Sabbath Day Salvation

[Icyspark]

And yet again the Greek shows you to be wrong in your assumption that it’s the Ten Commandments. And by the way homosexuality is not in the Ten Commandments. Being drunk is not in the Ten Commandments nor is being greedy part of the Ten Commandments cause as you in your own words state there are only 10, is there a commandment which says thou shalt not be greedy?

Hi Formersda,

When you say, "yet again," that implies that you've shown "the Greek" to prove me wrong on some previous occasion. I challenge you to share a single time where you've proven me wrong such that you can say "yet again." (Lurkers, please note that this challenge will not be met.)

The problem with this particular challenge of yours is that I didn't make the claim that the Ten Commandments are being addressed in John 14. That's just you assuming. I illustrated that Jesus expects that love and action go hand-in-hand. It doesn't matter what He commands, if you love Him then you will do what He asks of you.

As far as my pointing out specific portions in the quote from Paul which belong to the Ten Commandment covenant, that's just to show you that Paul still considers them valid and valuable and they reveal what qualifies as "those who do wrong." And what does Paul say happens to "those who do wrong"? That's right. They "will NOT inherit the Kingdom of heaven."

Paul (God) also says not to judge someone for the day they observe.

The word Sabbath is not to be found in that text. Neither is it found in that specific book.

Jesus says we're not to judge anyone, yet former Adventists are constantly condemning current SDAs to hell.

Loving Jesus entails a lot more than keeping 10 laws much more. The New Testament gives many examples of sins.

I believe there are three definitions of sin given in Scriptures. The most defined and specific of those three says: "The person who keeps on sinning is guilty of not obeying the Law of God. For sin is breaking the Law of God." If there is no law, there is no sin.

Below👇is what Paul has to say about sin and its relation to the law:

Romans 7:7​

What shall we say, then? Is the law sinful? Certainly not! Nevertheless, I would not have known what sin was had it not been for the law. For I would not have known what coveting really was if the law had not said, “You shall not covet.”​

Do you really believe that the only command which now identifies sin is the singular command not not to covet? Or rather, is Paul appealing to the entire set of Ten Commandments by naming one and realizing that his audience will automagically include all the rest of this set? That's certainly how icy it.

So yes, there are other things which could be included in what qualifies as sin, but the primary definition is transgression of the law. You can't just arbitrarily dismiss the Ten because Paul doesn't allow that.

You are not justified by keeping a day, or not eating pork or drinking pepsi cola. Our salvation is a gift from God not a reward for keeping the sabbath.

The law was never meant as a method of salvation. However, your love reveals if your faith is reals. If you love Jesus then you will obey Jesus. You have recently supplied your own approval of this premise indicating that you agree that lusting can result in loss of salvation. How do you reconcile this frank acknowledgment with your assertion that "Our salvation is a gift from God not a reward for [not lusting after women]"?

You cannot judge someone’s commitment to Jesus by the day they go to church, only God knows their hearts. Not everyone who goes to church every sabbath is saved.

You need to search your heart and harmonize what you believe with regard to lust and how that can keep you from eternal life and your antagonistic attitude toward the set of laws which Paul uses to identify sin. If there is no law, then you're not a sinner. If you're not a sinner then you have no need of a Savior. If you have no need of a Savior then you have no need for Jesus. If you have no need for Jesus then what's keeping you from going straight to heaven? You're sinless. 🤥

You are correct in saying that not everyone who goes to church every Sabbath is saved. Sabbath observance doesn't save you. It is one aspect of your walk with God. Intentionally transgressing God's holy day reveals a lack of love for Jesus.

I pray this helps.

 

[YeshuaFan]

Hi Formersda,

When you say, "yet again," that implies that you've shown "the Greek" to prove me wrong on some previous occasion. I challenge you to share a single time where you've proven me wrong such that you can say "yet again." (Lurkers, please note that this challenge will not be met.)

The problem with this particular challenge of yours is that I didn't make the claim that the Ten Commandments are being addressed in John 14. That's just you assuming. I illustrated that Jesus expects that love and action go hand-in-hand. It doesn't matter what He commands, if you love Him then you will do what He asks of you.

As far as my pointing out specific portions in the quote from Paul which belong to the Ten Commandment covenant, that's just to show you that Paul still considers them valid and valuable and they reveal what qualifies as "those who do wrong." And what does Paul say happens to "those who do wrong"? That's right. They "will NOT inherit the Kingdom of heaven."





The word Sabbath is not to be found in that text. Neither is it found in that specific book.

Jesus says we're not to judge anyone, yet former Adventists are constantly condemning current SDAs to hell.





I believe there are three definitions of sin given in Scriptures. The most defined and specific of those three says: "The person who keeps on sinning is guilty of not obeying the Law of God. For sin is breaking the Law of God." If there is no law, there is no sin.

