Predestination

Sethproton

Well-known member
Of course, civic never CLAIMED that 2 Tim. 2:15 specifically contains the WORD, "hermeneutics". But the fact that it does speak OF hermeneutics, "correctly handles the word of truth" is undeniable.

To try to argue that you have to find "exact words" is ridiculous, and could be used to claim that you must not believe in the Trinity because the WORD "Trinity" is nowhere found in the Bible.

The CONCEPT of the Trinity is found in the Bible.
Just as the CONCEPT of hermeutics is found in 2 Tim. 2:15.



It's amazing that this poster, although being completely IGNORANT of the Greek language, constantly speaks of "the Greek word". The purpose, of course, is to make themselves sound more knowledgable and learned, and since most others here don't understand the Greek language either, they are less able to address the claims being made.

My Greek is self-study (the first year being with Bill Mounce's audio lectures, textbook, and workbook), and I'm currently working through an intermediate course. But even with as little study as this, when you get to this point, you discover that the translators actually knew what they were talking about, and got just about everything right. But when you have someone who has NEVER studied Greek, throwing around "this Greek term means", they always use that to try to argue that the translation is wrong, and that their pet doctrines are correct (eg. "power over their own will" allegedly proves, "free will", or that Jesus is no longer our mediator).



Just out of curiosity, Seth, WHERE in the Bible do we find "the Greek word from which we get hermeneutics"? Chapter and verse, please?

Prediction: He will either ignore the challenge, or else turn it back around on me, even though HE is the one who made the false claim.



So show us.
I truly believe you have no clue what you're talking about.



Yeah, so?
Why do you present "Trivia", instead of substantive exegesis?

It comes from "one word" because it's a COMPOUND word, "ορθοτομεω" ("Ortho-tomeo").
"Ortho", meaning "right", or "straight" (eg. "orthodox").
"tomos" meaning "cut" or "divide".

It's interesting, since I'm a chemistry teacher, and I point out to my students that our current term "atom" comes from the Greek, "a-tomos", meaning "indivisible", since the atom was defined in the 5th century B.C. as a philosophical idea of the point where matter could no longer be divided. It is the same Greek term, "tomos", with the "alpha privative" for negation (eg. "a-sexual", "a-synchronous", etc.)



Did you all read that?
Seth taught the meaning of Scripture "correctly" because Seth sez it's "correctly".
Seth is infallible. He's been studying Scripture for 50 years. So he's correct.
He can even correct Greek scholars even though he hasn't had ONE lesson in Greek.
What you are ignoring, that you earlier demanded is that the concept you are pushing of the RIGHT way to study the Bible, is not in that verse.
That was my point. You don't quote a verse that speaks about rightly handling the Word of God and act like it supports your own version of hermeneutics.
That was the point
Nothing more
 

Sethproton

Well-known member
Of course, civic never CLAIMED that 2 Tim. 2:15 specifically contains the WORD, "hermeneutics". But the fact that it does speak OF hermeneutics, "correctly handles the word of truth" is undeniable.

To try to argue that you have to find "exact words" is ridiculous, and could be used to claim that you must not believe in the Trinity because the WORD "Trinity" is nowhere found in the Bible.

The CONCEPT of the Trinity is found in the Bible.
Just as the CONCEPT of hermeutics is found in 2 Tim. 2:15.



It's amazing that this poster, although being completely IGNORANT of the Greek language, constantly speaks of "the Greek word". The purpose, of course, is to make themselves sound more knowledgable and learned, and since most others here don't understand the Greek language either, they are less able to address the claims being made.

My Greek is self-study (the first year being with Bill Mounce's audio lectures, textbook, and workbook), and I'm currently working through an intermediate course. But even with as little study as this, when you get to this point, you discover that the translators actually knew what they were talking about, and got just about everything right. But when you have someone who has NEVER studied Greek, throwing around "this Greek term means", they always use that to try to argue that the translation is wrong, and that their pet doctrines are correct (eg. "power over their own will" allegedly proves, "free will", or that Jesus is no longer our mediator).



