Regeneration through faith

TomFL

Well-known member
Regeneration is the means by which God purifies (cleanses) the heart. In scripture it is likened as going from death to life - spiritual death to spiritual life thus is a resurrection or a raising up

With that in mind

Acts 15:9 —ESV
“and he made no distinction between us and them, having cleansed their hearts by faith.”

Col. 2:12 —ESV
“having been buried with him in baptism, in which you were also raised with him through faith in the powerful working of God, who raised him from the dead.”


The content of faith being the gospel


1 Cor. 4:15 —KJV
“For though ye have ten thousand instructors in Christ, yet have ye not many fathers: for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel.”

James 1:18 —ESV
“Of his own will he brought us forth by the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures.”

1 Pet. 1:23 —ESV
“since you have been born again, not of perishable seed but of imperishable, through the living and abiding word of God;”
 
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ReverendRV

Active member
Regeneration is the means by which God purifies (cleanses) the heart. In scripture it is likened as going from death to life - spiritual death to spiritual life thus is a resurrection or a raising up

With that in mind

Acts 15:9 —ESV
“and he made no distinction between us and them, having cleansed their hearts by faith.”

Col. 2:12 —ESV
“having been buried with him in baptism, in which you were also raised with him through faith in the powerful working of God, who raised him from the dead.”


The content of faith being the gospel


1 Cor. 4:15 —KJV
“For though ye have ten thousand instructors in Christ, yet have ye not many fathers: for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel.”

James 1:18 —ESV
“Of his own will he brought us forth by the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures.”

1 Pet. 1:23 —ESV
“since you have been born again, not of perishable seed but of imperishable, through the living and abiding word of God;”
I think when pressed, all sides will say that Regeneration and Faith (or Faith and Regeneration) occur practically at the same time; so much so, that it's Temporally impossible to tell which came first. We battle and battle every day over which one comes first; IE which comes first Logically. But if we HAVE to argue which comes first 'Logically', the reason for the need to argue Logically is that the assertion is Faith and Regeneration occur so close together, that the argument has to go to 'Plan B' or to a 'Run-Off'; over which one Reasonably occurs first. ~ Of course there is a place for a discussion about the Logical Order; but might it be that when we get to Heaven, it turns out that the Logical Order is also Compatibalistic? If Regeneration and Faith occur practically at the same time, isn't it true that they DO happen at the same time?
 
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TomFL

Well-known member
I think when pressed, all sides will say that Regeneration and Faith (or Faith and Regeneration) occur practically at the same time; so much so, that it's Temporally impossible to tell which came first. We battle and battle every day over which one comes first; IE which comes first Logically. But id we HAVE to argue which comes first 'Logically' the assertion is that Faith and Regeneration occur so close together, that the argument has to go to 'Plan B'; argue over which one Reasonably occurs first. ~ Of course there is a place for a discussion about the Logical Order; but might it be that when we get to Heaven, it turns out that the Logical Order is also Compatibalistic? If Regeneration and Faith occur practically at the same time, isn't it true that they DO happen at the same time?
Temporally yes

Logically according to the verses faith comes first

Faith being a criteria of regeneration according to scripture
 

TomFL

Well-known member
Which came first; Faith or Regeneration when the Scales dropped from Paul's eyes?

It was Paul's physical blindness which was in view here

But Why speculate about Paul when we have clear statements

.................................................................................

Regeneration is the means by which God purifies (cleanses) the heart. In scripture it is likened as going from death to life - spiritual death to spiritual life thus is a resurrection or a raising up

With that in mind

Acts 15:9 —ESV
“and he made no distinction between us and them, having cleansed their hearts by faith.”

Col. 2:12 —ESV
“having been buried with him in baptism, in which you were also raised with him through faith in the powerful working of God, who raised him from the dead.”


The content of faith being the gospel


1 Cor. 4:15 —KJV
“For though ye have ten thousand instructors in Christ, yet have ye not many fathers: for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel.”

James 1:18 —ESV
“Of his own will he brought us forth by the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures.”

1 Pet. 1:23 —ESV
“since you have been born again, not of perishable seed but of imperishable, through the living and abiding word of God;”
 

ReverendRV

Active member
It was Paul's physical blindness which was in view here

But Why speculate about Paul when we have clear statements

.................................................................................

Regeneration is the means by which God purifies (cleanses) the heart. In scripture it is likened as going from death to life - spiritual death to spiritual life thus is a resurrection or a raising up

With that in mind

Acts 15:9 —ESV
“and he made no distinction between us and them, having cleansed their hearts by faith.”

