Sabbath Day Salvation

YeshuaFan

Well-known member
Hi pythons,

You do realize I asked YeshuaFan 5️⃣ separate questions? So for you to say "the question is easily answerable" implies that I only asked 1️⃣ question. So which of my five questions are you supposedly easily answering? As icy it I don't feel like your response really addresses any of my questions 👇 But feel free to tell me otherwise and then go ahead and answer the other 4️⃣ questions while you're at it.







I think you're missing the point. Sunday keepers have zero biblical rationale as to why they are observing the first day of the week instead of the seventh. Thus they stretch texts such as Revelation 1:10 which indicates John as being in the Spirit "on the Lord's day" and attempt to target this nebulous reference into something more specific (i.e. the Lord's day mysteriously transmogrifies into becoming Sunday). This cannot be sustained from a normative reading of the text. Since John doesn't specify what day of the week it is then doesn't it make more sense to conclude it's the Sabbath based on the fact that God actually claims ownership calling it "My holy day." The first time anyone attempts to retask Rev. 1:10 to apply it to Sunday is over 200 years after the cross. Um, no. That why don't fly 🕊️ and that boat don't float ⛵





Have you read your Bible? I believe there are only seven references to the first day of the week in the entire New Testament and five of those deal specifically with the resurrection of Jesus. That leaves you with exactly two texts to establish "the practice of Christian assembly on the 1st day of the week." Good luck with that ;) I know what these other two texts say and how much spin is required to force them to say something they don't. That said, I eagerly await your biblical proof of Sunday assembly as "absolutely Apostolic in origin."🍿





Earlier on this thread I revealed that Jesus, the apostles, Paul, and Gentiles all observed the Sabbath. The seventh day continues to retain its venerated title (i.e. Sabbath) throughout the entirety of the New Testament, while there is no title supplied or rationale given as to why the first day of the week should be in any way elevated in status. In fact it retains its numeric designation in relation to the Sabbath!

Attempting to attach any sort of significance to Sunday is kinda like observing Christmas. Nowhere in the Bible do we see any identification for when our Lord was born or that we should in any way attach any honor on that day. The same is true for Christ's resurrection. Where do you find any apostolic rationale which indicates that we should transfer the solemnity of the seventh day Sabbath (which the Bible says we are to call a "delight" and which Jesus says was "made for human beings") to the first day of the week in supposed honor of the resurrection? It's not there. Like Christmas, it's a fantasy, but in this case it's doing definite harm as it attempts to set aside God's commandment in favor of one of man's.

I pray this helps.
Still awaiting your scriptures that support Church now under the sabbath, that the IJ is found in bible, and where is the [roof that Ellen White was a prophetess of God!
 

YeshuaFan

Well-known member
Sometimes an answer will make multiple questions irrelevant, that's what's going on here.



It floats very well and there is ample Biblical evidence for assembling on Sunday.

Colossians 2, 16
Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days: Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

There is no spinning out of the fact that the Feasts of Israel (the Feasts of the Lord) were weekly (the Sabbath's (notice the plural), the Monthly and the yearly. These feasts are detailed explicitly in the Old Testament (Leviticus 23) and here in the New are re-classified as "SHADOWS" that point to what fulfilled them (Christ).

Romans 14, 5 demonstrates the same point that Colossians 2 does by showing that in the big picture there isn't anything more important about the Sabbath than Thursday. Seriously Icy, can you imagine a New Testament Scripture that told Christians that one man believes he can sleep with other men's wives and another man believes he can't and therefore let each man make up his own mind! This is another frank and stinging reality slap that the Sabbath is CEREMONIAL exactly as both the Old Testament and New Testament say it is.

The New Testament Scriptures never speak that way about moral AKA non-ceremonial laws - can you imagine God telling Christian converts from Paganism or even Jews who accepted Christ to let no one judge them for murder, stealing, adultery, murder and the like? This alone should demonstrate the Feasts of God were ceremonial and as such not obligatory for Christians exactly as the Scripture tells us is the case.

So, we start from a position that comes straight out of the Bible - that observing the Sabbath is of no significance . Observing the Sabbath has as much to do with Salvation as carrying a piece of fried chicken in your left shirt pocket does.

There is a New Testament command for Christians to assemble however.

