Regeneration - A NT Doctrine

JDS

Well-known member
One cannot be "regenerated" until he is "generated." What does regenerated mean? Well, it means to be born anew. The word is used once in the NT in the context of people being born again and once in the context of the creation being restored to it's pristine condition as at the first. It is a New Testament doctrine because the agent of the New birth for both men and God's creation is Jesus Christ, the son of God, and the work he did in his incarnation and his cross and resurrection.

Let me establish in a couple of verses something about all of us.

Gen 5:1 This is the book of the generations of Adam. In the day that God created man, in the likeness of God made he him;
2 Male and female created he them; and blessed them, and called their name Adam, in the day when they were created.

Rom 5:12 Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:
Gen 5:3 And Adam lived an hundred and thirty years, and begat a son in his own likeness, and after his image; and called his name Seth:

It is important to know that Seth was by nature like Adam, after he sinned, and God was nowhere around when Seth was generated. Seth was a son of Adam, not a son of God. Adam, however, was the son of God, not by birth, but by creation. He had the Spirit of God in him from his creation and the Spirit is what made him the son of God. Lk 3:38. All the family of Adam from then until now are like Adam after he sinned. They do not have God indwelling them in the person of his Spirit. They are not like God. Because all the family of Adam are like him and all are generated through him and are in his family, he is the federal head of his own race. Nothing can change that. Because they are by nature like the sinning Adam there is no power in them to resist sin. They are dead spiritually, which only means they, like Adam, do not have God in them. It does not mean they cannot hear God speak from the outside of them, but it does mean they do not have him in them to speak to them and give them his inherent power and life as a possession.

But, what if God could produce a birth of a man where he was born both of Adam and of God? What if this person could receive his physical body through Adam's race and the Spirit from God? Would he then be like Adam before he sinned who was created like God and in his image? Yes, he could. And what if he was guided always in everything he did, great or small, by the Spirit of God that was a part of his being that he received from his Father? What if he was tempted in all points like as all Adam's race is, yet without sin? What if the words he spoke were always given him by God and this was made possible because the Spirit in him was omnipresent and was in God, his Father, and him, at the same time, time and distance being no obstacle for communications? What if all his power to do right came from his spiritual being and none came from his flesh? Answer. He would do always those things that please the Father and would never sin. He would by choice never act independently of his Father. He would be perfect.

So, Jesus Christ is a partaker of humanity through his mother and is physical. Yet he is different from any man who ever lived since Adam in that he has the Spirit from his Father, God. He has power over sin. I will post just two verses to demonstrate this, though I could post many.

John 1:4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men.
Jn 3:34 For he whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God: for God giveth not the Spirit by measure unto him.

Now we see that the Spirit is the life of God. As commentary, life in the physical is in the blood. The life of God is the Spirit. Adam's race has life in the blood but not life in the Spirit. Men who are born into the family of Adam are the sons of man. Those who are born into the family of God by the Spirit of God are sons of God. Jesus Christ is called both, son of man and son of God at his first coming. Through his mother he is in the "generation" of Adam. Through his Father he is the "only" begotten of him. Begotten means born. He is the only man who was ever born this way.

Matt 1:1The book of the "generation" of Jesus Christ, the son of David, the son of Abraham.

Luke 1:30 And the angel said unto her, Fear not, Mary: for thou hast found favour with God.
31 And, behold, thou shalt conceive in thy womb, and bring forth a son, and shalt call his name Jesus.
32 He shall be great, and shall be called the Son of the Highest:

Now that Jesus Christ has been tested as the son of man through all the temptations that are common to Adam's race and through weakness of the flesh and has not sinned, can he be a substitute and endure the penalty for the sin of all of Adam's race, which is death and forever separation from God? The answer is yes, that is why he came. Adam's race can occupy the world and live here until they die physically, but they cannot stay here. They must go somewhere and without the Spirit they cannot go where God is. They must go somewhere where God is not, and the only place where the omnipresent God has chosen not to be is in hell. That is the wages of sin. A thrice holy God cannot fellowship with sin and because of his holy nature God must punish sin and put it away before fellowship with any man is possible.

This is what happened with the sacrifice of the holy Jesus Christ.

