Revelation

Manfred

Well-known member
Did Jesus choose to reveal the Father to all people, or only to those he chooses to reveal Him to.

If He did not reveal the Father to all people, why not?
Luke 10
21 In that same hour he rejoiced in the Holy Spirit and said, I thank you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that you have hidden these things from the wise and understanding and revealed them to little children; yes, Father, for such was your gracious will. 22 All things have been handed over to me by my Father, and no one knows who the Son is except the Father, or who the Father is except the Son and anyone to whom the Son chooses to reveal him.

Secondary to this:

Is Divine revelation ineffective? When Divine revelation is received, is it possible for man not understand what is revealed?

If it is impossible to not understand divine revelation, and divine revelation is given to all men, why do men who understand the word of the cross (no longer folly) still perish?

1Cor1
18 For the word of the cross is folly to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.
 

TibiasDad

Well-known member
Did Jesus choose to reveal the Father to all people, or only to those he chooses to reveal Him to.

If He did not reveal the Father to all people, why not?
Luke 10
21 In that same hour he rejoiced in the Holy Spirit and said, I thank you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that you have hidden these things from the wise and understanding and revealed them to little children; yes, Father, for such was your gracious will. 22 All things have been handed over to me by my Father, and no one knows who the Son is except the Father, or who the Father is except the Son and anyone to whom the Son chooses to reveal him.


Secondary to this:

Is Divine revelation ineffective? When Divine revelation is received, is it possible for man not understand what is revealed?

If it is impossible to not understand divine revelation, and divine revelation is given to all men, why do men who understand the word of the cross (no longer folly) still perish?

1Cor1
18 For the word of the cross is folly to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.

Then apparently, if your logic stands, God only reveals himself to uneducated little children, and never to the "wise and understanding"!

Doug
 

Theo1689

Well-known member
Then apparently, if your logic stands, God only reveals himself to uneducated little children, and never to the "wise and understanding"!

Doug

So let me get this straight...
You're telling us you reject Luke 10.
Good to know.
 

Manfred

Well-known member
Then apparently, if your logic stands, God only reveals himself to uneducated little children, and never to the "wise and understanding"!

Doug
According to scripture, God reveals Himself to those who deny self and become like little children.

That is the problem with Arminians, provisionists and fence sitters, they think self is involved in salvation. A little bit of self credit.

The rich young ruler left Jesus sad, he was not willing to give up self and follow Jesus. Why are you not willing to give up self? Do you think it pleases Jesus?
 

PeanutGallery

Well-known member
...
Why are you not willing to give up self? Do you think it pleases Jesus?
According to Calvinism, God decrees whether one does or does not give up himself.
Biblically, one who does cry out to God for mercy has given up on himself; God is pleased to save such a one.
 

Chalcedon

Well-known member
According to Calvinism, God decrees whether one does or does not give up himself.
Biblically, one who does cry out to God for mercy has given up on himself; God is pleased to save such a one.
Can you explain the meaning of Luke 10:21-22 ?

PS- nothing you said above has anything to do with the passage.

What does the passage mean ?


21 In that same hour he rejoiced in the Holy Spirit and said, I thank you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that you have hidden these things from the wise and understanding and revealed them to little children; yes, Father, for such was your gracious will. 22 All things have been handed over to me by my Father, and no one knows who the Son is except the Father, or who the Father is except the Son and anyone to whom the Son chooses to reveal him.


And FYI- Rhetoric does not count as a biblical answer and neither does ad hominem attacks on calvinism count as a biblical answer. What does Jesus mean in the above passage in Luke 10:20-21 ?

hope this helps !!!
 

PeanutGallery

Well-known member
Can you explain the meaning of Luke 10:21-22 ?...
Babes are those who cry out; babes are to whom God reveals the Son.
Luke 10:21 In that hour Jesus rejoiced in spirit, and said, I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that thou hast hid these things from the wise and prudent, and hast revealed them unto babes: even so, Father; for so it seemed good in thy sight.
Luke 10:22 All things are delivered to me of my Father: and no man knoweth who the Son is, but the Father; and who the Father is, but the Son, and he to whom the Son will reveal him.

Psalm 147:11 The LORD taketh pleasure in them that fear him, in those that hope in his mercy.
 

Chalcedon

Well-known member
Babes are those who cry out; babes are to whom God reveals the Son.
Luke 10:21 In that hour Jesus rejoiced in spirit, and said, I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that thou hast hid these things from the wise and prudent, and hast revealed them unto babes: even so, Father; for so it seemed good in thy sight.
Luke 10:22 All things are delivered to me of my Father: and no man knoweth who the Son is, but the Father; and who the Father is, but the Son, and he to whom the Son will reveal him.

