unreachable. That's very Helenistic.

Simply put, there are some huge differences in our belief systems.

Oh, without a doubt there are. But my post was about the arrogance of non-members who think they know what we believe better than we do.

 

[Theo1689]

Oh, without a doubt there are. But my post was about the arrogance of non-members who think they know what we believe better than we do.

Why is that considered "arrogance"?

And if it is, then isn't it likewise "arrogance" for Mormons to think they know what Mormonism teaches better than non-Mormons do?

I mean, if we have to people, a "non-member" who used to be a Mormon for 30 years, and a current Mormon who's been member for 5 years, which person would you expect to be more knowledgeable about Mormonism?

 

[Bonnie]

Why is that considered "arrogance"?

And if it is, then isn't it likewise "arrogance" for Mormons to think they know what Mormonism teaches better than non-Mormons do?

I mean, if we have to people, a "non-member" who used to be a Mormon for 30 years, and a current Mormon who's been member for 5 years, which person would you expect to be more knowledgeable about Mormonism?

Isn't it arrogant for Mormons to think they know what their church teaches better than their own church does? Look at the times we have posted stuff from lds.org, to prove what their church teaches, only to be told that was wrong! I can think of at least 3 examples, possibly 4...after Mormons on here have told us that if we want to know what their church teaches we should go to its official website. So, we do, but they still say it's wrong!

Darned if we do,darned we don't....