Jn 1:29 The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.
He 9:26 For then must he often have suffered since the foundation of the world: but now once in the end of the world hath he appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself.

We know that Jesus Christ rose from the dead on the third day. He was dead. His soul came out of paradise in the center of the earth, the Spirit came back from God who gave it, and the Spirit quickened him by raising his body and glorifying it. Sin is paid for at this moment. God is propitiated for the sins of Adam's race. All sinners have been reconciled by this death of Christ. Jesus Christ is the firstborn from the dead and the federal head of a new family, the family of God. Any of Adam's race can be forgiven of their sins now and all of Adam's race may be forgiven of their sins. I am going to post some scriptures here for consideration.

Acts 2:31
He seeing this before spake of the resurrection of Christ, that his soul was not left in hell, neither his flesh did see corruption.
Rom 8:11 But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you,

Rom 8:29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
Col 1:18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
Rom 1:3 Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh; (his first birth)
4 And declared to be the Son of God with power, according to the spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead: (his second birth)
Psa 2:7 I will declare the decree: the Lord hath said unto me, Thou art my Son; this day have I begotten thee. (at the resurrection)
Acts 13:23 Of this man's seed hath God according to his promise raised unto Israel a Saviour, Jesus: (his first birth)
Acts 13:33 God hath fulfilled the same unto us their children, in that he hath raised up Jesus again; as it is also written in the second psalm, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee. (his second birth)

Continued
 

JDS

Well-known member
Continued

1 Cor 15:20 But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept.
1 Cor 15:21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead. (Adam=first to die - Spirit left him) - (Christ first to be made alive - Spirit raised him)
1 Cor 15:45a And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul;
1 Cor 15:45b the last Adam was made a quickening (life giving) spirit.
1 Cor 15:46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.
1 Cor 15:49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.

The purpose of the above verses is to show That the Spirit is who raised the body of Jesus from the dead, and his indwelling his body quickened it. God called this a birth. The first birth of this kind of which there will be many following. Jesus Christ is the firstborn from the dead. He is quickened by the Spirit, so says God in his book. There is no blood in this glorified body. The Spirit is the life that is in it. Jesus Christ is the head of a new family and all in Adam who will believe in him will be given his life giving Spirit and eventually a body like his glorious body.

Eph 1:22 And hath put all things under his feet, and gave him to be the head over all things to the church,
23 Which is his body, the fulness of him that filleth all in all.


Eph 3:14 For this cause I bow my knees unto the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ,
15 Of whom the whole family in heaven and earth is named,


16 That he would grant you, according to the riches of his glory, to be strengthened with might by his Spirit in the inner man;
17 That Christ may dwell in your hearts by faith; that ye, being rooted and grounded in love,
18 May be able to comprehend with all saints what is the breadth, and length, and depth, and height;
19 And to know the love of Christ, which passeth knowledge, that ye might be filled with all the fulness of God.

2 Cor 5:17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature

Receiving the Spirit is the definition of regeneration. It is made possible by our Lord Jesus Christ dying for us and shedding his blood on the cross, rising from the dead, and ascending back to heaven, where he poured out his life giving Spirit as a gift over the whole world to as many as will receive it by faith.

Jn 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: A new birth
Rom 8:14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.
16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit (our soul), that we are the children of God:

Rom 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.

Rom 8:10 And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.

The blood has been shed. The sins of Adam put away. The life giving Spirit has been poured out. God has been reconciled to sinful man and is no longer angry. The Spirit of God will regenerate, save, any who will freely come through faith in Christ and God. They will be born again. No limits. No pre-choices of God. Whosoever will, let him come and take of the water of life freely. Re 22:17
 
T

TomFL

Guest
Continued

1 Cor 15:20 But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept.
1 Cor 15:21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead. (Adam=first to die - Spirit left him) - (Christ first to be made alive - Spirit raised him)
1 Cor 15:45a And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul;
1 Cor 15:45b the last Adam was made a quickening (life giving) spirit.
1 Cor 15:46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.
1 Cor 15:49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.

The purpose of the above verses is to show That the Spirit is who raised the body of Jesus from the dead, and his indwelling his body quickened it. God called this a birth. The first birth of this kind of which there will be many following. Jesus Christ is the firstborn from the dead. He is quickened by the Spirit, so says God in his book. There is no blood in this glorified body. The Spirit is the life that is in it. Jesus Christ is the head of a new family and all in Adam who will believe in him will be given his life giving Spirit and eventually a body like his glorious body.

