Revelation

preacher4truth

Well-known member
no he is pointing out the sensual man who values only worldly wisdom cannot understand spiritual truth

that it does not apply to all is apparent as

Galatians 3:14 (KJV)
14 That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.
You still don't believe plain Scripture. The natural man cannot understand the things of the Spirit. For that truth you unashamedly stand against God.
 

preacher4truth

Well-known member
Did Jesus choose to reveal the Father to all people, or only to those he chooses to reveal Him to.

If He did not reveal the Father to all people, why not?
Luke 10
21 In that same hour he rejoiced in the Holy Spirit and said, I thank you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that you have hidden these things from the wise and understanding and revealed them to little children; yes, Father, for such was your gracious will. 22 All things have been handed over to me by my Father, and no one knows who the Son is except the Father, or who the Father is except the Son and anyone to whom the Son chooses to reveal him.


Secondary to this:

Is Divine revelation ineffective? When Divine revelation is received, is it possible for man not understand what is revealed?

If it is impossible to not understand divine revelation, and divine revelation is given to all men, why do men who understand the word of the cross (no longer folly) still perish?

1Cor1
18 For the word of the cross is folly to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.
He only reveals Himself to whom He wills to do so. These are burdened by sin and come to Him, and none other.

I discussed this with Leighton, the false teacher who is drawing away disciples after himself while speaking twisted perverse things and he deemed it unfair. That's the foundational reason for their teaching; God is unfair, hence Romans 9:19-21 is on display in them.
 

fltom

Well-known member
You still don't believe plain Scripture. The natural man cannot understand the things of the Spirit. For that truth you unashamedly stand against God.
You don't comprehend scripture being blinded by neo gnostic manicheanism

Men believe before they receive the Spirit

John 7:39 (KJV)
39 (But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)

Galatians 3:2 (KJV)
2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?

Galatians 3:5 (KJV)
5 He therefore that ministereth to you the Spirit, and worketh miracles among you, doeth he it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?

Galatians 3:14 (KJV)
14 That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.


Acts 2:38 (KJV)
38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Scripture shows menare capablke of believing

Men needed to be hardened so they could not believe

John 12:40 —KJV
“He hath blinded their eyes, and hardened their heart; that they should not see with their eyes, nor understand with their heart, and be converted, and I should heal them.”

had men not hardened themselves they could have believed

Acts 28:27 —KJV
“For the heart of this people is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes have they closed; lest they should see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.”

Jesus spoke to men in parables to prevent their understanding

Matt. 13:10–14 —KJV
“And the disciples came, and said unto him, Why speakest thou unto them in parables?
He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given.
For whosoever hath, to him shall be given, and he shall have more abundance: but whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken away even that he hath.
Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand.
And in them is fulfilled the prophecy of Esaias, which saith, By hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and shall not perceive:”

None of that makes any sense in your philosophy

further

God's word demonstrates its sufficiency

John 20:31 (KJV 1900)

31 But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name.

This clearly presupposes the gospel may be understood

2 Timothy 3:15 (KJV 1900)

15 And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.

presupposes Holy scriptures may be understood

Isaiah 55:11 (KJV 1900)

11 So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth:

It shall not return unto me void,

But it shall accomplish that which I please,

And it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.

God’s word prospers in whatever it is set out to do

Psalm 19:7 (KJV 1900)

7 ………………………The testimony of the Lord is sure, making wise the simple.

Psalm 119:130 (KJV 1900)

130 The entrance of thy words giveth light;

It giveth understanding unto the simple.

Self explanitory

Ninth the bible speaks of others believing through personal witness

John 1:7 —ESV

“He came as a witness, to bear witness about the light, that all might believe through him.”

John 17:20 —ESV

“¶ “I do not ask for these only, but also for those who will believe in me through their word,”

2 Th. 1:10 —ESV

“when he comes on that day to be glorified in his saints, and to be marveled at among all who have believed, because our testimony to you was believed.”

John 4:39 ¶ Many Samaritans from that town believed in him because of the woman’s testimony, “He told me all that I ever did.”

Multiple passages of scripture refute your beliefs

and you can't address them

BTW it is the psychikos - the sensual man who cannot understand scripture

not all men

you are still stuck with the fact men believe before they receive the spirit
 

fltom

Well-known member
He only reveals Himself to whom He wills to do so. These are burdened by sin and come to Him, and none other.

I discussed this with Leighton, the false teacher who is drawing away disciples after himself while speaking twisted perverse things and he deemed it unfair. That's the foundational reason for their teaching; God is unfair, hence Romans 9:19-21 is on display in them.
scripture

Mark 16:15 (KJV)
15 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.

Matthew 28:19-20 (KJV)
19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

1 Peter 3:15 (KJV)
15 But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear:

it also show the gospel is preached to those who do not respond

2 Thessalonians 2:10 (KJV)
10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

Romans 10:18 (KJV)
18 But I say, Have they not heard? Yes verily, their sound went into all the earth, and their words unto the ends of the world.

Its not your friend
 

Reformedguy

Well-known member
scripture

Mark 16:15 (KJV)
15 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.

Matthew 28:19-20 (KJV)
19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

1 Peter 3:15 (KJV)
15 But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear:

it also show the gospel is preached to those who do not respond

2 Thessalonians 2:10 (KJV)
10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

Romans 10:18 (KJV)
18 But I say, Have they not heard? Yes verily, their sound went into all the earth, and their words unto the ends of the world.

Its not your friend
Who said its not preached to those who don't respond? Who responds and who don't ?
 

fltom

Well-known member
Which happens when you are regenerated as you receive the gift of grace and faith.
nope faith precedes life

John 20:31 (ESV)
31 but these are written so that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that by believing you may have life in his name.

John 5:24-25 (ESV)
24 Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life.
25 “Truly, truly, I say to you, an hour is coming, and is now here, when the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God, and those who hear will live.

why is it you ignore scripture to extoll your systematic?
 

CrowCross

Super Member
nope faith precedes life

John 20:31 (ESV)
31 but these are written so that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that by believing you may have life in his name.

John 5:24-25 (ESV)
24 Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life.
25 “Truly, truly, I say to you, an hour is coming, and is now here, when the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God, and those who hear will live.

why is it you ignore scripture to extoll your systematic?
Faith is the way and means in which they enjoy life.

Titus 3:4But when the kindness of God our Savior and His love for mankind appeared, 5He saved us, not by the righteous deeds we had done, but according to His mercy, through the washing of new birtha and renewal by the Holy Spirit. 6This is the Spirit He poured out on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Savior, 7so that, having been justified by His grace, we would become heirs with the hope of eternal life. 8This saying is trustworthy. And I want you to emphasize these things, so that those who have believed God will take care to devote themselves to good deeds. These things are excellent and profitable for the people.
 

Sethproton

Well-known member
Why would you ask about "no longer walk in the fleshly mind", if you were referring to "carry out the desire of the flesh"?
Our actual flesh and blood does not have a mind. The fleshly mind is that part of us that is influenced and corrupted by the flesh, that mind is what carries out the desires that come thru flesh.
 

Theo1689

Well-known member
Our actual flesh and blood does not have a mind. The fleshly mind is that part of us that is influenced and corrupted by the flesh, that mind is what carries out the desires that come thru flesh.

So rationalization instead of Scripture.
Thank you for the admission that you don't have the spirit, but rely solely on the "intellect".
 

Sethproton

Well-known member
So rationalization instead of Scripture.
Thank you for the admission that you don't have the spirit, but rely solely on the "intellect".
Yes, our intellect is needed to understand the Bible. If we had no intellect then the Spirit could not teach us anything
 
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