Below👇is what Paul has to say about sin and its relation to the law:

Romans 7:7​

What shall we say, then? Is the law sinful? Certainly not! Nevertheless, I would not have known what sin was had it not been for the law. For I would not have known what coveting really was if the law had not said, “You shall not covet.”​

Do you really believe that the only command which now identifies sin is the singular command not not to covet? Or rather, is Paul appealing to the entire set of Ten Commandments by naming one and realizing that his audience will automagically include all the rest of this set? That's certainly how icy it.

So yes, there are other things which could be included in what qualifies as sin, but the primary definition is transgression of the law. You can't just arbitrarily dismiss the Ten because Paul doesn't allow that.





The law was never meant as a method of salvation. However, your love reveals if your faith is reals. If you love Jesus then you will obey Jesus. You have recently supplied your own approval of this premise indicating that you agree that lusting can result in loss of salvation. How do you reconcile this frank acknowledgment with your assertion that "Our salvation is a gift from God not a reward for [not lusting after women]"?





You need to search your heart and harmonize what you believe with regard to lust and how that can keep you from eternal life and your antagonistic attitude toward the set of laws which Paul uses to identify sin. If there is no law, then you're not a sinner. If you're not a sinner then you have no need of a Savior. If you have no need of a Savior then you have no need for Jesus. If you have no need for Jesus then what's keeping you from going straight to heaven? You're sinless. 🤥

You are correct in saying that not everyone who goes to church every Sabbath is saved. Sabbath observance doesn't save you. It is one aspect of your walk with God. Intentionally transgressing God's holy day reveals a lack of love for Jesus.

I pray this helps.

Ellen White states that refusing the Sabbath means will be lost, correct?

 

[SDAchristian]

Prologue:
AV 1Jn 3:7 Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.

I am surprised that many do not accept Jesus' model of "righteousness". Do you accept accept Jesus' model of "righteousness" as your own ???

AV 1Jn 3:8-12 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil. 9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God. 10 In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother. 11 For this is the message that ye heard from the beginning, that we should love one another. 12 Not as Cain, [who] was of that wicked one, and slew his brother. And wherefore slew he him? Because his own works were evil, and his brother's righteous.

Who wants to murder righteous people then ???

Jesus was born under the law, ministered under the Law, kept the law fully, so that we are now ujnder NC of GRACE!

AV Re 22:10-13 And he saith unto me, Seal not the sayings of the prophecy of this book: for the time is at hand. 11 He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still. 12 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward [is] with me, to give every man according as his work shall be. 13 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.

What I can not figure out is, How many miss Jesus judging works that are sin, and judging works that are righteousness, in our response to faith and grace ???

My definition of a spiritual self deceived, is someone who can not accept the obvious from Jesus' words.

Yours in Christ, Michael

 

[SDAchristian]

Ellen White states that refusing the Sabbath means will be lost, correct?

Does refusing "my holy day", means refusing to understand GOD's role as Creator ???

Yours in Christ, Michael

 

[Victor]

Ellen White states that refusing the Sabbath means will be lost, correct?

Yes, and not only that but failing to keep it holy:

It means eternal salvation to keep the Sabbath holy unto the Lord. {6T 356.4}​

It begs the question why Ellen White refused salvation, but it also shows that she did.

 

[SDAchristian]

Prologue:
AV Re 13:8-9 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world. 9 If any man have an ear, let him hear.

The spiritual demographics are not in your favor. But you knew that, Right ???

You cannot judge someone’s commitment to Jesus by the day they go to church, only God knows their hearts.

Really, you do not see Sunday Law coming ???

Tell that to GOD, and "my holy day" authority. So is GOD of OC/OT in "my holy day", is not your GOD ???

AV Ex 32:32-33 Yet now, if thou wilt forgive their sin--; and if not, blot me, I pray thee, out of thy book which thou hast written. 33 And the LORD said unto Moses, Whosoever hath sinned against me, him will I blot out of my book.

So Does GOD intent to not keep His Own Word to sinners(see Prologue) ???

Not everyone who goes to church every sabbath is saved.

AV Mt 13:30 Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn.

Imagine that, Jesus did not lie. Ready for more "did not lie" ???

I am sure Lucifer, did attend group worship, for his own selfish reasons before getting kicked out of heaven ...

Your point is the same for ANY church per Jesus, so you have proved nothing.

Yours in Christ, Michael

 

[Buzzard]

Rev.4:11
Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power:
for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created.​

Michael;
Rather than just; in your frustrations; throwing out scripture;
pounding on your keyboard, without thinking;
and; as they say "Bible Thumping"
know what you speak of before you click "Post Reply"

Michael post

AV Re 22:10-13 And he saith unto me, Seal not the sayings of the prophecy of this book: for the time is at hand. 11 He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still. 12 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward [is] with me, to give every man according as his work shall be. 13 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.

