Preterist Theology Is Inconsistent And Unbiblical

RCM said:
Do you not believe in the authority of God's Word?

Or, maybe the Reformed Bible doesn't have the Prophets and Minor Prophets?


God's word clearly teaches that He is going to restore ethnic Israel back into the Land

  • Amos 9:11-15 The LORD will restore Israel to its former glory, and they will never be uprooted again
  • Micah 4:1-5 The LORD’s future reign on earth in Jerusalem
  • Micah 4:6-13 The LORD will gather Israel and restore the kingdom
  • Zechariah 2:1-13 The LORD is going to going to call the exiles home to live with him in Israel
  • Zechariah 6:9-15 The LORD will rule as king and priest in the rebuilt temple
  • Zechariah 8:1-23 The LORD of Heaven’s Armies will return to Mount Zion and live in Jerusalem to bless the remnant of Israel
  • Zechariah 9:9-17 The LORD of Heaven’s Armies will destroy all the weapons used in battle and bring peace to the nations
  • Zechariah 10:1-12 The LORD will restore his people
  • Zechariah 12:1-14 The LORD will defend his people and give victory to Jerusalem
  • Zechariah 14:1-21 The LORD will rule the whole earth from Jerusalem

To further prove my point, Paul declares that Israel struggles with unbelief and pursues righteousness through the law in Romans 9-11

Romans 9:30-32
30 What shall we say then? That Gentiles, who did not pursue righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness of faith;
31 but Israel, pursuing the law of righteousness, has not attained to the law of righteousness.
32 Why? Because they did not seek it by faith, but as it were, by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumbling stone.


These verses proves the Church is not Israel


These verses in conjunction with Romans 11:26 proves there are two distinct entities that make up the 'One People of God'


Israel and the Church



You have been proven wrong! Not by me, but by God's Word



RCM
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Lol, that in no way proves the current secular state of Israel is some kind of restored manifestation of ancient Israel.

"One People of God", thank you. You are correct
 
Reformedguy said:
Lol, that in no way proves the current secular state of Israel is some kind of restored manifestation of ancient Israel.

"One People of God", thank you. You are correct
Click to expand...


Your posts continually display a complete lack of character, integrity, and ability to honestly interact and interpret the Biblical text

All the marks of a charlatan!


You wanted proof where the Biblical text states that Israel and the Church are distinctly separate from one another,


Paul declares that Israel struggles with unbelief and pursues righteousness through the law in Romans 9-11

Romans 9:30-32
30 What shall we say then? That Gentiles, who did not pursue righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness of faith;
31 but Israel, pursuing the law of righteousness, has not attained to the law of righteousness.
32 Why? Because they did not seek it by faith, but as it were, by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumbling stone.


These verses prove the Church is not Israel



Admit you have been proven wrong!



RCM
 
RCM said:
Your posts continually display a complete lack of character, integrity, and ability to honestly interact and interpret the Biblical text

All the marks of a charlatan!


You wanted proof where the Biblical text states that Israel and the Church are distinctly separate from one another,


Paul declares that Israel struggles with unbelief and pursues righteousness through the law in Romans 9-11

Romans 9:30-32
30 What shall we say then? That Gentiles, who did not pursue righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness of faith;
31 but Israel, pursuing the law of righteousness, has not attained to the law of righteousness.
32 Why? Because they did not seek it by faith, but as it were, by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumbling stone.


These verses prove the Church is not Israel



Admit you have been proven wrong!



RCM
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And your posts display frustration with your inability to prove your dispensational lunacy. It's not my fault. Wise up

There always has only been one people of God. Which you admit. Now your arguing for arguments sake. Good talk though
 
Reformedguy said:
And your posts display frustration with your inability to prove your dispensational lunacy. It's not my fault. Wise up

There always has only been one people of God. Which you admit. Now your arguing for arguments sake. Good talk though
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So, you agree that Paul is saying that, Israel means ethnic Israel (Jacob), and not the Church


Because, Paul declares that Israel struggles with unbelief and pursues righteousness through the law in Romans 9-11, so the Church can't be Israel

Romans 9:30-32
30 What shall we say then? That Gentiles, who did not pursue righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness of faith;
31 but Israel, pursuing the law of righteousness, has not attained to the law of righteousness.
32 Why? Because they did not seek it by faith, but as it were, by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumbling stone.



