Paul quoted Jesus about the rapture(1 Thes 4-5 quotes Matt 24)

[Truther]

37 But as the days of Noah were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,

39 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

THE CATCHING AWAY OF THE SAINTS
40 Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

41 Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

42 Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.

THE THIEF
43 But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up.

44 Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh....

DRUNKEN SERVANT

...49 And shall begin to smite his fellowservants, and to eat and drink with the drunken;..


NOW CHECK THIS OUT

15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord(QUOTING JESUS' WORDS), that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.

16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

THE CATCHING AWAY OF THE SAINTS

17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words.

5 But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you.

THE THIEF

2 For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.

3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.

4 But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.

5 Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness.

6 Therefore let us not sleep, as do others; but let us watch and be sober.

THE DRUNKEN SERVANT

7 For they that sleep sleep in the night; and they that be drunken are drunken in the night.

 

[Truther]

Paul had no special revelation here.

He just commented on the Matt 24 dialogue that everyone was talking about.

He understood the "one taken" was a saint being taken.

 

[shroom]

37 But as the days of Noah were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,

39 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

THE CATCHING AWAY OF THE SAINTS
40 Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

Paul had no special revelation here.

He just commented on the Matt 24 dialogue that everyone was talking about.

He understood the "one taken" was a saint being taken.

The problem is that Jesus said "as in the days of Noah." During the flood, the evil people were the ones taken away. Matt 24:40 is not the "catching away of the saints," it's the taking away of the evil people. That will happen at Christ's return to earth at Armageddon. The unsaved will be taken away, the saved will remain and be allowed into the kingdom. The rapture of the Christian church will precede the trib. What Paul shared in 1 Cor 15:51ff and 1 Thes 4:13ff was indeed new.

 

[Truther]

The problem is that Jesus said "as in the days of Noah." During the flood, the evil people were the ones taken away. Matt 24:40 is not the "catching away of the saints," it's the taking away of the evil people. That will happen at Christ's return to earth at Armageddon. The unsaved will be taken away, the saved will remain and be allowed into the kingdom. The rapture of the Christian church will precede the trib. What Paul shared in 1 Cor 15:51ff and 1 Thes 4:13ff was indeed new.

There are multiple "takings" in the Bible.

Some are taken by judgement and others are taken by God.

Matt 25 is the Spirit filled 5 virgins taken and 5 non filled left.

We will all be taken somewhere too.

The context is that Paul was quoting Jesus in Matt 24, per 1 Thes 4-5.

They both speak in this order...catching away...thief...drunken servant.

This is not a coincidence, since Paul says "this we say by the word of the Lord".

 

[Truther]

Paul did not say, "this I say by God's word revealed specifically to me".

As eschatology teachers tell folks, "Paul had a special revelation".

The fact is, everyone knew about what Jesus explained per Matt 24 in the first century church, even before Paul was converted.

 

[shroom]

The context is that Paul was quoting Jesus in Matt 24, per 1 Thes 4-5.

Disagree.

Paul did not say, "this I say by God's word revealed specifically to me".

As eschatology teachers tell folks.

1 Cor 15:51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,

The rapture of the Christian church was part of God's secret, which was not known about prior to its being revealed to Paul.

Eph 3:
2 If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you-ward:
3 How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words,
4 Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)
5 Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;

 

[Truther]

Disagree.


1 Cor 15:51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,

The rapture of the Christian church was part of God's secret, which was not known about prior to its being revealed to Paul.

Eph 3:
2 If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you-ward:
3 How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words,
4 Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)
5 Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;

He was explaining the transfomation of mortality into immortality.

he was not introducing the catching away.

....15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord.

We, as in everyone.

The word of the Lord as in something Jesus said to everyone.

 

[shroom]

He was explaining the transfomation of mortality into immortality.

he was not introducing the catching away.

....15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord.

We, as in everyone.

The word of the Lord as in something Jesus said to everyone.

Thanks. I disagree.

 

[Truther]

Thanks. I disagree.

You are welcome. Thanks for jumping in