Hebrews 10, 23-27
Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water. Let us hold fast the profession of our faith without wavering; (for he is faithful that promised;) And let us consider one another to provoke unto love and to good works: Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching. For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.

This is CHRISTIAN ASSEMBLY being spoken of here therefore going to the Temple or Synagogue on the Sabbath day would be violating the command in Hebrews 10 because Christians assembling with Jews ISN'T assembling "OF THEMSELVES TOGETHER".

Acts 2,46 is extremely clear.
And they [ Apostles & other Christians ], continuing daily with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread from house to house, did eat their meat with gladness and singleness of heart,

The earliest Christians continued DAILY to assemble with their fellow Jews at the Temple (where actual sacrifices were still going on) AND at the Synagogues but came together AS CHRISTIANS on the 1st day of the week. Understand the difference between an assembly of Christians with Jews still practicing Judaism AND an assembly OF Christians.

Acts 20, 7

And upon the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread, Paul preached unto them, ready to depart on the morrow; and continued his speech until midnight

The Scriptures state that the Apostles & converts to Christianity were continuing DAILY in the temple and also meeting at Synagogues yet it was on the 1st day of the week they had an assembly of THEMSELVES together AS A CHURCH. The same concept is spelled out clearly in 1 Corinthians 11, 18 - end of the chapter.
The sda fail to rightly divide the Old and New Covenants, as Jesus was born under and administered under OC law, but now they lived and taught NC grace, as that transition was recorded down to us in Acts!
 

YeshuaFan

Well-known member
Prologue:
AV Ro 4:5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

No works required to be saved, Right ???

AV Mt 26:28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

Does Sunday rest, Sunday holiness and Sunday assembling is salvation apart from Jesus' flesh and blood example ???

So when the Sunday law comes, we all can recognize that as works, Right ???

Yours in Christ, Michael
No Sunday law coming, as the Apostles themselves changed observing the day from Sabbath to lords day!
 

YeshuaFan

Well-known member
We will need to agree to disagree. You have your opinions, and I have mine. The Whole Truth will be reveal shortly.

"There will be no "Sunday Law" coming.", They already on the law books here in USA. Called Blue Laws, are just not enforced, Currently.

EU laws are changing though. <<< Click Here. Currently RCC has more pull on EU laws, than in the USA.

What we are waiting on is a world wide Theocracy, to make Sunday mandatory universally. Your biggest clue starts with closing on Sunday for all kinds of activities, except church attendance.

When it comes, you need to make your OWN personal decision, and not force others into it, with man made laws.

So does keeping Sunday works save a person ???

AV Re 18:1-5 And after these things I saw another angel come down from heaven, having great power; and the earth was lightened with his glory. 2 And he cried mightily with a strong voice, saying, Babylon the great is fallen, is fallen, and is become the habitation of devils, and the hold of every foul spirit, and a cage of every unclean and hateful bird. 3 For all nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her fornication, and the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth are waxed rich through the abundance of her delicacies. 4 And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues. 5 For her sins have reached unto heaven, and God hath remembered her iniquities.

Please realize, I do not doubt your sincerity. Just what you have been lead to believe by others. Because when these verses become sight and sound to you, you have a cognitive dissonance issue to resolve for yourself. To make worst, it will be during the counterfeit second advent by satan, telling everyone, sabbath has been change to Sunday.

Yours in Christ, Michael
By the standards of Ellen White, none of the Apostles were saved, as NONE kept Jewish Sabbath as being mandatory now under the NC!
 

YeshuaFan

Well-known member
AV Re 13:15 And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed.

"Federal Authorities", No, a new theocracy of worship, Yes !!!

Yours in Christ, Michael
That will be the Antichrist, and that will not be any Pope!
 

Common Tater

Active member
Prologue:
AV Ro 4:5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

No works required to be saved, Right ???

AV Mt 26:28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

Does Sunday rest, Sunday holiness and Sunday assembling is salvation apart from Jesus' flesh and blood example ???

So when the Sunday law comes, we all can recognize that as works, Right ???

Yours
Once again you trot out Sunday sabbatarianism, even though it has been pointed out to you ad nauseum that most Christians do not see Sunday as a Sabbath, do not see it as a holy day, rather, it is simply the day we meet for corporate worship to celebrate the resurrection of our Lord Jesus Christ. Look to the history of the early Church. Christians would meet early Sunday morning to worship and break bread, and would then depart and go about their day.