What I can not figure out is, How many miss Jesus judging works that are sin, and judging works that are righteousness, in our response to faith and grace ???

My definition of a spiritual self deceived, is someone who can not accept the obvious from Jesus' words.

Yours in Christ, Michael

AV Re 22:10-13 And he saith unto me, Seal not the sayings of the prophecy of this book: for the time is at hand. 11 He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still. 12 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward [is] with me, to give every man according as his work shall be. 13 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.
==============================================================

simple summation of those words
be not deceived brethren
as Christ said
"Ye shall reap what ye have sewn"

For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book,
If any man shall add unto these things,
God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book:

19 And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy,
God shall take away his part out of the book of life,
and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book​

why are you adding to and also taking away those things written ????????

Rev.3:18
I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire,
that thou mayest be rich;
and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed,
and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear;​

And the eyes of them both were opened, and they knew that they were naked;
and they sewed fig leaves together, and made themselves aprons.

and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve,
that thou mayest see.​

Matt.13:51
Jesus saith unto them,
Have ye understood all these things?
They say unto him, Yea, Lord.

52 Then said he unto them,
Therefore every scribe which is instructed unto the kingdom of heaven
is like unto a man that is an householder,
which bringeth forth out of his treasure things new and old.

Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises:
that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature,
having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.

5 And beside this, giving all diligence,
add to your faith virtue; and to virtue knowledge;
6 And to knowledge temperance;
and to temperance patience;
and to patience godliness;
7 And to godliness brotherly kindness;
and to brotherly kindness charity.

8 For if these things be in you, and abound,
they make you that ye shall neither be barren nor unfruitful
in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.

9 But he that lacketh these things is blind, and cannot see afar off,
and hath forgotten that he was purged from his old sins.

 

[Icyspark]

Ellen White states that refusing the Sabbath means will be lost, correct?

Jesus says if you lust after someone not your spouse means will be lost, correct?

 

[YeshuaFan]

Does refusing "my holy day", means refusing to understand GOD's role as Creator ???

Yours in Christ, Michael

sabbath was ONLY given to israel to keep, as a sign to them being in covenant with Yahweh!

 

[YeshuaFan]

Yes, and not only that but failing to keep it holy:

It means eternal salvation to keep the Sabbath holy unto the Lord. {6T 356.4}​

It begs the question why Ellen White refused salvation, but it also shows that she did.

Jesus stated that in Him is eternal life, not in the Sabbath!

 

[YeshuaFan]

Prologue:
AV Re 13:8-9 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world. 9 If any man have an ear, let him hear.

The spiritual demographics are not in your favor. But you knew that, Right ???

Really, you do not see Sunday Law coming ???

Tell that to GOD, and "my holy day" authority. So is GOD of OC/OT in "my holy day", is not your GOD ???

AV Ex 32:32-33 Yet now, if thou wilt forgive their sin--; and if not, blot me, I pray thee, out of thy book which thou hast written. 33 And the LORD said unto Moses, Whosoever hath sinned against me, him will I blot out of my book.

So Does GOD intent to not keep His Own Word to sinners(see Prologue) ???

AV Mt 13:30 Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn.

Imagine that, Jesus did not lie. Ready for more "did not lie" ???

I am sure Lucifer, did attend group worship, for his own selfish reasons before getting kicked out of heaven ...

Your point is the same for ANY church per Jesus, so you have proved nothing.

Yours in Christ, Michael

Apostles observed Sun as the Lords day, do you?

 

[YeshuaFan]

Jesus says if you lust after someone not your spouse means will be lost, correct?

Jesus told us thast the ONLY things God requires from us to to believe on Him that was sent to save us from our sins, period!

 

[Icyspark]

Jesus told us thast the ONLY things God requires from us to to believe on Him that was sent to save us from our sins, period!

Hi YeshuaFan,

Here we see an example of a rejecting what Jesus said in one place and creating disharmony by forcing what He said elsewhere to be contradictory.

Matthew 5:27-29​

“You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall not commit adultery.’ But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart. If your right eye causes you to stumble, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to be thrown into hell. 🔥​

Or have you not read what He says about what to do with your hand which is sinning?

Matthew 5:30​

30 And if your right hand causes you to stumble, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to go into hell. 🔥​

​

So you've caused Jesus to to be in conflict with His teachings, making your jesus error prone and not the all-knowing God of the universe. I'll take the Jesus of the Bible. In the above two examples Jesus gets gruesome in how He expresses His severe view of sin. It is better to gouge out your eye or cut off your hand than to keep on sinning and have your whole body thrown into hell ☠️

I pray this helps.