Eph 1:22 And hath put all things under his feet, and gave him to be the head over all things to the church,
23 Which is his body, the fulness of him that filleth all in all.


Eph 3:14 For this cause I bow my knees unto the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ,
15 Of whom the whole family in heaven and earth is named,


16 That he would grant you, according to the riches of his glory, to be strengthened with might by his Spirit in the inner man;
17 That Christ may dwell in your hearts by faith; that ye, being rooted and grounded in love,
18 May be able to comprehend with all saints what is the breadth, and length, and depth, and height;
19 And to know the love of Christ, which passeth knowledge, that ye might be filled with all the fulness of God.

2 Cor 5:17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature

Receiving the Spirit is the definition of regeneration. It is made possible by our Lord Jesus Christ dying for us and shedding his blood on the cross, rising from the dead, and ascending back to heaven, where he poured out his life giving Spirit as a gift over the whole world to as many as will receive it by faith.

Jn 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: A new birth

Regeneration is through the gospel

James 1:18 (NASB)
18 In the exercise of His will He brought us forth by the word of truth, so that we would be a kind of first fruits among His creatures.


1 Peter 1:23 (NASB)
23 for you have been born again not of seed which is perishable but imperishable, that is, through the living and enduring word of God.



1 Corinthians 4:15 (KJV)
15 For though ye have ten thousand instructors in Christ, yet have ye not many fathers: for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel.

Predicated on the Resurrection of Christ

Romans 6:4 (KJV)
4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.

Colossians 2:12, 13 (KJV)
12 Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.
13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;

Concurrent with the indwelling of the Holy Spirit

Ezekiel 36:25-27 (KJV)
25 Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you.
26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.
27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.

Only in Christ

1 John 5:12 (KJV)
12 He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life.

Becoming a New Creation



2 Corinthians 5:17 (KJV)
17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.



New Life

John 20:31 (KJV)
31 But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name.

John 5:24 (KJV)
24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
Regeneration is through the gospel

James 1:18 (NASB)
18 In the exercise of His will He brought us forth by the word of truth, so that we would be a kind of first fruits among His creatures.


1 Peter 1:23 (NASB)
23 for you have been born again not of seed which is perishable but imperishable, that is, through the living and enduring word of God.



1 Corinthians 4:15 (KJV)
15 For though ye have ten thousand instructors in Christ, yet have ye not many fathers: for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel.

Predicated on the Resurrection of Christ

Romans 6:4 (KJV)
4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.

Colossians 2:12, 13 (KJV)
12 Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.
13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;

Concurrent with the indwelling of the Holy Spirit

Ezekiel 36:25-27 (KJV)
25 Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you.
26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.
27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.

Only in Christ

1 John 5:12 (KJV)
12 He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life.

Becoming a New Creation



2 Corinthians 5:17 (KJV)
17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.



New Life

John 20:31 (KJV)
31 But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name.

John 5:24 (KJV)
24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.
Technically regeneration is when the elect in Christ rose together with Him when He was risen from the dead. Eph 2:5-6

5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved)

6 And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:

Christs life from the dead is the regeneration. The word is a noun, a person, place or thing

This proves both election, and vital union with Christ when He both died and rose from the dead.
 
T

TomFL

Guest
Technically regeneration is when the elect in Christ rose together with Him when He was risen from the dead. Eph 2:5-6

5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved)

6 And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:

Christs life from the dead is the regeneration. The word is a noun, a person, place or thing

This proves both election, and vital union with Christ when He both died and rose from the dead.
You did not exist then

Men are raised here

Col. 2:12–13 —ESV
“having been buried with him in baptism, in which you were also raised with him through faith in the powerful working of God, who raised him from the dead.
And you, who were dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made alive together with him, having forgiven us all our trespasses,”
 

civic

Well-known member
@JDS

the OP debunked with one passage below:

1 Peter
Concerning this salvation, the prophets, who spoke of the grace that was to come to you, searched intently and with the greatest care, 11 trying to find out the time and circumstances to which the Spirit of Christ in them was pointing when he predicted the sufferings of the Messiah and the glories that would follow

hope this helps !!!
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
You did not exist then

