Reducing God to the truth and reality.

Electric Skeptic

Well-known member
You have not shown that I "do not understand it" silly.
I don't have to: you do that.
You can't know any truth without a believing mind silly.
Not at issue. Your claim that I "have been so deceived by your unbelief that the truth and reality is unknowable to you" is falsified by the fact that I know infinitely many truths. You consistently ignore this fact, because it falsifies all of your nonsense.
 

Tercon

Well-known member
I don't have to: you do that.

No, you just use your mind for deluding yourself rather than believing the truth.

Not at issue. Your claim that I "have been so deceived by your unbelief that the truth and reality is unknowable to you" is falsified by the fact that I know infinitely many truths. You consistently ignore this fact, because it falsifies all of your nonsense.

You don't and can't know reality without believing it first silly. How can you know the truth and reality without believing first in how and why the truth and reality is known to you? And you can't do that without first believing that belief is necessary and must occur before the truth and reality is known to you. That's how the truth and reality works, the truth and reality doesn't need to consult your opinion or feelings in order to make itself known to you, all it requires is your belief. And without it you get to wallow around in a delusion for eternity devoid of the presences of His truth and reality.
 

Nouveau

Well-known member
That's how the truth and reality works... all it requires is your belief.
Wrong again. Knowledge requires more than just belief. It also requires truth and justification.

This has been explained to you consistently and repeatedly for over ten years. Will you ever learn?
 

Electric Skeptic

Well-known member
No, you just use your mind for deluding yourself rather than believing the truth.
You don't and can't know reality without believing it first silly. How can you know the truth and reality without believing first in how and why the truth and reality is known to you? And you can't do that without first believing that belief is necessary and must occur before the truth and reality is known to you. That's how the truth and reality works, the truth and reality doesn't need to consult your opinion or feelings in order to make itself known to you, all it requires is your belief. And without it you get to wallow around in a delusion for eternity devoid of the presences of His truth and reality.
The same as usual. Avoid and ignore the refutations of your falsehoods and later claim they weren't made. This is an excellent example. You completely ignore what I said and instead go on a rant that I've stated nothing about.

Your claim that I "have been so deceived by your unbelief that the truth and reality is unknowable to you" is falsified by the fact that I know infinitely many truths. You consistently ignore this fact, because it falsifies all of your nonsense.
 

Tercon

Well-known member
The same as usual. Avoid and ignore the refutations of your falsehoods and later claim they weren't made. This is an excellent example. You completely ignore what I said and instead go on a rant that I've stated nothing about.

Evasion and projection. Deal with what's be said to you before you starting to rant silly.

Your claim that I "have been so deceived by your unbelief that the truth and reality is unknowable to you" is falsified by the fact that I know infinitely many truths. You consistently ignore this fact, because it falsifies all of your nonsense.

Nothing can be known to exist or occur without a believing mind in order to exist and occur in and with.
 

Electric Skeptic

Well-known member
Evasion and projection. Deal with what's be said to you before you starting to rant silly.
You have yet to deal with what has been said to you, so don't try to accuse me of something you've done.
Nothing can be known to exist or occur without a believing mind in order to exist and occur in and with.
Irrelevant.

Why do you keep failing to address what is said to you?

Your claim that I "have been so deceived by your unbelief that the truth and reality is unknowable to you" is falsified by the fact that I know infinitely many truths. You consistently ignore this fact, because it falsifies all of your nonsense.
 

Tercon

Well-known member
You have yet to deal with what has been said to you, so don't try to accuse me of something you've done.

I have. And you still done it. I am showing how and why the truth and reality is known and you are not.

Irrelevant.

Your opinion as to it's relevant is "irrelevant" silly, because what I said is true and that's the only point I was trying to make.

Nothing can be known to exist or occur without a believing mind in order to exist and occur in and with.

Why do you keep failing to address what is said to you?

I don't. You have just closed your mind to the truth with your unbelief.

Your claim that I "have been so deceived by your unbelief that the truth and reality is unknowable to you" is falsified by the fact that I know infinitely many truths. You consistently ignore this fact, because it falsifies all of your nonsense.

You know nothing about the truth and reality if you disbelieve that belief is the only thing that can make the truth and reality known to you. If you think there is something else other than belief and a believing mind that makes the truth and reality possible, then say what you know that other thing is that doesn't rely on a believing mind for its existence and occurrence.
 

Nouveau

Well-known member
Nothing can be known to exist or occur without a believing mind in order to exist and occur in and with.
Unsupported and false. Things that are real rather than imaginary can exist and occur in mind-independent objective reality regardless of what any minds do or do not believe about them. That's what makes them real.
 

Electric Skeptic

Well-known member
That is blatantly false. You have not dealt with the fact that your claims that the truth and reality are unknowable to me are falsified by the fact that I know infinitely many truths.

And you still done it. I am showing how and why the truth and reality is known and you are not.
Does not make sense.
Your opinion as to it's relevant is "irrelevant" silly, because what I said is true and that's the only point I was trying to make.
False. You have tried to make a number of other points and, when they are refuted, simply ignore the refutation.
Nothing can be known to exist or occur without a believing mind in order to exist and occur in and with.
Not at issue.
Yes, you do. Constantly.
You have just closed your mind to the truth with your unbelief.
Again falsified by the fact that I know infinitely many truths.
You know nothing about the truth and reality if you disbelieve that belief is the only thing that can make the truth and reality known to you. If you think there is something else other than belief and a believing mind that makes the truth and reality possible, then say what you know that other thing is that doesn't rely on a believing mind for its existence and occurrence.
All strawman and irrelevant.

Address what I stated.

You claim that the truth and reality are unknowable to me. That claim is falsified by the fact that I know infinitely many truths.
 

Tercon

Well-known member
God cannot be ‘reduced’

Strawman. I am not reducing God in His omniscience or prominence in regards to our dependence on Him, rather I am showing how and why God can still be known by His children. And reduction isn't always a bad thing, in this case it is God reducing the lies and deceptions so the believer can see the truth and reality for what IT really is and how and why God is God.

When God is reduced to the truth and reality in our minds, only then can we begin to know and understand how and why God is God, because there is only ONE way and place the truth and reality can be known to exist and occur, and that is in and with His Believing Mind. And outside of His Believing Mind, nothing exists or occurs.
 

Tercon

Well-known member
i don’t agree with your reduction.

Do you think God being the originator of the truth and reality itself is some kind of downgrade or reduction of God in your mind?

And just where else do you know of that believers can know and experience God outside of a believing mind?

of course we can understand Him, if He allows, but that does not require reduction..

How can you understand Him without knowing how He is God?
 
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