Romans4

dberrie2020

Well-known member
"Where do we find any such designation as "Zeus" or "god of the sun"--in the Biblical text?

Mag--these weren't golden calves either:

Psalm 82:1-6---King James Version
1 God standeth in the congregation of the mighty; he judgeth among the gods.
2 How long will ye judge unjustly, and accept the persons of the wicked? Selah.
3 Defend the poor and fatherless: do justice to the afflicted and needy.
4 Deliver the poor and needy: rid them out of the hand of the wicked.
5 They know not, neither will they understand; they walk on in darkness: all the foundations of the earth are out of course.
6 I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High

How can the gods which judge and are children of the most High--be golden calves? How can the "congregation of the mighty" --which God stands in, with the gods--not be real?

One may call them "false"--but they were real gods. "children of the most High"--according to the Biblical writers."

still waiting on an answer.
 

Magdalena

Well-known member
"Where do we find any such designation as "Zeus" or "god of the sun"--in the Biblical text?

Mag--these weren't golden calves either:

Psalm 82:1-6---King James Version
1 God standeth in the congregation of the mighty; he judgeth among the gods.
2 How long will ye judge unjustly, and accept the persons of the wicked? Selah.
3 Defend the poor and fatherless: do justice to the afflicted and needy.
4 Deliver the poor and needy: rid them out of the hand of the wicked.
5 They know not, neither will they understand; they walk on in darkness: all the foundations of the earth are out of course.
6 I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High

How can the gods which judge and are children of the most High--be golden calves? How can the "congregation of the mighty" --which God stands in, with the gods--not be real?

One may call them "false"--but they were real gods. "children of the most High"--according to the Biblical writers."

still waiting on an answer.
Do you really expect a different answer every time you post that?
 

Magdalena

Well-known member
I expect that taint so!!! ----is neither a convincing nor a compelling answer.
We see that this is your new obsession. Since you can’t spam the board with faith alone stuff anymore, you’ve chosen this Revelation verse to post in every thread.
 

Janice Bower

Well-known member
"Where do we find any such designation as "Zeus" or "god of the sun"--in the Biblical text?

Mag--these weren't golden calves either:

Psalm 82:1-6---King James Version
1 God standeth in the congregation of the mighty; he judgeth among the gods.
2 How long will ye judge unjustly, and accept the persons of the wicked? Selah.
3 Defend the poor and fatherless: do justice to the afflicted and needy.
4 Deliver the poor and needy: rid them out of the hand of the wicked.
5 They know not, neither will they understand; they walk on in darkness: all the foundations of the earth are out of course.
6 I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High

How can the gods which judge and are children of the most High--be golden calves? How can the "congregation of the mighty" --which God stands in, with the gods--not be real?

One may call them "false"--but they were real gods. "children of the most High"--according to the Biblical writers."

still waiting on an answer.
An honorary title doesn't make them real gods.

Ellicott's Commentary for Ebglish Readers
(6) I have said.--Again the Divine voice breaks the silence with an emphatic I. "From me comes your office and your honoured title, gods; now from me hear your doom. Princes though ye be, ye will die as other men: yea, altogether will ye princes perish." (For the rendering "altogether," literally, like one man, see Ezra 2:64; Ezra 3:9, &c.)
 

dberrie2020

Well-known member
An honorary title doesn't make them real gods.

Unless it was a lie--they were real gods.

Again--how could God stand in the midst of imaginary gods? How could "children of the most High" be non-existent? Why would God pass judgment on something which isn't real?

Psalm 82:1-6---King James Version
1 God standeth in the congregation of the mighty; he judgeth among the gods.
2 How long will ye judge unjustly, and accept the persons of the wicked? Selah.
3 Defend the poor and fatherless: do justice to the afflicted and needy.
4 Deliver the poor and needy: rid them out of the hand of the wicked.
5 They know not, neither will they understand; they walk on in darkness: all the foundations of the earth are out of course.
6 I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High

And the problem which presents itself does not end there, as most all the Early Church Fathers taught men could become gods--for centuries. That can be shown.

The fact is--the critics here share precious little in common with the Biblical NT:

Revelation 3:21---King James Version
21 To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.
 

Janice Bower

Well-known member
Unless it was a lie--they were real gods.

It wasn't a lie. They were honorary gods(i. e. rulerts). You have a KJV, do you not? There is only one God. There is no other god.
Again--how could God stand in the midst of imaginary gods? How could "children of the most High" be non-existent?
They are not imaginary. The word honorary has never meant imaginary. The humans being referred to are not non-existent.