Men are raised here

Col. 2:12–13 —ESV
“having been buried with him in baptism, in which you were also raised with him through faith in the powerful working of God, who raised him from the dead.
And you, who were dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made alive together with him, having forgiven us all our trespasses,”
You put reason above revelation.
 

armylngst

Well-known member
That your methodology

I quote scripture

you quote your theology
You are isolating verses, and then giving your theology, instead of actual scripture.
Colossians 3
"11 In him also you were circumcised with a circumcision made without hands, by putting off the body of the flesh, by the circumcision of Christ, 12 having been buried with him in baptism, in which you were also raised with him through faith in the powerful working of God, who raised him from the dead. 13 And you, who were dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made alive together with him, having forgiven us all our trespasses, 14 by canceling the record of debt that stood against us with its legal demands. This he set aside, nailing it to the cross. 15 He disarmed the rulers and authorities[b] and put them to open shame, by triumphing over them in him.[c]"

So how long have you believed in baptismal regeneration?
 
T

TomFL

Guest
You are isolating verses, and then giving your theology, instead of actual scripture.
Colossians 3
"11 In him also you were circumcised with a circumcision made without hands, by putting off the body of the flesh, by the circumcision of Christ, 12 having been buried with him in baptism, in which you were also raised with him through faith in the powerful working of God, who raised him from the dead. 13 And you, who were dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made alive together with him, having forgiven us all our trespasses, 14 by canceling the record of debt that stood against us with its legal demands. This he set aside, nailing it to the cross. 15 He disarmed the rulers and authorities[b] and put them to open shame, by triumphing over them in him.[c]"

So how long have you believed in baptismal regeneration?
Have you never heard of baptism en the holy Ghost

1 Cor. 12:13
“For en (greek) one Spirit we were all baptized into one body—Jews or Greeks, slaves or free—and all were made to drink of one Spirit.”

You would do yourself a favor if you would not assume what I believe

water does not regenerate
 

JDS

Well-known member
th
@JDS

the OP debunked with one passage below:

1 Peter
Concerning this salvation, the prophets, who spoke of the grace that was to come to you, searched intently and with the greatest care, 11 trying to find out the time and circumstances to which the Spirit of Christ in them was pointing when he predicted the sufferings of the Messiah and the glories that would follow

hope this helps !!!
Civic, Civic, the Bible is just a book of religion to you and really means nothing. You seem to not be able to grasp the purpose of God to bring salvation to those who do not have it. You recognize no divisions in the working out of God's plan and you do not acknowledge a difference between times and purpose that is divided by the cross of Jesus Christ and his resurrection from the dead. You can't seem to make any kind of logical application to any text of scriptures apart from presuppositions that you have adopted that exalts no one but you, as some sort of special elected individual.

Would you just ask yourself the question of why Peter would have written a letter to someone in the region of Asia minor in the first century talking about what "prophets" had written. What would they know about what prophets of Israel had written? UNLESS, they were of Israel and still read and followed the OT writings? Looking at the salutation of Peter might be a hint to whom these words would at least initially apply.

Isn't it strange that Paul wrote 13 letters to gentiles and did not appeal to the prophets when he preached the glorious gospel of salvation through Christ. God did not prophesy anything to gentile nations in the OT times. The promises he makes to gentiles is through Jesus Christ and his death and resurrection. Jesus Christ was a Jew. He was the seed of Abraham through whom the nations would be blessed. We can and should accept what God has offered to us but we should not be arrogant enough to think that he has promised us anything. His offer to us is through his mercy and grace. He had pity on us. He went to great lengths to showcase this attribute of his character and you guys rub it out on a daily basis, and you are not guiltless because of it.

The ignorance that you Calvinists demonstrate here daily is overwhelming and the way you all present him tells me that he must come back soon and put a stop to it.
 

civic

Well-known member
th

Civic, Civic, the Bible is just a book of religion to you and really means nothing. You seem to not be able to grasp the purpose of God to bring salvation to those who do not have it. You recognize no divisions in the working out of God's plan and you do not acknowledge a difference between times and purpose that is divided by the cross of Jesus Christ and his resurrection from the dead. You can't seem to make any kind of logical application to any text of scriptures apart from presuppositions that you have adopted that exalts no one but you, as some sort of special elected individual.