RCM
 
Reformedguy said:
Lol, that in no way proves the current secular state of Israel is some kind of restored manifestation of ancient Israel.
Click to expand...

You are blind to reality and to the authority of Scripture

Zechariah 12:2-3
2 "Behold, I will make Jerusalem a cup of drunkenness to all the surrounding peoples, when they lay siege against Judah and Jerusalem.
3 And it shall happen in that day that I will make Jerusalem a very heavy stone for all peoples; all who would heave it away will surely be cut in pieces, though all nations of the earth are gathered against it.



RCM
 
RCM said:
You are blind to reality and to the authority of Scripture

Zechariah 12:2-3
2 "Behold, I will make Jerusalem a cup of drunkenness to all the surrounding peoples, when they lay siege against Judah and Jerusalem.
3 And it shall happen in that day that I will make Jerusalem a very heavy stone for all peoples; all who would heave it away will surely be cut in pieces, though all nations of the earth are gathered against it.



RCM
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Ya sure, everyone is blind but you. Typical cultist zealot
 
Reformedguy said:
Ya sure, everyone is blind but you. Typical cultist zealot
Click to expand...

In Biblical Apologetics, you quickly learn that when a person cannot defend their theological viewpoint from both the Old Testament and the New Testament Scriptures, and do so without contradiction, their doctrine is in error

It is obvious to all that you have been completely unable to engage the debate and defend your position with Old Testament and New Testament Biblical Scriptures, and do so without contradiction



RCM
 
RCM said:
Your posts continually display a complete lack of character, integrity, and ability to honestly interact and interpret the Biblical text

All the marks of a charlatan!


You wanted proof where the Biblical text states that Israel and the Church are distinctly separate from one another,


Paul declares that Israel struggles with unbelief and pursues righteousness through the law in Romans 9-11

Romans 9:30-32
30 What shall we say then? That Gentiles, who did not pursue righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness of faith;
31 but Israel, pursuing the law of righteousness, has not attained to the law of righteousness.
32 Why? Because they did not seek it by faith, but as it were, by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumbling stone.


These verses prove the Church is not Israel



Admit you have been proven wrong!



RCM
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yes and notice what section on carm this forum is one lol- might as well be in the cult section where it belongs with the rest of the false teachings. Well its right below them close enough with the open theists, emergents, word of faith,new age all heresies.

good jib defending the truth BTW !!!

kudos
 
RCM said:
In Biblical Apologetics, you quickly learn that when a person cannot defend their theological viewpoint from both the Old Testament and the New Testament Scriptures, and do so without contradiction, their doctrine is in error

It is obvious to all that you have been completely unable to engage the debate and defend your position with Old Testament and New Testament Biblical Scriptures, and do so without contradiction



RCM
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good luck getting an actual dialogue/debate without it resorting to ad hominems.
 
RCM said:
You are blind to reality and to the authority of Scripture

Zechariah 12:2-3
2 "Behold, I will make Jerusalem a cup of drunkenness to all the surrounding peoples, when they lay siege against Judah and Jerusalem.
3 And it shall happen in that day that I will make Jerusalem a very heavy stone for all peoples; all who would heave it away will surely be cut in pieces, though all nations of the earth are gathered against it.



RCM
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ditto scripture is clear and completely refutes their heresy.
 
BlessedAnomaly said:
Sure they do. Tallen for one (agreed with you HERE, although we may have gotten your meaning wrong). Yodas Prodigy for another. The list goes on. You even brought up "Israel of God" as the church in THIS post. So you said so -- i.e.: no strawman.


No, it lies with anyone who comments and disagrees or supplies something new. You disagreed. You need to prove your disagreement.


RCM has already documented that for you a number of times, but you fail to read and comment back (because you seem to be incapable of it - not an ad hom, but apparently a simple truth; prove me wrong).