 

[YeshuaFan]

Hi YeshuaFan,

Here we see an example of a rejecting what Jesus said in one place and creating disharmony by forcing what He said elsewhere to be contradictory.

Matthew 5:27-29​

“You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall not commit adultery.’ But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart. If your right eye causes you to stumble, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to be thrown into hell. 🔥​

Or have you not read what He says about what to do with your hand which is sinning?

Matthew 5:30​

30 And if your right hand causes you to stumble, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to go into hell. 🔥​

​

So you've caused Jesus to to be in conflict with His teachings, making your jesus error prone and not the all-knowing God of the universe. I'll take the Jesus of the Bible. In the above two examples Jesus gets gruesome in how He expresses His severe view of sin. It is better to gouge out your eye or cut off your hand than to keep on sinning and have your whole body thrown into hell ☠️

I pray this helps.

There is NO NT verse that states not keeping the sabbath now is sin!

 

[Icyspark]

There is NO NT verse that states not keeping the sabbath now is sin!

Hi YeshuaFan,

Previously you adamantly asserted:

Jesus told us thast the ONLY things God requires from us to to believe on Him that was sent to save us from our sins, period!

Amazing how you don't wish to reaffirm said belief in the light of Jesus's admonition to either gouge out your eye or cut off your hand in order to stop sinning rather than to have your whole body thrown into hell. 🔥 Now you're just jumping to a new line of thought. It's not a question, but icy it for what it is--a diversionary tactic.

So do you believe your own assertion or not? Is the ONLY thing God requires is belief?

God bless.

 

[YeshuaFan]

Hi YeshuaFan,

Previously you adamantly asserted:


Amazing how you don't wish to reaffirm said belief in the light of Jesus's admonition to either gouge out your eye or cut off your hand in order to stop sinning rather than to have your whole body thrown into hell. 🔥Now you're just jumping to a new line of thought. It's not a question, but icy it for what it is--a diversionary tactic.

So do you believe your own assertion or not? Is the ONLY thing God requires is belief?

God bless.

Saved by Grace alone thru faith alone, remember the reformation?

 

[Icyspark]

Saved by Grace alone thru faith alone, remember the reformation?

Hi YeshuaFan,

There's only one place in the Bible that uses the words "by faith alone." Have you read it? Could you post it here for me?

God bless.

 

[Common Tater]

Prologue:
Actually, I find this question worded properly.

"Do Seventh Day Adventists actually believe that someday their salvation will depend on what day they go to church?", Short answer is Yes.

Is "that someday" today, No.

Will the first/sun day people make first/sun day a salvific issue, in the future with the laws of men and governments, YES !!!

AV Re 13:15 And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed.

A future theocracy is not hard to spot at all. Are you ready for it's fulfillment ???

Just a note of comparison, in GOD's theocracy, had sabbath sins as a punishable sin with death.

Do you realize, how satan has counterfeits of GOD's authority ???

Yours in Christ, Michael

Between Samoa and Auckland we crossed the day-line, and for the first time in our lives we had a week of six days. Tuesday, December 1, was dropped from our reckoning, and we passed from Monday to Wednesday. {BEcho, January 1, 1892 par. 14}

Ellen White blithely transferred her day of corporate worship from the seventh day to the six day in January 1892 and continued to worship on the sixth day until her return to the United States in 1892, Evidently, it was more important for her to worship on the day known as Saturday than the day she had recognized as the seventh day of the week her entire life. So how important was the Fourth Commandment to her after all?

 

[Him]

If our salvation is based on observing the seventh day sabbath, does that mean the Jews already have salvation without Jesus?

No Salvation is in our acceptance of Jesus Christ as our Lord and Savior. In Him we are purged of our old sins and have become vessels fit for holy use being filled by Christ through His Spirit, His Word, His Law, the Love of God shed abroad in our hearts. The life in which He had intended from the beginning. A life through and in Him.

And this, the Word, the Law, His Spirit in our hearts through Christ my friends includes Resting on the Seventh Day Sabbath. It that we have beheld has become one with us.

 

[Him]

Deleted

I am not SDA. And for your information your post is based on subjectivity, how you feel and does nothing to confirm or deny the post you responded to.

Because Salvation is in our acceptance of Jesus Christ as our Lord and Savior. In Him we are purged of our old sins and have become vessels fit for holy use being filled by Christ through His Spirit, His Word, His Law, the Love of God shed abroad in our hearts. The life in which He had intended from the beginning. A life through and in Him.

And this, the Word, the Law, His Spirit in our hearts through Christ my friends includes Resting on the Seventh Day Sabbath. It that we have beheld has become one with us.