And, again, I'd like to ask you if you are following Jesus' flesh and blood example and observing all of the Jewish feasts and festivals?
 

Common Tater

Active member
I do not agree that the command not to take the Lord's name in vain is not found in the New Testament.

“Again, you have heard that the ancients were told, ‘YOU SHALL NOT MAKE FALSE VOWS, BUT SHALL FULFILL YOUR VOWS TO THE LORD.’ “But I say to you, make no oath at all, either by heaven, for it is the throne of God, or by the earth, for it is the footstool of His feet, or by Jerusalem, for it is THE CITY OF THE GREAT KING. “Nor shall you make an oath by your head, for you cannot make one hair white or black. “But let your statement be, ‘Yes, yes’ or ‘No, no’; anything beyond these is of evil. Matthew 5:33-37 NASB

All who are under the yoke as slaves are to regard their own masters as worthy of all honor so that the name of God and our doctrine will not be spoken against. 1 Timothy 6:1 NASB

But above all, my brethren, do not swear, either by heaven or by earth or with any other oath; but your yes is to be yes, and your no, no, so that you may not fall under judgment. James 5:12 NASB

Dennis Prager, a very intelligent man who takes his Judaism seriously, also points out that a better translation of "taking the Lord's name in vain" is doing that which is evil in God's name.
 

Buzzard

Well-known member
Dennis Prager, a very intelligent man who takes his Judaism seriously, also points out that a better translation of "taking the Lord's name in vain" is doing that which is evil in God's name.
"taking the Lord's name in vain" is doing that which is evil in God's name.
--------------------------------------------------------

And Jesus answered and said unto them,
Take heed that no man deceive you.

5 For many shall come in my name,
saying,

I am Christ; and shall deceive many.​

and """MANY""" shall come
---- "IN MY NAME"-----
and deceive many

now think about it for a minute ???????
they will come confessing Christ
claiming they were called, chosen, and sent by Christ

Titus 1:16​
They profess that they know God;
but in works they deny him,
being abominable, and disobedient,
and unto every good work reprobate.​

if I send someone on and errand for me;
they go in my name,
as an Ambassador to other nations is sent
"In the Name of" the country they represent

2 Cor.5:20​
Now then we are ambassadors for Christ,
as though God did beseech you by us:
we pray you in Christ's stead,
be ye reconciled to God.

Ex.20:7​
Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain;
for the Lord will not hold him guiltless that taketh his name in vain.​
 

SDAchristian

Well-known member
Prologue: Do not look, if giving up ignorance is PAINFUL !!!
First-day Sabbatarian (Sunday Sabbatarian) practices include attending morning and evening church services on Sundays, receiving catechesis in Sunday School on the Lord's Day, taking the Lord's Day off from servile labour, not eating at restaurants on Sundays, not Sunday shopping, not using public transportation on the Lord's Day, not participating in sporting events that are held on Sundays, as well as not viewing television and the internet on Sundays
AV 1Jn 2:6 He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked.

Hypocrites a many, will in ignorance perpetuate sins against the sabbath keepers, who follow Jesus' walk.
Keeping a day will never save someone.
Is this true for keeping Sunday too, so a Sunday Law is NEVER needed, ever, Right ???

For many, their day of cognitive dissonance, will be when the Sunday Law goes into affect. To stop people from sinning against GOD on Sunday, Right ???

AV Re 14:9-11 And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive [his] mark in his forehead, or in his hand, 10 The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb: 11 And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.

The day many lose their salvation, is the Sunday Law Death Decree. Because many have no Free Will Choice honored by men, for sabbath rest and sabbath holiness after Jesus' own example, will be outlawed.

That is when my ministry is over, and GOD finishes the Free Will Choice benefits to sinners in the time of the end.

AV Mt 26:28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

So can Jesus' righteousness be declared sin, by the authority of laws of men ???

Yours in Christ, Michael
 

Buzzard

Well-known member
Michael spouts
That is when my ministry is over, and GOD finishes the Free Will Choice benefits to sinners in the time of the end.