Would you just ask yourself the question of why Peter would have written a letter to someone in the region of Asia minor in the first century talking about what "prophets" had written. What would they know about what prophets of Israel had written? UNLESS, they were of Israel and still read and followed the OT writings? Looking at the salutation of Peter might be a hint to whom these words would at least initially apply.

Isn't it strange that Paul wrote 13 letters to gentiles and did not appeal to the prophets when he preached the glorious gospel of salvation through Christ. God did not prophesy anything to gentile nations in the OT times. The promises he makes to gentiles is through Jesus Christ and his death and resurrection. Jesus Christ was a Jew. He was the seed of Abraham through whom the nations would be blessed. We can and should accept what God has offered to us but we should not be arrogant enough to think that he has promised us anything. His offer to us is through his mercy and grace. He had pity on us. He went to great lengths to showcase this attribute of his character and you guys rub it out on a daily basis, and you are not guiltless because of it.

The ignorance that you Calvinists demonstrate here daily is overwhelming and the way you all present him tells me that he must come back soon and put a stop to it.
ad hominem attack a sure sign of defeat when one cannot make a cogent reply to the argument and attacks the person.

hope this helps !!!
 

Theo1689

Well-known member
th

Civic, Civic, the Bible is just a book of religion to you and really means nothing.

<sigh>

This is why nobody here takes you seriously.

All you do is insult people who disagree with your garbage.

The ignorance that you Calvinists demonstrate here daily is overwhelming

The arrogance that anti-Calvinists demonstrate here daily is overwhelming.
 

JDS

Well-known member
ad hominem attack a sure sign of defeat when one cannot make a cogent reply to the argument and attacks the person.

hope this helps !!!
It is not an attack. It is the truth. It is the way it is. These letters are still the letters that teach us about God. They have not been ungraded in 2000 years. Acts is still the history of the beginning of the Christian church. It is a new thing in the earth. Men are being saved by the blood of Christ washing away their sins and receiving the Spirit of God Titus 3:5. God is giving the Spirit of Christ from heaven as a gift. He is life and eternal. He is an eternal gift to those who receive him by faith in the shed blood of Jesus Christ, the only thing that can wash away sins. He is a possession of a man when he receives him. He is a person. He is God. He was in Jesus Christ from his birth. He was in no other OT person as a possession. OT people had sin in them. The Spirit could not dwell in any man and give him eternal life with his presence in them.

The ministry of God the Holy Spirit was not the same in the OT as it it in the NT. The New Testament is the new testament in the blood of Christ. There is a difference.

My op defines the doctrine of regeneration.
 

armylngst

Well-known member
Have you never heard of baptism en the holy Ghost

1 Cor. 12:13
“For en (greek) one Spirit we were all baptized into one body—Jews or Greeks, slaves or free—and all were made to drink of one Spirit.”

You would do yourself a favor if you would not assume what I believe

water does not regenerate
Why sure, but even you know that that is not what the previous verse you gave was talking about. The only way to use the verse you used is to believe in baptismal regeneration, or understand that verse has nothing to do with what you were talking about. However, if you do that, it undercuts all of your arguments that also misuse scripture.
 
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TomFL

Guest
Why sure, but even you know that that is not what the previous verse you gave was talking about. The only way to use the verse you used is to believe in baptismal regeneration, or understand that verse has nothing to do with what you were talking about. However, if you do that, it undercuts all of your arguments that also misuse scripture.
Sorry that is just your opinion

Colossians 3
"11 In him also you were circumcised with a circumcision made without hands, by putting off the body of the flesh, by the circumcision of Christ, 12 having been buried with him in baptism, in which you were also raised with him through faith in the powerful working of God, who raised him from the dead. 13 And you, who were dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made alive together with him, having forgiven us all our trespasses, 14 by canceling the record of debt that stood against us with its legal demands. This he set aside, nailing it to the cross. 15 He disarmed the rulers and authorities[b] and put them to open shame, by triumphing over them in him.[c]"

Just as the circumcision was spiritual and not the literal cutting of flesh so also the baptism was spiritual
 

JDS

Well-known member
<sigh>

This is why nobody here takes you seriously.