Col. 2:12 —ESV
“having been buried with him in baptism, in which you were also raised with him through faith in the powerful working of God, who raised him from the dead.”


The content of faith being the gospel


1 Cor. 4:15 —KJV
“For though ye have ten thousand instructors in Christ, yet have ye not many fathers: for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel.”

James 1:18 —ESV
“Of his own will he brought us forth by the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures.”

1 Pet. 1:23 —ESV
“since you have been born again, not of perishable seed but of imperishable, through the living and abiding word of God;”
Since you know me so well, you should know why I'm speculating about Paul; I'm about to set you up. I assume you agree that the Scales falling from his eyes has meaning regarding his Redemption in Time; that's why I asked, because Evangelicals teach this is symbolic of our state of Being before and after the New Birth...

Which came first; Regeneration of Faith when Jesus blinded Paul on the Road to Damascus?
 

TomFL

Well-known member
Since you know me so well, you should know why I'm speculating about Paul; I'm about to set you up. I assume you agree that the Scales falling from his eyes has meaning regarding his Redemption in Time; that's why I asked, because Evangelicals teach this is symbolic of our state of Being before and after the New Birth...
Actually no that would be speculation

and I cannot do theology by speculation

In any case we have clear scripture showing faith is instrumental in regeneration
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
Regeneration is the means by which God purifies (cleanses) the heart. In scripture it is likened as going from death to life - spiritual death to spiritual life thus is a resurrection or a raising up

With that in mind

Acts 15:9 —ESV
“and he made no distinction between us and them, having cleansed their hearts by faith.”

Col. 2:12 —ESV
“having been buried with him in baptism, in which you were also raised with him through faith in the powerful working of God, who raised him from the dead.”


The content of faith being the gospel


1 Cor. 4:15 —KJV
“For though ye have ten thousand instructors in Christ, yet have ye not many fathers: for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel.”

James 1:18 —ESV
“Of his own will he brought us forth by the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures.”

1 Pet. 1:23 —ESV
“since you have been born again, not of perishable seed but of imperishable, through the living and abiding word of God;”
Faith is the fruit of the Spirit Gal 5 22 So please show the verse that states:

"Regeneration through faith"
 

TomFL

Well-known member
Faith is the fruit of the Spirit Gal 5 22 So please show the verse that states:

"Regeneration through faith"
Read the evidence as that is what is being taught

Regeneration is the means by which God purifies (cleanses) the heart. In scripture it is likened as going from death to life - spiritual death to spiritual life thus is a resurrection or a raising up

With that in mind

Acts 15:9 —ESV
“and he made no distinction between us and them, having cleansed their hearts by faith.”

Col. 2:12 —ESV
“having been buried with him in baptism, in which you were also raised with him through faith in the powerful working of God, who raised him from the dead.”


The content of faith being the gospel


1 Cor. 4:15 —KJV
“For though ye have ten thousand instructors in Christ, yet have ye not many fathers: for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel.”

James 1:18 —ESV
“Of his own will he brought us forth by the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures.”

1 Pet. 1:23 —ESV
“since you have been born again, not of perishable seed but of imperishable, through the living and abiding word of God
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
Read the evidence as that is what is being taught

Regeneration is the means by which God purifies (cleanses) the heart. In scripture it is likened as going from death to life - spiritual death to spiritual life thus is a resurrection or a raising up

With that in mind

Acts 15:9 —ESV
“and he made no distinction between us and them, having cleansed their hearts by faith.”

Col. 2:12 —ESV
“having been buried with him in baptism, in which you were also raised with him through faith in the powerful working of God, who raised him from the dead.”


The content of faith being the gospel


1 Cor. 4:15 —KJV
“For though ye have ten thousand instructors in Christ, yet have ye not many fathers: for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel.”

James 1:18 —ESV
“Of his own will he brought us forth by the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures.”

1 Pet. 1:23 —ESV
“since you have been born again, not of perishable seed but of imperishable, through the living and abiding word of God
Not one scripture you have provided stated "regeneration through faith Its in your imagination ! Faith is a fruit of the Spirit who regenerates Gal 5 22
 

TomFL

Well-known member
Not one scripture you have provided stated "regeneration through faith Its in your imagination ! Faith is a fruit of the Spirit who regenerates Gal 5 22
You are in denial

looking for wording rather than comprehension

Read the evidence as that is what is being taught

Regeneration is the means by which God purifies (cleanses) the heart. In scripture it is likened as going from death to life - spiritual death to spiritual life thus is a resurrection or a raising up

With that in mind

Acts 15:9 —ESV
“and he made no distinction between us and them, having cleansed their hearts by faith.”