Yours in Christ, Michael
Paul tells the Ephesians about the Gifts given to the Bride
the Corinthians = that ain't the SDAs Michael

Eph.4:11​
And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;​
12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry,
for the edifying of the body of Christ:​
13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God,
unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:​

And who appointed you to this ministry you speak of Michael ???
 

Icyspark

Active member
Amen, as Jesus alone saves us, not keeping the Sabbath!


Hi YeshuaFan,

That is true! I agree. Have you considered that if you love Jesus that you will be doing what He asks of you?

Exodus 20:4-6
“You shall not make for yourself an image in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below. You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the parents to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me, but showing love to a thousand generations of those who LOVE me and keep my commandments."
John 14:15, 21
If you love me, keep my commands.
Whoever has my commands and keeps them is the one who loves me. The one who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I too will love them and show myself to them.”
1 Corinthians 6:9-11
Dont you realize that those who do wrong will not inherit the Kingdom of God? [Note that here Paul equates doing wrong with salvation.] Dont fool yourselves.Those who indulge in sexual sin, or who worship idols, [Look at that! One of the Ten Commandments!] or commit adultery, [Look at that! Another one of the Ten Commandments!] or are male prostitutes, or practice homosexuality, or are thieves, [Look at that! Yet another one of the ten commandments!] or greedy people, or drunkards, or are abusive, or cheat people none of these will inherit the Kingdom of God. Some of you were once like that. But you were cleansed; you were made holy; you were made right with God by calling on the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.
Jesus alone saves us, but He saves those who love Him and keep His commandments. Paul agrees and indicates the inverse of Jesus's words by saying that those who do not love Jesus (i.e. "those who do wrong") will not be saved. I agree with Jesus and Paul. Do you?

I pray this helps.
 

YeshuaFan

Well-known member
Once again you trot out Sunday sabbatarianism, even though it has been pointed out to you ad nauseum that most Christians do not see Sunday as a Sabbath, do not see it as a holy day, rather, it is simply the day we meet for corporate worship to celebrate the resurrection of our Lord Jesus Christ. Look to the history of the early Church. Christians would meet early Sunday morning to worship and break bread, and would then depart and go about their day.

And, again, I'd like to ask you if you are following Jesus' flesh and blood example and observing all of the Jewish feasts and festivals?
has ANY Sda EVER kept the sabbath as God intended it to be kept? Ellen White?
 

YeshuaFan

Well-known member
Prologue: Do not look, if giving up ignorance is PAINFUL !!!

AV 1Jn 2:6 He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked.

Hypocrites a many, will in ignorance perpetuate sins against the sabbath keepers, who follow Jesus' walk.

Is this true for keeping Sunday too, so a Sunday Law is NEVER needed, ever, Right ???

For many, their day of cognitive dissonance, will be when the Sunday Law goes into affect. To stop people from sinning against GOD on Sunday, Right ???

AV Re 14:9-11 And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive [his] mark in his forehead, or in his hand, 10 The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb: 11 And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.

The day many lose their salvation, is the Sunday Law Death Decree. Because many have no Free Will Choice honored by men, for sabbath rest and sabbath holiness after Jesus' own example, will be outlawed.

That is when my ministry is over, and GOD finishes the Free Will Choice benefits to sinners in the time of the end.

AV Mt 26:28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

So can Jesus' righteousness be declared sin, by the authority of laws of men ???

Yours in Christ, Michael
Jesus was born under the law, ministered under the Law, kept the law fully, so that we are now ujnder NC of GRACE!
 

YeshuaFan

Well-known member
Hi YeshuaFan,

That is true! I agree. Have you considered that if you love Jesus that you will be doing what He asks of you?

Exodus 20:4-6
“You shall not make for yourself an image in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below. You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the parents to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me, but showing love to a thousand generations of those who LOVE me and keep my commandments."
John 14:15, 21
If you love me, keep my commands.
Whoever has my commands and keeps them is the one who loves me. The one who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I too will love them and show myself to them.”
1 Corinthians 6:9-11
Dont you realize that those who do wrong will not inherit the Kingdom of God? [Note that here Paul equates doing wrong with salvation.] Dont fool yourselves.Those who indulge in sexual sin, or who worship idols, [Look at that! One of the Ten Commandments!] or commit adultery, [Look at that! Another one of the Ten Commandments!] or are male prostitutes, or practice homosexuality, or are thieves, [Look at that! Yet another one of the ten commandments!] or greedy people, or drunkards, or are abusive, or cheat people none of these will inherit the Kingdom of God. Some of you were once like that. But you were cleansed; you were made holy; you were made right with God by calling on the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.
Jesus alone saves us, but He saves those who love Him and keep His commandments. Paul agrees and indicates the inverse of Jesus's words by saying that those who do not love Jesus (i.e. "those who do wrong") will not be saved. I agree with Jesus and Paul. Do you?

