Punk-ness

[stiggy wiggy]

To answer your question. No.

That's what I thought.

 

[Furion]

Both.

Anger that anyone sitting behind this blind mortal veil to eternity with the rest of us has the balls to tell other people with conviction how painful and torturous their eternity is going to be because those people decided to fill that ignorance with Christianity,

That is an incorrect conclusion. Christianity is just a symptom in your view. God is the one, whether law, grace, conscience, all the avenues God has utilized are unacceptable to you. You've turned your anger at God towards your fellow man.

an ignorance that still remains after their personal decision to merely believe something for THEMSELVES. They are made no wiser to the mystery for having done it. We are naturally worrisome and curious creatures regarding our unknown future and vulnerable to the anxiety that instills. The Christian view of the afterlife employed to fill this fear is no less exploitative of that fear and credible to that future than a fortune teller who would connect you to your dead relatives in a séance, reading Tarot, or a crystal ball for cash.

I do agree, man for all his bravado is really pretty scared.

I come here and I see many brave Sir Roberts, knowing full well the bravery is for show, and that's ok, I have patience.

God places very high importance to believing what He says. Christ marveled at the people for the same reason. I am fully persuaded man has no clue why it is important after talking to many men. Your option is to go to your death never grasping why such a simple concept is eternally important.

Scared, yes. I'm am sometimes scared of letting go of the only thing I know.

I think God is fully aware of how frightened man is. Fear shouldn't instill a false bravado in the face of destruction though.

You have to accept that God is God.

He is not like you at all, and He is not like me at all. He is not a man.

In order to stand before God the light will pierce straight through you, exposing every single fragment of your being, your notions and your hopes and dreams.

But God being God He leaves you intact, honors your independence. You'll find God gave you talent and you'll realize you can put it to work for Him because you love Him. You are truly set free.

I'm sure you can find fault in whatever I say. But these things are ancient, they will not change.

There is however comfort in peace. Also in the fact that I sure didn't miss not being around in 1900, or 1850, or 1940, etc.... It's like asking someone if I miss having a third arm. How would I know?

Not until you understand the above.

I think what you should consider is every fear and complaint you have is common among men.

 

[5wize]

That is an incorrect conclusion. Christianity is just a symptom in your view.

Oh... that's interesting. I didn't know that.... and it's my own view too.

God is the one, whether law, grace, conscience, all the avenues God has utilized are unacceptable to you.

Law and conscious are pretty acceptable avenues for me. God ain't driving down them though.

You've turned your anger at God towards your fellow man.

That's terrible. Just terrible. I shouldn't do that.

I do agree, man for all his bravado is really pretty scared.

I come here and I see many brave Sir Roberts, knowing full well the bravery is for show, and that's ok, I have patience.

Patience in what, Brave Sir Robert?. So stoic. So enduring you are.

God places very high importance to believing what He says.

No, you place a high importance in us believing what you say.

Christ marveled at the people for the same reason. I am fully persuaded man has no clue why it is important after talking to many men.

I'm fully persuaded you are one of those men.

Your option is to go to your death never grasping why such a simple concept is eternally important.

There are a lot of simple concepts that have no importance at all.

I think God is fully aware of how frightened man is.

You think? Why do you think that?

Fear shouldn't instill a false bravado in the face of destruction though.

And like you said, there are many possible ends. 2 or 3 dozen or so you said, and you admit to your own false bravado in the face of them.

You have to accept that God is God.

What exactly is that though? Give us the run down. You seem to know...and it seems to be the source of your own bravado. Good to have humans like you around to tell us about what God is.

He is not like you at all, and He is not like me at all. He is not a man.

o.k. So much for what he's not.

In order to stand before God the light will pierce straight through you, exposing every single fragment of your being, your notions and your hopes and dreams.

You've seen this?

But God being God He leaves you intact, honors your independence. You'll find God gave you talent and you'll realize you can put it to work for Him because you love Him. You are truly set free.

How convenient. Sounds like an excuse for why something like the above never happens as opposed to the real reason they don't happen.

I'm sure you can find fault in whatever I say. But these things are ancient, they will not change.

Ancient indeed. You know, sacrificing living things to appease God is ancient too. We still do that?

I think what you should consider is every fear and complaint you have is common among men.

I know, but not you, right?

 

[Furion]

Law and conscious are pretty acceptable avenues for me. God ain't driving down them though.

But you are and you don't even know it.

It is certainly an interesting part of reading here, just how many years you can go fully not understanding what you rail against.

The scriptures don't say you oppose yourself for no reason.

That's terrible. Just terrible. I shouldn't do that.

Patience in what, Brave Sir Robert?. So stoic. So enduring you are.

No, you place a high importance in us believing what you say.

I'm fully persuaded you are one of those men.

There are a lot of simple concepts that have no importance at all.

You think? Why do you think that?

And like you said, there are many possible ends. 2 or 3 dozen or so you said, and you admit to your own false bravado in the face of them.