Psalm 147:11 The LORD taketh pleasure in them that fear him, in those that hope in his mercy.
Where does Jesus say in the passage that babes : " are those who cry out" ???
 

fltom

Well-known member
Did Jesus choose to reveal the Father to all people, or only to those he chooses to reveal Him to.

If He did not reveal the Father to all people, why not?
Luke 10
21 In that same hour he rejoiced in the Holy Spirit and said, I thank you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that you have hidden these things from the wise and understanding and revealed them to little children; yes, Father, for such was your gracious will. 22 All things have been handed over to me by my Father, and no one knows who the Son is except the Father, or who the Father is except the Son and anyone to whom the Son chooses to reveal him.


Secondary to this:

Is Divine revelation ineffective? When Divine revelation is received, is it possible for man not understand what is revealed?

If it is impossible to not understand divine revelation, and divine revelation is given to all men, why do men who understand the word of the cross (no longer folly) still perish?

1Cor1
18 For the word of the cross is folly to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.
Mark 16:15 (ESV)
15 And he said to them, “Go into all the world and proclaim the gospel to the whole creation.

Matthew 28:19-20 (ESV)
19 Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,
20 teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you. And behold, I am with you always, to the end of the age.”

Colossians 1:27-28 (KJV)
27 To whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory:
28 Whom we preach, warning every man, and teaching every man in all wisdom; that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus:

1 Peter 3:15 (KJV)
15 But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear:
 

Reformedguy

Well-known member
Mark 16:15 (ESV)
15 And he said to them, “Go into all the world and proclaim the gospel to the whole creation.

Matthew 28:19-20 (ESV)
19 Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,
20 teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you. And behold, I am with you always, to the end of the age.”

Colossians 1:27-28 (KJV)
27 To whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory:
28 Whom we preach, warning every man, and teaching every man in all wisdom; that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus:

1 Peter 3:15 (KJV)
15 But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear:
Here comes the proof texter. How about dealing with the text at hand? Try something different.
 

PeanutGallery

Well-known member
evasion is your specialty I don't know why I expected anything less than that from you. ...
How is private interpretation an evasion; I'm just following your rules: no scripture required.
Who are babes: those who believed the law and the prophets, those who fear the Lord.
 

Chalcedon

Well-known member
How is private interpretation an evasion; I'm just following your rules: no scripture required.
Who are babes: those who believed the law and the prophets, those who fear the Lord.
I'm sorry Jesus never said that in Luke 10:21-22.

you made that up as usual.

next
 

fltom

Well-known member
Here comes the proof texter. How about dealing with the text at hand? Try something different.
And naturally you failed to deal with anything

that is because your theology is not founded on scripture

Mark 16:15 (ESV)
15 And he said to them, “Go into all the world and proclaim the gospel to the whole creation.

Matthew 28:19-20 (ESV)
19 Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,
20 teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you. And behold, I am with you always, to the end of the age.”

Colossians 1:27-28 (KJV)
27 To whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory:
28 Whom we preach, warning every man, and teaching every man in all wisdom; that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus:

1 Peter 3:15 (KJV)
15 But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear:
 

Reformedguy

Well-known member
And naturally you failed to deal with anything

that is because your theology is not founded on scripture

Mark 16:15 (ESV)
15 And he said to them, “Go into all the world and proclaim the gospel to the whole creation.

Matthew 28:19-20 (ESV)
19 Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,
20 teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you. And behold, I am with you always, to the end of the age.”

Colossians 1:27-28 (KJV)
27 To whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory:
28 Whom we preach, warning every man, and teaching every man in all wisdom; that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus:

1 Peter 3:15 (KJV)
15 But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear:
And the text in Luke?
 

fltom

Well-known member
And the text in Luke?
It does not contradict these

Mark 16:15 (ESV)
15 And he said to them, “Go into all the world and proclaim the gospel to the whole creation.

Matthew 28:19-20 (ESV)
19 Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,
20 teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you. And behold, I am with you always, to the end of the age.”

Colossians 1:27-28 (KJV)
27 To whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory:
28 Whom we preach, warning every man, and teaching every man in all wisdom; that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus:

1 Peter 3:15 (KJV)
15 But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear:

different time different historical context

Christ chose 70 to announce the kingdom of God

he had yet empowered the apostles to carry the gospel into all the world

Luke speaks of a select group while the other passages who the gospel would go to

You cannot deny the apostles were commissioned to preach the gospel to every creature

o
 
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