Where does the Bible say there are two different sets of the elect? The bible speaks of the elect.


This is true. The covenant was made for him to all people. His son is Isaac. His son is Jacob - who is Israel, who is only a part of Abraham's offspring. All of Israel shall be saved. Nowhere is there a promise that all of Abraham will be saved.
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Amen
 
RCM said:
I am completely amazed at the Reformed's inability to practice good Biblical Theology so that Scripture interprets Scripture and Scripture correlates with Scripture

Much of that Old Testament Scripture that you think has already been fulfilled, is yet future, especially Zechariah

And Paul's statement in Roman's 11:26, which is an OT Quote from Isaiah 59:20 proves as much,

Romans 11:26
26 And so all Israel will be saved, as it is written: "The Deliverer will come out of Zion, And He will turn away ungodliness from Jacob;


The Greek that Paul used for the verbs is in the future tense, it hasn't happened yet!



Israel coming back to the land is the beginning of God fulfilling His Old Testament Promises to Israel, in Hosea, Amos, Daniel, Ezekiel, Isaiah, Zephaniah, Zechariah, Acts 15, Romans 9-11, Revelation


Like I said before, you are just like the Pharisees, God has fulfilled Biblical Prophecy right in front of your eyes, and you refuse to see it!



RCM
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its the same thing on the arminian/calvinist forum- welcome to my world lol. I was a staunch calvinist for 40 years but never a preterist. as a calvinist I had some great dialogues with non calvinists but now as a non calvinist those dialogues have all but disappeared and its nothing but ad hominems.
 
BlessedAnomaly said:
Is he the only Preterist in the world? ;)

Wait. Pre-coffee-post-bagel-without-cream-cheese-with-amil-leanings-Preterist. Gotta get the right bent. ?
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no the calvinist forum is full of them with the rest of their heresies.
 
Pretersim makes a complete mockery out of most of the OT prophecies and the NT teaching of Jesus and the Apostles. The problem of evil still existing is enough to topple the house of cards built upon sinking sand.
 
RCM said:
Your posts continually display a complete lack of character, integrity, and ability to honestly interact and interpret the Biblical text

All the marks of a charlatan!


You wanted proof where the Biblical text states that Israel and the Church are distinctly separate from one another,


Paul declares that Israel struggles with unbelief and pursues righteousness through the law in Romans 9-11

Romans 9:30-32
30 What shall we say then? That Gentiles, who did not pursue righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness of faith;
31 but Israel, pursuing the law of righteousness, has not attained to the law of righteousness.
32 Why? Because they did not seek it by faith, but as it were, by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumbling stone.


These verses prove the Church is not Israel



Admit you have been proven wrong!



RCM
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I'm a partial preterist and will be glad to deal with your claims.

Every single saint of God in all ages have come to God through faith. That is why Abraham is referenced has having obtain everlasting life. Abraham was a Gentile when he received the circumcision of the heart. The lineage of Jesus Christ didn't begin with Abraham. It began with the faithfulness of Adam.
 
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Chalcedon said:
Pretersim makes a complete mockery out of most of the OT prophecies and the NT teaching of Jesus and the Apostles. The problem of evil still existing is enough to topple the house of cards built upon sinking sand.
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What promise does Israel have that isn't predicated upon Jesus Christ? The only everlasting heir of Abraham?
 
RCM said:
So, you agree that Paul is saying that, Israel means ethnic Israel (Jacob), and not the Church


Because, Paul declares that Israel struggles with unbelief and pursues righteousness through the law in Romans 9-11, so the Church can't be Israel

Romans 9:30-32
30 What shall we say then? That Gentiles, who did not pursue righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness of faith;
31 but Israel, pursuing the law of righteousness, has not attained to the law of righteousness.
32 Why? Because they did not seek it by faith, but as it were, by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumbling stone.



RCM
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This was a problem has existed from the beginning. Where the law given on Sinah or the law written in the conscience of mankind from the beginning, same problem.

Rom 2:12 For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law;
Rom 2:13 (For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.
Rom 2:14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:
Rom 2:15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another
 
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