Why would God pass judgment on something which isn't real?

Psalm 82:1-6---King James Version
1 God standeth in the congregation of the mighty; he judgeth among the gods.
2 How long will ye judge unjustly, and accept the persons of the wicked? Selah.
3 Defend the poor and fatherless: do justice to the afflicted and needy.
4 Deliver the poor and needy: rid them out of the hand of the wicked.
5 They know not, neither will they understand; they walk on in darkness: all the foundations of the earth are out of course.
6 I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High

And the problem which presents itself does not end there, as most all the Early Church Fathers taught men could become gods--for centuries. That can be shown.

The fact is--the critics here share precious little in common with the Biblical NT:

Revelation 3:21---King James Version
21 To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.
Humans are not non-exitent. You made that up.

For a resurrected human to sit on God's throne is a figure of speech. God doesn't sit on a throne that is hundreds of miles long.
 
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Janice Bower

Well-known member
Post #3
If God restored the truth through Joseph Smith, why have the racist verses been removed from the Book of Mormon in my time? Were those verses not true?

These are such good questions. Why are there no answers?
 

dberrie2020

Well-known member
It wasn't a lie.

It surely isn't--they were gods--period.

They were honorary gods(i. e. rulerts).

Where do we find the term "honorary gods" in the scriptures? They were the sons of God.

You have a KJv, dp you not? There is only one God. There is no other god.

LOL!!! Yes---they are gods because there really isn't any other god. Got it.

They are not imaginary. The word honorary has never meant imaginary.

And the term "gods" has never meant there is no other god.

The mortals being referred to are not non-existent.

And your evidence they are mortals? The Divine Council was not made up of mortals.

Psalm 82: Grammatical/Syntactical Issues and How the Divine Council Practically Expresses itself in Biblical Theology​


Abstract
Psalm 82 is a brief text, attributed to the psalmist Asaph that is rich with mythological imagery. Exegetical studies of pre-critical scholarship interpreted the “gods” (elohim) of this passage as human judges. Modern post-critical scholars have undermined that previous interpretation based upon coterminous textual discoveries and linguistic advances. There are few scholars presently that would interpret the “gods” of Psalm 82 as human judges.
 

Janice Bower

Well-known member
Understanding Psalm 82 is a huge blessing. God's rulers are being reprimanded.

Of course, they are mortals. They will die.

"7 But you will die like mere mortals; you will fall like every other ruler.”
 
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Janice Bower

Well-known member
John 1 explains that we become sons of God when we are born again.
12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: 13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
 

Janice Bower

Well-known member
So did God the Son.
Jesus came to die for our sins and only by lowering Himself became a human so He could die.

Those rulers you mistakenly think were gods were mortals. God is not a created mortal. A created being is not a a god in embryo or a man who became a God.
 

e v e 21

Well-known member
That makes sense. He was closer to God than any of us.

are you saying it was God’s will for adam to disobey God … did not adam freely choose to disobey God ?

So… is adam in charge of this world, does he still have dominion ?
 
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e v e 21

Well-known member
Why did adam leave eden if as you said he is closer to God?

is he a deity ? a son of God?

how do you view him ?
 

dberrie2020

Well-known member
Jesus came to die for our sins and only by lowering Himself became a human so He could die.

Those rulers you mistakenly think were gods were mortals. God is not a created mortal. A created being is not a a god in embryo or a man who became a God.

It's still an example of God dying. God the Son died. If God the Son can die--then so can other heavenly gods.

The gods of the Divine Council were not humans. The Divine Council is made up of heavenly, divine beings--that's the reason it's called the Divine Council.

Psalm 82:1---English Standard Version

1 God has taken his place in the divine council;
in the midst of the gods he holds judgment:



The Divine Council of Yahweh​


"The Bible acknowledges there are many gods but affirms there is one God who is the sovereign creator of all those gods. Therefore, the biblical perspective found in the Bible is that a believer’s allegiance and devotion is to the one true God, despite the existence of many gods.

The divine council of Yahweh is an assembly of divine, spiritual beings
over which Yahweh, the one true God, presides. These beings participate in making decisions with Yahweh, execute these decisions in creation, and rule over creation on Yahweh’s behalf."

Divine Council​

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

A Divine Council is an assembly of deities over which a higher-level god presides.
 
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