this verse does not contradict our new birth to be by the word of God (word of Jesus christ in matt 28:19) and by the use of water in the baptismal rite as the church teaches. this is what john 3: 3-5 means... both the words of God being uttered and the use of water in the sacrament of baptism. it is not the word alone or the water alone but, as Paul said, it is the “washing of water with the word” (Eph 5:26).
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catholics don't know or understand enough of His word to wash a kernel of corn.
Buzzard said:
I think Peter and John knew a bunch more than the ECFs
and their students
1 Peter 1:23
Being born again, not of corruptible seed,
but of incorruptible, by the word of God,
which liveth and abideth for ever.
So I ask;
why is it that after "Baptism" those "dunked" into the water
do not come up holy and without blemish.
could it be he speaks of a different "Water"
---- The Ashes of the Red Heifer ------
----------------- Posters ---------------------
Moses says
The """WATER""" Christ and the Apostles spake of is this Water
Only those that have been cleansed by this ""WATER""
will see the Kingdom of Heaven
I think Peter and John knew a bunch more than the ECFs
and their students
1 Peter 1:23
Being born again, not of corruptible seed,
but of incorruptible, by the word of God,
which liveth and abideth for ever.
That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,
27 That he might present it to himself a glorious church,
not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing;
but that it should be holy and without blemish.
27 That he might present it to himself a glorious church,
not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing;
but that it should be holy and without blemish.
So I ask;
why is it that after "Baptism" those "dunked" into the water
do not come up holy and without blemish.
could it be he speaks of a different "Water"
---- The Ashes of the Red Heifer ------
Numbers 19:1
19 And the Lord spake unto Moses and unto Aaron, saying,
2 This is the ordinance of the law which the Lord hath commanded,
saying,
Speak unto the children of Israel,
that they bring thee a red heifer without spot,
wherein is no blemish, and upon which never came a yoke:
19 And the Lord spake unto Moses and unto Aaron, saying,
2 This is the ordinance of the law which the Lord hath commanded,
saying,
Speak unto the children of Israel,
that they bring thee a red heifer without spot,
wherein is no blemish, and upon which never came a yoke:
----------------- Posters ---------------------
Moses says
And a man that is clean shall gather up the ashes of the heifer,
and lay them up without the camp in a clean place,
and it shall be kept for the congregation of the children of Israel
for a water of separation: it is a purification for sin
and lay them up without the camp in a clean place,
and it shall be kept for the congregation of the children of Israel
for a water of separation: it is a purification for sin
.
The """WATER""" Christ and the Apostles spake of is this Water
Only those that have been cleansed by this ""WATER""
will see the Kingdom of Heaven
Jesus answered and said unto him,
Verily, verily, I say unto thee,
Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God
If I have told you earthly things,
and ye believe not,
how shall ye believe,
if I tell you of heavenly things?
./Verily, verily, I say unto thee,
Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God
If I have told you earthly things,
and ye believe not,
how shall ye believe,
if I tell you of heavenly things?
It shows their desperation and it is sad to watch them trying to defend that which is false and then the frustration they feel because they fail.
Oh that is a simple answer for those who read and know scripture. The answer is in scripture. Because Paul's words aligned with scripture and did were not false teachings. But then you guys like to believe false doctrines and myths and ignore scripture.
Interesting how another RC debases scripture this time by putting it on the same level as the Koran. They obviously have not read the Koran either. Interesting read but it is not inspired at all.
leonard03782
Well-known member
Because they did what rc's do not do,...........ever.
11These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.
Jesus never gave anything to an evil institution which is run by wolves. To say so is to insult Jesus. He would never enable an institution that teaches false doctrines, lies to people, harms the sheep. You institution harms the flock, lies to the flock and authorities. If they lie on one thing, they will lie about other things and can never
Funny, two Catholic Bibles have:
Joh 3:3 [DRC] Jesus answered, and said to him: Amen, amen I say to thee, unless a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
Joh 3:3 [CPDV] Jesus responded and said to him, “Amen, amen, I say to you, unless one has been reborn anew, he is not able to see the kingdom of God.”
Really, you should check out what is in your Catholic Bibles before sticking your foot in your mouth! Took me less than a minute to find the verses on my phone's app.
Jesus answered and said unto him,
Art thou a master of Israel, and knowest not these things?
Art thou a master of Israel, and knowest not these things?
I think Peter understood the words of Christ to Nicodemus,
1 Peter 1:23
corruptible seed, -vs - incorruptible seed
Being born again, not of corruptible seed,
but of incorruptible, by the word of God,
which liveth and abideth for ever.
as Christ saith
If I have told you earthly things,
and ye believe not,
how shall ye believe,
if I tell you of heavenly things?
and ye believe not,
how shall ye believe,
if I tell you of heavenly things?
How can anyone schooled in corruptible seed
understand the words of that which is incorruptible
;;
they came every one from his own place;
Eliphaz the Temanite, and Bildad the Shuhite, and Zophar the Naamathite:
for they had made an appointment together to come to mourn with him and to comfort him.
..
take your advise and shove it
Baptized unto Moses, crossing the Red Sea
went over Dry Shod = not dunked in the Water
Noah was in the Ark, not dunked in the Flood
Now when Job's three friends heard of all this evil that was come upon him,
they came every one from his own place;
Eliphaz the Temanite, and Bildad the Shuhite, and Zophar the Naamathite:
for they had made an appointment together to come to mourn with him and to comfort him.
..
Job 9:30
Then Job answered and said,
I know it is so of a truth:
take your advise and shove it
If I wash myself with snow water,
and make my hands never so clean;
;;
Yet shalt thou plunge me in the ditch,
and mine own clothes shall abhor me
.Once again;
the words of Peter1Peter 3:20
when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah,
while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.
21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us
(not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,)
by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:
Baptized unto Moses, crossing the Red Sea
went over Dry Shod = not dunked in the Water
Noah was in the Ark, not dunked in the Flood
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what i am referring to is the question of translating to english the greek 'anothen' in the greek phrase 'gennatha anothem (born again)' which is in john3:3 and 3:7. in the new testament, it means regeneration in titus3: 5. it is also described as receiving new life (Rom. 6:4), receiving the circumcision of the heart (Rom. 2:29; Col. 2:11–12), and becoming a new creation (2 Cor. 5:17; Gal. 6:15). most of these are the effects of the sacrament of baptism that jesus talks about in john3 as being born of water and spirit.
are you implying baptism should not be by dunking in water?
thanks for your ad hominems, peace be with you!
we appeal to the bible ( old and new testament). the bereans (hellenistic jews) appeal to their scripture/old testament and their scripture have the deuterocanonical books that protestants removed from the bible.
the Jews in Berean are noble because they are not hostile and are open minded, unlike the Jews in Thessalonica who were close/shut minded and antagonistic. both searched the scripture but unlike the jews in thessalonica, the jews in berea accepted paul's teaching and were willing to learn. what the bereans have is apostolic tradition in the person of paul and scripture unlike the thessalonians who relied on scripture alone.
post your source
as long as you read into it what the rcc tells you it says instead of what it actually does say.
check.... bible hub.com with strong's lexicon
but not scripture alone, it is both sacred tradition and sacred scripture.
When will RCs learn what ad hominems are. The true facts are not ad hominems. The fruit of your institution was stated truthfully. It is not my fault you do not like what it shows.