What exactly is that though? Give us the run down. You seem to know...and it seems to be the source of your own bravado. Good to have humans like you around to tell us about what God is.

o.k. So much for what he's not.

You've seen this?

How convenient. Sounds like an excuse for why something like the above never happens as opposed to the real reason they don't happen.

Ancient indeed. You know, sacrificing living things to appease God is ancient too. We still do that?

I know, but not you, right?

 

[5wize]

But you are and you don't even know it.

I do know it. We all know it. Law and conscience is a relationship we all possess an awareness of. That's what conscience is... our awareness of ourselves in relationship to both intimate personal and social expectations. There is no other place except within ourselves whare any of that is recognized.

It is certainly an interesting part of reading here, just how many years you can go fully not understanding what you rail against.

That's what I wonder about you too. How long are you going to invest in a narrative that you refuse to look into for its anthropomorphic and nationalist origins and the obvious narcissistic supernatural fabrications that would entail? Most world religions are rife with it. Christianity and the Hebrew nationalism it grew out of is no special pocket protected from this human problem.

The scriptures don't say you oppose yourself for no reason.

I know. The above explains why very well.

 

[Furion]

I do know it. We all know it. Law and conscience is a relationship we all possess an awareness of. That's what conscience is... our awareness of ourselves in relationship to both intimate personal and social expectations. There is no other place except within ourselves whare any of that is recognized.

Good then, you have a glimpse of your own law ready to judge your thoughts and intentions of your heart, and your corresponding actions.

We'll see how you fare in your judgement. I know I would have failed in the first few seconds. Let's see if you can last a whole ten seconds.

That's what I wonder about you too. How long are you going to invest in a narrative that you refuse to look into for its anthropomorphic and nationalist origins and the obvious narcissistic supernatural fabrications that would entail? Most world religions are rife with it. Christianity and the Hebrew nationalism it grew out of is no special pocket protected from this human problem.

I know. The above explains why very well.

I have nothing to do.

I have been enlightened to love, against it there is no law than has any effect. No atheist complaining can change it either

I was set free.

You are not, however.

 

[5wize]

Good then, you have a glimpse of your own law ready to judge your thoughts and intentions of your heart, and your corresponding actions.

We'll see how you fare in your judgement. I know I would have failed in the first few seconds. Let's see if you can last a whole ten seconds.

Nope... only took 5 seconds for me to convict myself. This is how conscience works in navigating the world we experience. It is a far more direct and real relationship to the self than a far removed intellectual hypothesis of a God being involved.

I have nothing to do.

I have been enlightened to love, against it there is no law than has any effect. No atheist complaining can change it either

I was set free.

You are not, however.

I was free to reject the inconsistencies and incoherencies that you slave under. So much so that you block them out as much as possible to protect your personal enjoyment of whatever is left.

 

[treeplanter]

Well, if you don't actually care about the truth, then my opinion is utterly irrelevant.



I've already given you the truth.
Your continued demand for a yes/no response is definitive proof to me that you lack the necessary tools to reason clearly.

Steve, do you believe that it is morally acceptable to consciously and purposefully inflict needless harm upon another?

Yes or no?

 

[SteveB]

Steve, do you believe that it is morally acceptable to consciously and purposefully inflict needless harm upon another?

Yes or no?

I've already given you the truth.
Your continued demand for a yes/no response is definitive proof to me that you lack the necessary tools to reason clearly.

The previous time you asked me this, your post was edited by mgmt.

You really should learn the lessons you're being given the opportunity to learn.

 

[Furion]

Nope... only took 5 seconds for me to convict myself. This is how conscience works in navigating the world we experience.

Good then, I'll just ignore all your complaining till the time comes.

I was free to reject the inconsistencies and incoherencies that you slave under. So much so that you block them out as much as possible to protect your personal enjoyment of whatever is left.

Considering you fulfill your daily quest of opposing God, and you post it for all to see, I would say it's impossible to ignore rants about some alleged inconsistency you've discovered.

If you also discover a good reason why you will not fail your judgement, that has come from your own heart, let me know.

As of now you can fight, squirm and spit fire, but nothing will change in the end. The only way to change that ending is if Christ changes it for you. You'll have to ask Him.

 

[mikeT]

So again how is it a threat to you?

A threat involves the intent of the threatener, not the understanding of the threatened.

A co-worker says to me "I'm gonna go get a cup of coffee", knowing full well that I'm deathly allergic to it. I report him to the police as having threatened me. The police then question him, and find out he always takes a coffee break at that exact time - and thus dismiss my claim.

If threats were about how the threatened person feels, my co-worker would be charged with a misdemeanor, and probably get fired.

You asking how claims about God are a threat to atheists entirely misses the ball. Threatening an atheist with hellfire is a threat, regardless of whether the atheist believes it or not.

 

[treeplanter]

I've already given you the truth.
Your continued demand for a yes/no response is definitive proof to me that you lack the necessary tools to reason clearly.