Just out of curiosity, Seth, WHERE in the Bible do we find "the Greek word from which we get hermeneutics"? Chapter and verse, please?

Prediction: He will either ignore the challenge, or else turn it back around on me, even though HE is the one who made the false claim.



So show us.
I truly believe you have no clue what you're talking about.



Yeah, so?
Why do you present "Trivia", instead of substantive exegesis?

It comes from "one word" because it's a COMPOUND word, "ορθοτομεω" ("Ortho-tomeo").
"Ortho", meaning "right", or "straight" (eg. "orthodox").
"tomeo" (v.) from "tomos" (a) meaning "able to be cut" or "divisible".

It's interesting, since I'm a chemistry teacher, and I point out to my students that our current term "atom" comes from the Greek, "a-tomos", meaning "indivisible", since the atom was defined in the 5th century B.C. as a philosophical idea of the point where matter could no longer be divided. It is the same Greek term, "tomos", with the "alpha privative" for negation (eg. "a-sexual", "a-synchronous", etc.)



Did you all read that?
Seth taught the meaning of Scripture "correctly" because Seth sez it's "correctly".
Seth is infallible. He's been studying Scripture for 50 years. So he's correct.
He can even correct Greek scholars even though he hasn't had ONE lesson in Greek.
The info on naming the atom is interesting. thanks
 

Theo1689

Well-known member
What you are ignoring,

I'm NOT "ignoring" anything, since I'm not the one who's wrong.

that you earlier demanded is that the concept you are pushing of the RIGHT way to study the Bible, is not in that verse.

Well, no, there isn't a comprehensive treatise on hermeneutics in that single verse.
And nobody claimed there was.
You do realize you're being unreasonable here, right?

That was my point. You don't quote a verse that speaks about rightly handling the Word of God and act like it supports your own version of hermeneutics.

You don't get to tell others what to do.
It's against the rules.

And I can understand why someone like you who breaks the rules so often, wants to claim that reporting posts is "childish". Kind of self-serving, don't you think?
 

Sethproton

Well-known member
That's all he got out of my post?
And all the while he was unable to quote quote the verse that allegedly contains the word, "hermeneutics".
Theo, I did not say the Greek contains the word hermeneutics. I said that verses contain the Greek word from which that English word is derived.
Are you asking where it is? 1 Cor 12:10 and 14:26
 

Sethproton

Well-known member
You should read before you post. johnny spoke about this in post 101. Theo presented a rational, cogent and completely biblical argument. You should consider such as approach.
what is the need for all the personal putdowns? Why is it impossible for you to just address doctrine.
Do you have any doctrinal points of scripture that interest you?
 

Theo1689

Well-known member
Beloved Daughter said:
You should read before you post. johnny spoke about this in post 101. Theo presented a rational, cogent and completely biblical argument. You should consider such as approach.

what is the need for all the personal putdowns?

You can't see the problem with accusing others with "cuddling" with others, but you apparently see "personal putdowns" in the above quote?

Exactly where are the "personal putdowns"?

And why do you constantly talk about others, yet you throw a hissy-fit when others do the same to you?
 
G

guest1

Guest
what is the need for all the personal putdowns? Why is it impossible for you to just address doctrine.
Do you have any doctrinal points of scripture that interest you?
You are confusing the facts with you claims. Your claims are not facts but assumptions. You are demonstrating here the same thing you do with the scriptures. At least you are now bring consistent which is a good start .
 

Sethproton

Well-known member
You can't see the problem with accusing others with "cuddling" with others, but you apparently see "personal putdowns" in the above quote?

Exactly where are the "personal putdowns"?