All you do is insult people who disagree with your garbage.



The arrogance that anti-Calvinists demonstrate here daily is overwhelming.
The church has not responded correctly towards Reformed doctrines. The system is no more Christian than Mormonism and Russellism. The foundations of the Christian faith are attacked by it. This is proven by your comment here. You say my commentary on the scriptures are garbage. They are not. I have continually exalted the Lord Jesus Christ, my Lord and Savior. He is preeminent in my thinking. He is the beginning and ending of the church. Some ethereal choosing and pre-salvation is not taught in the scriptures. If someone is saved from their sins it is because Jesus Christ, God, came in the form of a man and lived perfectly to please God and then died for the sins of all men and rose again and they have put their trust in him after they heard the gospel, the good news that men may be saved through him. This business that most men on this planet have been created for the express purpose of the pleasure of God to cast them into an eternal hell is not good news for them and you insult heaven and earth by teaching such a thing and calling it good news to men. Blaming God for men not being saved because he hates them is not scriptural. There is no way to justify that kind of teaching.

Jesus said he would build his church and the gates of hell would not prevail against it. Then, 1500 years later, after the church was firmly established upon himself, planted in the ground as the cornerstone of it, the foundation of the Jewish apostles laid as the foundation and, finally the framework of the Jews and gentiles as the "living" stones, who will believe, being laid on it to, get this, be the habitation of the Spirit of God, and someone comes along and says it needs reforming. The false Catholic church is what needed reforming. Calvinism is the result of that.

13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off (that would be gentiles in context)are made nigh by the blood of Christ.

14 For he is our peace, who hath made both (Jews & Gentile) one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us; (Paul was a Jew addressing gentiles)

15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;



16 And that he might reconcile both (Jews &Gentiles) unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:

17 And came and preached peace to you which were afar off (the gentiles), and to them that were nigh (the Jews).

18 For through him we both (Jew & Gentile) have access by one Spirit unto the Father.

19 Now therefore ye (gentile believers) are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens (see Verse 11-12) with the saints (Jewish believers), and of the household of God;

20 And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, (this is 83 preachers with sign gifts) Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone;

21 In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord: (the operative word is groweth)

22 In whom ye (gentiles) also are builded together (with the Jews who were first) for an habitation of God through the Spirit.

The way God can inhabit the corporate body is by giving each member the Spirit and then when they are together, each of them have the indwelling Spirit, eternal life.

1 Cor 6:19 What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?

Ep 2:4 There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;

13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
14 That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;
15 But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ:
16 From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love.

The Spirit of God is in the spiritual what water is in the physical. No living thing can survive without it. The water is life to the physical and is poured out in such abundance that any and all may drink and live. God has likewise made a one time pouring out of his Spirit from heaven, like rainwater, in such abundance that every thirsty soul may drink and live eternally. One drink is all it takes but one must drink once. Both are poured out in such abundance that it is always available and free of charge. In hell, there is no water and everyone there is dead, forever separated from God.

Jn 7:37 In the last day, that great day of the feast, Jesus stood and cried, saying, If any man thirst, let him come unto me, and drink.
38 He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.
39 (But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified)

Re 22:17 And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.

If you would read and consider this true doctrine of regeneration it would help you a lot.
 

Theo1689

Well-known member
The church has not responded correctly towards Reformed doctrines.

<Chuckle>
Thanks for today's laugh!

Your opinion and a $100 would buy a mediocre $1.50 cup of coffee.

The system is no more Christian than Mormonism and Russellism.

<Chuckle>

So you believe Calvinists aren't saved.
Got it. (Not that we care about your opinion).
I hope you never sing, "Amazing Grace". (It was written by one of dem evil "Calvinists").
Or "Rock of Ages", for that matter....

The foundations of the Christian faith are attacked by it.

Even TomFL can tell you that's false.
I have continually exalted the Lord Jesus Christ, my Lord and Savior. He is preeminent in my thinking.

The fact that you summarily condemn Reformed brothers in Christ prove that you do NOT "exalt the Lord Jesus Christ". So you have been caught in an untruth.

This business that most men on this planet have been created for the express purpose of the pleasure of God to cast them into an eternal hell is not good news for them

The gospel was NEVER meant to be "good news" for unrepentant sinners.

