Perhaps someone can explain evolution to me.

SteveB

Well-known member
This website is a highly detailed image of a eukaryotic cell.

Transformation of the Cellular Landscape through a Eukaryotic Cell, by Evan Ingersoll Ingersoll Gael McGill ~ Digizyme's Custom Maya Molecular Software Biología Al Instante

 

rossum

Active member
This website is a highly detailed image of a eukaryotic cell.
Why do you start there? The eukaryotic cell is the result of endosymbiosis. Better to start by looking at the origins of the separate symbionts before looking at how they combined.

Evolution is a developmental process, usually working from less complex to more complex. You are starting at the complex end. It is easier to explain it by starting at the less complex end.
 

Temujin

Well-known member
Why do you start there? The eukaryotic cell is the result of endosymbiosis. Better to start by looking at the origins of the separate symbionts before looking at how they combined.

Evolution is a developmental process, usually working from less complex to more complex. You are starting at the complex end. It is easier to explain it by starting at the less complex end.
But that would defeat the object, which is to say "Look how complex nature is! Therefore God."
 

TeabagSalad

Active member
This website is a highly detailed image of a eukaryotic cell.

Transformation of the Cellular Landscape through a Eukaryotic Cell, by Evan Ingersoll Ingersoll Gael McGill ~ Digizyme's Custom Maya Molecular Software Biología Al Instante


If you are genuinely interested in learning about Evolution then I am willing to teach you some basics, on the proviso that you agree to honestly answer any questions that I ask which are related to me teaching you the basics of evolution. And that you agree to read and attempt to understand the content of any links to articles which I may post (which also relate to me teaching the basics of evoltion).

Do you agree?
 

Mr Laurier

Well-known member
This website is a highly detailed image of a eukaryotic cell.

Transformation of the Cellular Landscape through a Eukaryotic Cell, by Evan Ingersoll Ingersoll Gael McGill ~ Digizyme's Custom Maya Molecular Software Biología Al Instante

DNA self replicates.
Sometimes there is a copy error.
Sometimes that copy error is a good thing.
 

Temujin

Well-known member
This website is a highly detailed image of a eukaryotic cell.

Transformation of the Cellular Landscape through a Eukaryotic Cell, by Evan Ingersoll Ingersoll Gael McGill ~ Digizyme's Custom Maya Molecular Software Biología Al Instante


Transcript of a conversation with Sir Paul Nurse. There are others in the series.
 

SteveB

Well-known member
If you are genuinely interested in learning about Evolution then I am willing to teach you some basics, on the proviso that you agree to honestly answer any questions that I ask which are related to me teaching you the basics of evolution. And that you agree to read and attempt to understand the content of any links to articles which I may post (which also relate to me teaching the basics of evoltion).

Do you agree?
start explaining.
Because when I look at the picture of this cell, I find myself bordering on laughing hysterically when I consider people actually think this cell evolved from nothing.
So.... by all means.
 

SteveB

Well-known member
Why do you start there? The eukaryotic cell is the result of endosymbiosis. Better to start by looking at the origins of the separate symbionts before looking at how they combined.

Evolution is a developmental process, usually working from less complex to more complex. You are starting at the complex end. It is easier to explain it by starting at the less complex end.
I start with this picture of this cell because of its complexity.
As I actually started before the cosmos came into existence, and people ranted about that, I have no problem with this.
 

SteveB

Well-known member
DNA self replicates.
Sometimes there is a copy error.
Sometimes that copy error is a good thing.
I guess that would explain why I have cancer.
Ironically, cancer increases cells, which means it becomes increasingly complex, and the end result is death.
So...... why is that a good thing?
 

Mr Laurier

Well-known member
I guess that would explain why I have cancer.
Ironically, cancer increases cells, which means it becomes increasingly complex, and the end result is death.
So...... why is that a good thing?
Nope. It does not explain why you have cancer.
Nothing ironic about it. Cancer is what happens when cells forget how to die
Who said it was a good thing?
 

Mr Laurier

Well-known member
start explaining.
Because when I look at the picture of this cell, I find myself bordering on laughing hysterically when I consider people actually think this cell evolved from nothing.
So.... by all means.
And since nobody thinks any cell ever evolved from nothing....
 

SteveB

Well-known member

Transcript of a conversation with Sir Paul Nurse. There are others in the series.
Interesting article.
I have trouble with his statement/idea that the chicken egg is a single celled object.

But some cells can be really quite big. If you take a hen’s egg, and when you look at the yolk in there, that is a single cell, which then will then-​
AB: Really?​
PN: Absolutely. And it will undergo repeated divisions and eventually make a little chicken. But that’s a single cell and that’s very large.​

I think that's an extremely simplistic description. Too much so.

Which is one more reason why I posted this picture. Sometimes I think you guys have over simplified the biology we have, and have ignored its complexity.
 

SteveB

Well-known member
Nope. It does not explain why you have cancer.
Nothing ironic about it. Cancer is what happens when cells forget how to die
Who said it was a good thing?
You're the one who said

DNA self replicates.
Sometimes there is a copy error.
Sometimes that copy error is a good thing.


Cancer is obviously a replication of dna that is broken.
So, which is it?

It's either a good thing or it's not.
It's clearly broken DNA.
As a stage 4 cancer survivor, and a grandson, and a son of cancer victims who've long since died, I see nothing good about cancer. And you just said that it's not good, yet you claim broken DNA replication can be good.

So, show me a good example of broken DNA.

 

Temujin

Well-known member
Interesting article.
I have trouble with his statement/idea that the chicken egg is a single celled object.



I think that's an extremely simplistic description. Too much so.

Which is one more reason why I posted this picture. Sometimes I think you guys have over simplified the biology we have, and have ignored its complexity.
How do you define a cell?
Why do you think that complexity is a mark of design?
 

SteveB

Well-known member
And since nobody thinks any cell ever evolved from nothing....
yeah you do. Or are you saying that we all just showed up one day with our present level of complexity?

The very concept of evolution is that a single celled organism came from a lightning strike in a sludge pond, and over the course of untold billions of years became increasingly complex, and DNA (an highly complex strand of atoms) slowly become more complex, increasing in the amount of information, until it reached its present level of complexity.

I have to admit here.... I find your statement here rather curious.... you'd be the first person I've ever read say that cells never evolved from nothing.
 

Temujin

Well-known member
I posted a picture of a cell.
And now you deny that an egg is a cell. A picture of a particular type of cell is not a definition.

Why do I think complexity is a mark of design?
Tell me why it's not.
Because frequently it is simplicity that is more a mark of design. There is not much more complex than chaos. A pile of lego bricks is more chaotic than a completed lego model. Mere complexity tells us nothing. If it did you would be able to point to something simple, and say it is not designed. Can you do that?
 

Mr Laurier

Well-known member
You're the one who said




Cancer is obviously a replication of dna that is broken.
So, which is it?

It's either a good thing or it's not.
It's clearly broken DNA.
As a stage 4 cancer survivor, and a grandson, and a son of cancer victims who've long since died, I see nothing good about cancer. And you just said that it's not good, yet you claim broken DNA replication can be good.

So, show me a good example of broken DNA.

You are conflating two separate things. And you know it.
I have never suggested that broken DNA even exists.
 

Andy Sist

Active member
Because when I look at the picture of this cell, I find myself bordering on laughing hysterically when I consider people actually think this cell evolved from nothing
That's exactly what I mean by your brutal scientific ignorance coupled with your unwarranted arrogance towards people who know much more about evolutionary theory than you ever will.
 
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