I pray this helps.
The ONLY commandments for us under the NC to now observe are to love the Lord, love the brethren, and trust in Lord Jesus! NOTHING stating must still keep the sabbath!
 

Icyspark

Active member
Total denial of Ellen White version of it!


Hi YeshuaFan,

What part of the Bible texts below are you claiming belong to Ellen White?

Hi YeshuaFan,

That is true! I agree. Have you considered that if you love Jesus that you will be doing what He asks of you?

Exodus 20:4-6
“You shall not make for yourself an image in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below. You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the parents to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me, but showing love to a thousand generations of those who LOVE me and keep my commandments."
John 14:15, 21
If you love me, keep my commands.
Whoever has my commands and keeps them is the one who loves me. The one who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I too will love them and show myself to them.”
1 Corinthians 6:9-11
Dont you realize that those who do wrong will not inherit the Kingdom of God? [Note that here Paul equates doing wrong with salvation.] Dont fool yourselves.Those who indulge in sexual sin, or who worship idols, [Look at that! One of the Ten Commandments!] or commit adultery, [Look at that! Another one of the Ten Commandments!] or are male prostitutes, or practice homosexuality, or are thieves, [Look at that! Yet another one of the ten commandments!] or greedy people, or drunkards, or are abusive, or cheat people none of these will inherit the Kingdom of God. Some of you were once like that. But you were cleansed; you were made holy; you were made right with God by calling on the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.
Jesus alone saves us, but He saves those who love Him and keep His commandments. Paul agrees and indicates the inverse of Jesus's words by saying that those who do not love Jesus (i.e. "those who do wrong") will not be saved. I agree with Jesus and Paul. Do you?

I pray this helps.
 

Formersda

Active member
Hi YeshuaFan,

That is true! I agree. Have you considered that if you love Jesus that you will be doing what He asks of you?

Exodus 20:4-6
“You shall not make for yourself an image in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below. You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the parents to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me, but showing love to a thousand generations of those who LOVE me and keep my commandments."
John 14:15, 21
If you love me, keep my commands.
Whoever has my commands and keeps them is the one who loves me. The one who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I too will love them and show myself to them.”
1 Corinthians 6:9-11
Dont you realize that those who do wrong will not inherit the Kingdom of God? [Note that here Paul equates doing wrong with salvation.] Dont fool yourselves.Those who indulge in sexual sin, or who worship idols, [Look at that! One of the Ten Commandments!] or commit adultery, [Look at that! Another one of the Ten Commandments!] or are male prostitutes, or practice homosexuality, or are thieves, [Look at that! Yet another one of the ten commandments!] or greedy people, or drunkards, or are abusive, or cheat people none of these will inherit the Kingdom of God. Some of you were once like that. But you were cleansed; you were made holy; you were made right with God by calling on the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.
Jesus alone saves us, but He saves those who love Him and keep His commandments. Paul agrees and indicates the inverse of Jesus's words by saying that those who do not love Jesus (i.e. "those who do wrong") will not be saved. I agree with Jesus and Paul. Do you?

I pray this helps.
And yet again the Greek shows you to be wrong in your assumption that it’s the Ten Commandments. And by the way homosexuality is not in the Ten Commandments. Being drunk is not in the Ten Commandments nor is being greedy part of the Ten Commandments cause as you in your own words state there are only 10, is there a commandment which says thou shalt not be greedy?

Paul (God) also says not to judge someone for the day they observe.

Loving Jesus entails a lot more than keeping 10 laws much more. The New Testament gives many examples of sins.

You are not justified by keeping a day, or not eating pork or drinking pepsi cola. Our salvation is a gift from God not a reward for keeping the sabbath.

You cannot judge someone’s commitment to Jesus by the day they go to church, only God knows their hearts. Not everyone who goes to church every sabbath is saved.
 
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