It never ceases to amaze me how anti-Calvinists set themselves up to be advocates for the enemies of God.

and you insult heaven and earth by teaching such a thing and calling it good news to men.

Sorry, but you are not God.
You do NOT get to make proclamations of what allegedly "insults heaven and earth".
Get over yourself.

Blaming God for men not being saved because he hates them is not scriptural.

Then it's a good thing that Calvinists do NOT teach that.
1) Calvinists do NOT "blame God for men not being saved". We recognize that the reason they are not saved is because of THEIR OWN SINS.

2) Men are not damned "because God hates them". They are damned because of THEIR OWN SINS.

You really should refrain from making judgments about a theology you are 100% ignorant of.

So like I said before, and like you have just confirmed, your posts ARE nothing but garbage.

If you would read and consider this true doctrine of regeneration it would help you a lot.

I don't accept theology from false teachers like you.
 

civic

Well-known member
The church has not responded correctly towards Reformed doctrines. The system is no more Christian than Mormonism and Russellism. The foundations of the Christian faith are attacked by it. This is proven by your comment here. You say my commentary on the scriptures are garbage. They are not. I have continually exalted the Lord Jesus Christ, my Lord and Savior. He is preeminent in my thinking. He is the beginning and ending of the church. Some ethereal choosing and pre-salvation is not taught in the scriptures. If someone is saved from their sins it is because Jesus Christ, God, came in the form of a man and lived perfectly to please God and then died for the sins of all men and rose again and they have put their trust in him after they heard the gospel, the good news that men may be saved through him. This business that most men on this planet have been created for the express purpose of the pleasure of God to cast them into an eternal hell is not good news for them and you insult heaven and earth by teaching such a thing and calling it good news to men. Blaming God for men not being saved because he hates them is not scriptural. There is no way to justify that kind of teaching.

Jesus said he would build his church and the gates of hell would not prevail against it. Then, 1500 years later, after the church was firmly established upon himself, planted in the ground as the cornerstone of it, the foundation of the Jewish apostles laid as the foundation and, finally the framework of the Jews and gentiles as the "living" stones, who will believe, being laid on it to, get this, be the habitation of the Spirit of God, and someone comes along and says it needs reforming. The false Catholic church is what needed reforming. Calvinism is the result of that.

The church has not responded correctly towards Reformed doctrines. The system is no more Christian than Mormonism and Russellism. The foundations of the Christian faith are attacked by it. This is proven by your comment here. You say my commentary on the scriptures are garbage. They are not. I have continually exalted the Lord Jesus Christ, my Lord and Savior. He is preeminent in my thinking. He is the beginning and ending of the church. Some ethereal choosing and pre-salvation is not taught in the scriptures. If someone is saved from their sins it is because Jesus Christ, God, came in the form of a man and lived perfectly to please God and then died for the sins of all men and rose again and they have put their trust in him after they heard the gospel, the good news that men may be saved through him. This business that most men on this planet have been created for the express purpose of the pleasure of God to cast them into an eternal hell is not good news for them and you insult heaven and earth by teaching such a thing and calling it good news to men. Blaming God for men not being saved because he hates them is not scriptural. There is no way to justify that kind of teaching.

Jesus said he would build his church and the gates of hell would not prevail against it. Then, 1500 years later, after the church was firmly established upon himself, planted in the ground as the cornerstone of it, the foundation of the Jewish apostles laid as the foundation and, finally the framework of the Jews and gentiles as the "living" stones, who will believe, being laid on it to, get this, be the habitation of the Spirit of God, and someone comes along and says it needs reforming. The false Catholic church is what needed reforming. Calvinism is the result of that.
Wow you have just called Arminians, Calvinists, Lutherans, Presbyterians, Baptists all Cults and not saved.

Have you ever considered that you might be the one who is not saved and the rest of the above on the list are saved ?
 

JDS

Well-known member
Wow you have just called Arminians, Calvinists, Lutherans, Presbyterians, Baptists all Cults and not saved.
How so? I said the system is false, not all in the system. Some people are just deceived. Paul said in Ga 1:4 that this is a present evil age.

"The system is no more Christian than Mormonism and Russellism"
All three systems says they are special to God and nobody else is.
 
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