Preterism and the People of God

Iconoclast

Active member
The trib is still future.
I was originally taught that idea also, but the biblical evidence is overwhelming.

CC.....what period of time and what is being described here?
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

32 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh:

33 So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.

34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.
 

CrowCross

Super Member
I was originally taught that idea also, but the biblical evidence is overwhelming.

CC.....what period of time and what is being described here?
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

32 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh:

33 So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.

34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.

"CC.....what period of time and what is being described here?"

You have ...now....then the rapture...the the 7 year tribulation...then the event described in your post.
 

Iconoclast

Active member
"CC.....what period of time and what is being described here?"

You have ...now....then the rapture...the the 7 year tribulation...then the event described in your post.
okay..now when does the activity of the Sun moon and stars happen?
It says the stars fall from heaven...
 

CrowCross

Super Member
okay..now when does the activity of the Sun moon and stars happen?
It says the stars fall from heaven...
What are the stars?

Literal stars?

Are they angels as angels are described as stars...Perhaps they represent satellites crashing to earth or the remains of a meteor....
 

robycop3

Well-known member
I was originally taught that idea also, but the biblical evidence is overwhelming.

CC.....what period of time and what is being described here?
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

32 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh:

33 So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.

34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.
Sir, the beast will be in power when the trib occurs. Besides that, JESUS said He'd return IMMEDIATELY AFTER the trib, so if it's already occurred, He's 'WAY-overdue!
 

robycop3

Well-known member
What are the stars?

Literal stars?

Are they angels as angels are described as stars...Perhaps they represent satellites crashing to earth or the remains of a meteor....
They will be meteors. "Falling stars" has long been a term for meteors.
 

Iconoclast

Active member
What are the stars?

Literal stars?

Are they angels as angels are described as stars...Perhaps they represent satellites crashing to earth or the remains of a meteor....
It is speaking of a change of Government, or administration;
isa 13 babylon was being destroyed;
6 Howl ye; for the day of the Lord is at hand; it shall come as a destruction from the Almighty.

7 Therefore shall all hands be faint, and every man's heart shall melt:

8 And they shall be afraid: pangs and sorrows shall take hold of them; they shall be in pain as a woman that travaileth: they shall be amazed one at another; their faces shall be as flames.

9 Behold, the day of the Lord cometh, cruel both with wrath and fierce anger, to lay the land desolate: and he shall destroy the sinners thereof out of it.

10 For the stars of heaven and the constellations thereof shall not give their light: the sun shall be darkened in his going forth, and the moon shall not cause her light to shine.

11 And I will punish the world for their evil, and the wicked for their iniquity; and I will cause the arrogancy of the proud to cease, and will lay low the haughtiness of the terrible.

isa34
4 And all the host of heaven shall be dissolved, and the heavens shall be rolled together as a scroll: and all their host shall fall down, as the leaf falleth off from the vine, and as a falling fig from the fig tree.

5 For my sword shall be bathed in heaven: behold, it shall come down upon Idumea, and upon the people of my curse, to judgment.
 

CrowCross

Super Member
It is speaking of a change of Government, or administration;
isa 13 babylon was being destroyed;
6 Howl ye; for the day of the Lord is at hand; it shall come as a destruction from the Almighty.

7 Therefore shall all hands be faint, and every man's heart shall melt:

8 And they shall be afraid: pangs and sorrows shall take hold of them; they shall be in pain as a woman that travaileth: they shall be amazed one at another; their faces shall be as flames.

9 Behold, the day of the Lord cometh, cruel both with wrath and fierce anger, to lay the land desolate: and he shall destroy the sinners thereof out of it.

10 For the stars of heaven and the constellations thereof shall not give their light: the sun shall be darkened in his going forth, and the moon shall not cause her light to shine.

11 And I will punish the world for their evil, and the wicked for their iniquity; and I will cause the arrogancy of the proud to cease, and will lay low the haughtiness of the terrible.

isa34
4 And all the host of heaven shall be dissolved, and the heavens shall be rolled together as a scroll: and all their host shall fall down, as the leaf falleth off from the vine, and as a falling fig from the fig tree.

5 For my sword shall be bathed in heaven: behold, it shall come down upon Idumea, and upon the people of my curse, to judgment.
This part should be interesting:

heavens shall be rolled together as a scroll
 

robycop3

Well-known member
It is speaking of a change of Government, or administration;
isa 13 babylon was being destroyed;
6 Howl ye; for the day of the Lord is at hand; it shall come as a destruction from the Almighty.

7 Therefore shall all hands be faint, and every man's heart shall melt:

8 And they shall be afraid: pangs and sorrows shall take hold of them; they shall be in pain as a woman that travaileth: they shall be amazed one at another; their faces shall be as flames.

9 Behold, the day of the Lord cometh, cruel both with wrath and fierce anger, to lay the land desolate: and he shall destroy the sinners thereof out of it.

10 For the stars of heaven and the constellations thereof shall not give their light: the sun shall be darkened in his going forth, and the moon shall not cause her light to shine.

11 And I will punish the world for their evil, and the wicked for their iniquity; and I will cause the arrogancy of the proud to cease, and will lay low the haughtiness of the terrible.

isa34
4 And all the host of heaven shall be dissolved, and the heavens shall be rolled together as a scroll: and all their host shall fall down, as the leaf falleth off from the vine, and as a falling fig from the fig tree.

5 For my sword shall be bathed in heaven: behold, it shall come down upon Idumea, and upon the people of my curse, to judgment.
No, it represents meteors.
 

Iconoclast

Active member
Just curious -- could you show ANY other place in scripture where Heaven is called governments of man? Because the bolded Isa 13:10 and 34:4 do NOT say or imply that.
Hello BA,
check Gen 37...Joseph says the sun moon and stars will bow down to Him....
Joel 2 is quoted on the day of pentecost...vs 16...this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel

mt24:29-31
rev6;
12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;

13 And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.

14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.
 
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Iconoclast

Active member
Where do the stars fall to?
It is not literal stars, those in power are changed, the heaven rolls up like a scroll...life as they knew it changes
rev.6
12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;

13 And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.

14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.
 

robycop3

Well-known member
It is not literal stars, those in power are changed, the heaven rolls up like a scroll...life as they knew it changes
rev.6
12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;

13 And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.

14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.
Ancient peoples used sackcloth, and some still do today, to view solar eclipses. The sky will become so smoky/dusty that people will be able to view the sun with the unshielded eye, much as we can now, thru fog.

The falling stars will be meteors. And I explained about the heavens earlier.
 

robycop3

Well-known member
Sportzz Fanzz, please take Iconoclast's stuff with a grain of salt. He believes the goofy & false preterist doctrine.
 
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