Col. 2:12 —ESV
“having been buried with him in baptism, in which you were also raised with him through faith in the powerful working of God, who raised him from the dead.”


The content of faith being the gospel


1 Cor. 4:15 —KJV
“For though ye have ten thousand instructors in Christ, yet have ye not many fathers: for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel.”

James 1:18 —ESV
“Of his own will he brought us forth by the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures.”

1 Pet. 1:23 —ESV
“since you have been born again, not of perishable seed but of imperishable, through the living and abiding word of God
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
You are in denial

looking for wording rather than comprehension

Read the evidence as that is what is being taught

Regeneration is the means by which God purifies (cleanses) the heart. In scripture it is likened as going from death to life - spiritual death to spiritual life thus is a resurrection or a raising up

With that in mind

Acts 15:9 —ESV
“and he made no distinction between us and them, having cleansed their hearts by faith.”

Col. 2:12 —ESV
“having been buried with him in baptism, in which you were also raised with him through faith in the powerful working of God, who raised him from the dead.”


The content of faith being the gospel


1 Cor. 4:15 —KJV
“For though ye have ten thousand instructors in Christ, yet have ye not many fathers: for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel.”

James 1:18 —ESV
“Of his own will he brought us forth by the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures.”

1 Pet. 1:23 —ESV
“since you have been born again, not of perishable seed but of imperishable, through the living and abiding word of God
You are imagining things, not one scripture ever says "

Regeneration through faith​

 

TomFL

Well-known member
You are imagining things, not one scripture ever says "

Regeneration through faith​

You lack understanding for the heart is purified in regeneration and regeneration is a spiritual resurrection

ou are in denial

looking for wording rather than comprehension

Read the evidence as that is what is being taught

Regeneration is the means by which God purifies (cleanses) the heart. In scripture it is likened as going from death to life - spiritual death to spiritual life thus is a resurrection or a raising up

With that in mind

Acts 15:9 —ESV
“and he made no distinction between us and them, having cleansed their hearts by faith.”

Col. 2:12 —ESV
“having been buried with him in baptism, in which you were also raised with him through faith in the powerful working of God, who raised him from the dead.”


The content of faith being the gospel


1 Cor. 4:15 —KJV
“For though ye have ten thousand instructors in Christ, yet have ye not many fathers: for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel.”

James 1:18 —ESV
“Of his own will he brought us forth by the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures.”

1 Pet. 1:23 —ESV
“since you have been born again, not of perishable seed but of imperishable
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
You lack understanding for the heart is purified in regeneration and regeneration is a spiritual resurrection

ou are in denial

looking for wording rather than comprehension

Read the evidence as that is what is being taught

Regeneration is the means by which God purifies (cleanses) the heart. In scripture it is likened as going from death to life - spiritual death to spiritual life thus is a resurrection or a raising up

With that in mind

Acts 15:9 —ESV
“and he made no distinction between us and them, having cleansed their hearts by faith.”

Col. 2:12 —ESV
“having been buried with him in baptism, in which you were also raised with him through faith in the powerful working of God, who raised him from the dead.”


The content of faith being the gospel


1 Cor. 4:15 —KJV
“For though ye have ten thousand instructors in Christ, yet have ye not many fathers: for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel.”

James 1:18 —ESV
“Of his own will he brought us forth by the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures.”

1 Pet. 1:23 —ESV
“since you have been born again, not of perishable seed but of imperishable
Your imagination running wild. No scripture says "regeneration through faith" its impossible, since Faith is the fruit of the Spirit who gives Faith Gal 5 22
 

TomFL

Well-known member
Your imagination running wild. No scripture says "regeneration through faith" its impossible, since Faith is the fruit of the Spirit who gives Faith Gal 5 22
Your understanding of Gal 5:22 is defective shown by many verses showing you cannot have the spirit without faith

as was stated

You lack understanding for the heart is purified in regeneration and regeneration is a spiritual resurrection

Regeneration is the means by which God purifies (cleanses) the heart. In scripture it is likened as going from death to life - spiritual death to spiritual life thus is a resurrection or a raising up

With that in mind

Acts 15:9 —ESV
“and he made no distinction between us and them, having cleansed their hearts by faith.”