And why do you constantly talk about others, yet you throw a hissy-fit when others do the same to you?
How exactly is cuddling an accusation? In my sentence it means to intellectually huddle together. You guys pretended you thought I meant it was a physical cuddling, Ridiculous
 

Theo1689

Well-known member
How exactly is cuddling an accusation? In my sentence it means to intellectually huddle together. You guys pretended you thought I meant it was a physical cuddling, Ridiculous

You made the false accusation that BD engaged in "personal putdowns".
Yet you can't identify any.
I think you owe her an apology.
 

ReverendRV

Well-known member
Do you have any scriptures that form your ideas ? All I see are your ideas with no scripture or definition of words like I see from beloved daughter , tibiasdad, reverend, dizerner, carbon, civic and many other participants on this forum. I’m not familiar with your bible study techniques. Where do you get them from ? Can you share a link with me that explains your methods ? Thank you .
I think you will need to be patient, I've been trying for a while to get him to talk about the ramifications of me having 'Another Jesus'...
 

Sethproton

Well-known member
Do you have any scriptures that form your ideas ? All I see are your ideas with no scripture or definition of words like I see from beloved daughter , tibiasdad, reverend, dizerner, carbon, civic and many other participants on this forum. I’m not familiar with your bible study techniques. Where do you get them from ? Can you share a link with me that explains your methods ? Thank you .
Of course I have scripture. I told you i did, more than once.
Let us back track. I wrote you a post to explain a position. you said you disagreed. You mentioned no scripture. And when I offered to talk scripture with you, you were not interested.
Now you are saying again, you want scripture, so again i will say to you that we can step thru the ideas I presented to you. You can tell me one idea at a time that you question and i will show you what scripture it comes from.
Isn't that what you are asking for. A discussion about specific scripture that is the basis of what i wrote to you?
 

Theo1689

Well-known member
Johnnybgood asks for Scripture.

Seth responds:
Of course I have scripture. I told you i did, more than once.

Great!

Yet....

Let us back track. I wrote you a post to explain a position. you said you disagreed. You mentioned no scripture. And when I offered to talk scripture with you, you were not interested.

No Scripture yet...

Now you are saying again, you want scripture, so again i will say to you that we can step thru the ideas I presented to you. You can tell me one idea at a time that you question and i will show you what scripture it comes from.

No Scripture yet...

Isn't that what you are asking for. A discussion about specific scripture that is the basis of what i wrote to you?

No Scripture yet...

Seth ALWAYS does this.

Seth: "My beliefs are X, Y, Z".
"Bob": "What Scriptures support your claims?
Seth: "If you want me to provide Scripture, let me know, and I'm happy to provide them."
"Bob": "Yes, show us Scripture".
Seth: "Okay, just tell me which assertions you want Scripture for.
"Bob": I'd like to see Scripture for ALL of your claims!
Seth: "Okay, Bob is at the point of harassing me, so I'm going to ignore him, but if anyone ELSE wants to see Scripture for my beliefs, just let me know, and I will be happy to provide them."
 

Sethproton

Well-known member
I have been lurking as reverend says watching this thread and I have to agree with the other posters who have also asked you for the same things I have been asking you which is post the Bible scriptures with your replies so I can understand your ideas and where they come from but you have not done that for me or any other person today. So I know that I am not imagining this or making it up. What I can see happening is that everyone here is wrong and you are right. But for you to be right you would have to post the scriptures that your ideas come from and I have not seen any so far. This is tiring and I don’t enjoy this kind of bantering with people . You might like it but I sure do not.
Ok, good. then let you and I do that.
Pick out one thing from the post that you disagreed with and i will show you the scripture.
It should be simple. Start with any point i made in that post and i will back it up with scripture
And in that way we can work thru the whole post and I can answer every question you have
 

ReverendRV

Well-known member
Ok, good. then let you and I do that.
Pick out one thing from the post that you disagreed with and i will show you the scripture.
It should be simple. Start with any point i made in that post and i will back it up with scripture
And in that way we can work thru the whole post and I can answer every question you have
I for one am still interested in 1st Timothy 2:5. Would you say that I have another Jesus, since I say he is still an Anthropos Man?
 
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