The previous time you asked me this, your post was edited by mgmt.

You really should learn the lessons you're being given the opportunity to learn.

Steve, does 'truth' include the belief that it is morally acceptable to consciously and purposefully inflict needless harm upon another?

Yes or no?

 

[SteveB]

Steve, does 'truth' include the belief that it is morally acceptable to consciously and purposefully inflict needless harm upon another?

Yes or no?

I've already given you the truth.
Your continued demand for a yes/no response is definitive proof to me that you lack the necessary tools to reason clearly.

 

[treeplanter]

I've already given you the truth.
Your continued demand for a yes/no response is definitive proof to me that you lack the necessary tools to reason clearly.

Yes, Steve - let's reason, shall we!

Step one:
Define the parameters of your beliefs

Does 'truth', as you comprehend it, include the belief that it is morally acceptable to consciously and purposefully inflict needless harm upon another?

Yes or no?

 

[SteveB]

Yes, Steve - let's reason, shall we!

Step one:
Define the parameters of your beliefs

Does 'truth', as you comprehend it, include the belief that it is morally acceptable to consciously and purposefully inflict needless harm upon another?

Yes or no?

I've already given you the truth.
Your continued demand for a yes/no response is definitive proof to me that you lack the necessary tools to reason clearly.

 

[treeplanter]

I've already given you the truth.
Your continued demand for a yes/no response is definitive proof to me that you lack the necessary tools to reason clearly.

As usual, you make absolutely no sense

Wanting to establish, with absolute certainty, the actual position of one's interlocutor is NOT definitive proof of an inability to reason!

To the contrary, it is a prerequisite of reasoning with clarity
I can neither agree with you or disagree with you until I made aware of what it is that you are saying, Steve

I believe that it is not morally acceptable to consciously and purposefully inflict needless harm upon another

What do you believe?

Is it morally acceptable to consciously and purposefully inflict needless harm upon another?
Yes or no?

 

[SteveB]

As usual, you make absolutely no sense

Wanting to establish, with absolute certainty, the actual position of one's interlocutor is NOT definitive proof of an inability to reason!

To the contrary, it is a prerequisite of reasoning with clarity
I can neither agree with you or disagree with you until I made aware of what it is that you are saying, Steve

I believe that it is not morally acceptable to consciously and purposefully inflict needless harm upon another

What do you believe?

Is it morally acceptable to consciously and purposefully inflict needless harm upon another?
Yes or no?

I've been explaining to you what I believe for the past several years now.
It's not rocket science.

Jesus said that unless we become as a little child we shall by no means enter the Kingdom of God.
So, if since he's clearly stated that he's made it simple enough for a child to understand, there's nothing about it that makes no sense.

As such.....

I've already given you the truth.
Your continued demand for a yes/no response is definitive proof to me that you lack the necessary tools to reason clearly.

 

[stiggy wiggy]

Is it morally acceptable to consciously and purposefully inflict needless harm upon another?

First answer this;

Is it immorally unacceptable to unconsciously and purposelessly withhold needed benefits upon oneself?

 

[treeplanter]

I've been explaining to you what I believe for the past several years now.
It's not rocket science.

Jesus said that unless we become as a little child we shall by no means enter the Kingdom of God.
So, if since he's clearly stated that he's made it simple enough for a child to understand, there's nothing about it that makes no sense.

As such.....

I've already given you the truth.
Your continued demand for a yes/no response is definitive proof to me that you lack the necessary tools to reason clearly.

Get THIS through your head, Steve!

I am not asking what you think truth is
I am not asking you what you believe about God

I am not talking about God, at all

It's an exceedingly straightforward question that is answerable with a simple YES or NO

Do you believe that it is morally acceptable to consciously and purposefully inflict needless harm upon another human being?
Yes or no???

You know what harm is

You know the difference between harm that is needed in order to provide a greater good
and
harm that is not needed in the course of effecting a greater good

This isn't rocket science, Steve
Just answer the question!


You are the most frustrating person I've ever encountered:

I ask you if you prefer enchiladas or burritos and you respond with:
"I already told you"

I ask you if you prefer enchiladas or burritos and you respond with:
"I've already given you the truth"

I ask you if you prefer enchiladas or burritos and you respond with:
"Jesus said that unless we become as a little child we shall by no means enter the Kingdom of God.
So, if since he's clearly stated that he's made it simple enough for a child to understand, there's nothing about it that makes no sense"


Again, listen to what I am telling you, Steve!

This has NOTHING to do with your definition of truth
This has NOTHING to do with God

I want to know what you believe as pertaining needless harm

Is it morally acceptable, in your opinion, to consciously and purposefully inflict needless harm upon another?

YES???
or
NO???

 

[treeplanter]

First answer this;

Is it immorally unacceptable to unconsciously and purposelessly withhold needed benefits upon oneself?

Steve doesn't get it

You're just a troll