Col. 2:12 —ESV
“having been buried with him in baptism, in which you were also raised with him through faith in the powerful working of God, who raised him from the dead.”


The content of faith being the gospel


1 Cor. 4:15 —KJV
“For though ye have ten thousand instructors in Christ, yet have ye not many fathers: for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel.”

James 1:18 —ESV
“Of his own will he brought us forth by the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures.”

1 Pet. 1:23 —ESV
“since you have been born again, not of perishable seed but of imperishable
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
Your understanding of Gal 5:22 is defective shown by many verses showing you cannot have the spirit without faith

as was stated

You lack understanding for the heart is purified in regeneration and regeneration is a spiritual resurrection

Regeneration is the means by which God purifies (cleanses) the heart. In scripture it is likened as going from death to life - spiritual death to spiritual life thus is a resurrection or a raising up

With that in mind

Acts 15:9 —ESV
“and he made no distinction between us and them, having cleansed their hearts by faith.”

Col. 2:12 —ESV
“having been buried with him in baptism, in which you were also raised with him through faith in the powerful working of God, who raised him from the dead.”


The content of faith being the gospel


1 Cor. 4:15 —KJV
“For though ye have ten thousand instructors in Christ, yet have ye not many fathers: for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel.”

James 1:18 —ESV
“Of his own will he brought us forth by the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures.”

1 Pet. 1:23 —ESV
“since you have been born again, not of perishable seed but of imperishable
No its good. Faith is the fruit of the Spirit Gal 5 22
 

TomFL

Well-known member
No its good. Faith is the fruit of the Spirit Gal 5 22
Sorry you ignore the evidence

Your understanding of Gal 5:22 is defective shown by many verses showing you cannot have the spirit without faith

Gal. 3:14 That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.

as was stated

You lack understanding for the heart is purified in regeneration and regeneration is a spiritual resurrection

Regeneration is the means by which God purifies (cleanses) the heart. In scripture it is likened as going from death to life - spiritual death to spiritual life thus is a resurrection or a raising up

With that in mind

Acts 15:9 —ESV
“and he made no distinction between us and them, having cleansed their hearts by faith.”

Col. 2:12 —ESV
“having been buried with him in baptism, in which you were also raised with him through faith in the powerful working of God, who raised him from the dead.”


The content of faith being the gospel


1 Cor. 4:15 —KJV
“For though ye have ten thousand instructors in Christ, yet have ye not many fathers: for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel.”

James 1:18 —ESV
“Of his own will he brought us forth by the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures.”

1 Pet. 1:23 —ESV
“since you have been born again, not of perishable seed but of imperishable
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
Sorry you ignore the evidence

Your understanding of Gal 5:22 is defective shown by many verses showing you cannot have the spirit without faith

Gal. 3:14 That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.

as was stated

You lack understanding for the heart is purified in regeneration and regeneration is a spiritual resurrection

Regeneration is the means by which God purifies (cleanses) the heart. In scripture it is likened as going from death to life - spiritual death to spiritual life thus is a resurrection or a raising up

With that in mind

Acts 15:9 —ESV
“and he made no distinction between us and them, having cleansed their hearts by faith.”

Col. 2:12 —ESV
“having been buried with him in baptism, in which you were also raised with him through faith in the powerful working of God, who raised him from the dead.”


The content of faith being the gospel


1 Cor. 4:15 —KJV
“For though ye have ten thousand instructors in Christ, yet have ye not many fathers: for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel.”

James 1:18 —ESV
“Of his own will he brought us forth by the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures.”

1 Pet. 1:23 —ESV
“since you have been born again, not of perishable seed but of imperishable
How can faith be before regeneration, when Faith is the fruit of the Spirit that gives new life.

How can activity of life be before life that gives activity ? Duh
 

TomFL

Well-known member
How can faith be before regeneration, when Faith is the fruit of the Spirit that gives new life.

How can activity of life be before life that gives activity ? Duh
Because the bible says it is

Spiritual death is not a condition of inertness

Just a separation from God

and you misunderstand Gal 5:22

it is not speaking of initial faith without which one is not saved or have the Spirit
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
Because the bible says it is

Spiritual death is not a condition of inertness

Just a separation from God

and you misunderstand Gal 5:22

it is not speaking of initial faith without which one is not saved or have the Spirit
How can you walk, as in walk by faith, and not be alive ? Faith is a Spiritual walk 2 Cor 5 7

for we walk by faith, not by sight) To do spiritual things, you must be spiritual or have spiritual life, faith is spiritual ! Gal 5 22
 
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