Salvation can be seen in this analogy

CrowCross

Super Member
Salvation can be seen in this analogy:

Some say man is in the middle of a lake drowning. Just before he goes under for the last time and dies a life preserver is thrown to him...all he has to do is grab onto the life preserver and be dragged to shore and live.

The real analogy is as follows:

The man has already drowned and laying at the bottom of the lake dead. Jesus has to jump into the lake and drag you to shore then restore life to you. Regenerate you.
 

ReverendRV

Well-known member
Salvation can be seen in this analogy:

Some say man is in the middle of a lake drowning. Just before he goes under for the last time and dies a life preserver is thrown to him...all he has to do is grab onto the life preserver and be dragged to shore and live.

The real analogy is as follows:

The man has already drowned and laying at the bottom of the lake dead. Jesus has to jump into the lake and drag you to shore then restore life to you. Regenerate you.
I agree...

The problem will be when someone points out the Bible says we are Blind, and they choose this explanation over the Spiritually Dead explanation. But the choice of the one over the other, does not sweep the other under the rug...

You'll need to find a way to reinforce the Dead perspective, because it will be undermined out of existence...
 

CrowCross

Super Member
I agree...

The problem will be when someone points out the Bible says we are Blind, and they choose this explanation over the Spiritually Dead explanation. But the choice of the one over the other, does not sweep the other under the rug...

You'll need to find a way to reinforce the Dead perspective, because it will be undermined out of existence...
As you know this analogy came from Eph 2...And you were dead in your trespasses and sins and made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in our trespasses.
 

eternomade

Well-known member
I believe all the miracles performed by Christ were meant to point to mans total inability of obeying the commands of God. Good post. Whether you are deaf, dumb, blind, dead or demon posessed, you do not have the ability to come to Christ on your own.
 

CrowCross

Super Member
I believe all the miracles performed by Christ were meant to point to mans total inability of obeying the commands of God. Good post. Whether you are deaf, dumb, blind, dead or demon posessed, you do not have the ability to come to Christ on your own.
I agree. John 6:65 tells us....Then Jesus said, “This is why I told you that no one can come to Me unless the Father has granted it to him.”
 

ReverendRV

Well-known member
I believe all the miracles performed by Christ were meant to point to mans total inability of obeying the commands of God. Good post. Whether you are deaf, dumb, blind, dead or demon posessed, you do not have the ability to come to Christ on your own.
Regarding inability, these All Conflate...

So when a Verse says we are able, Grace should be presumed to have already appeared to make a 'real' difference in our Salvation...

It's this simple...
 

Synergy

Well-known member
As you know this analogy came from Eph 2...And you were dead in your trespasses and sins and made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in our trespasses.
Once one understands that Eph 1 leads into Eph 2 and upon reading Eph 1:13 then it becomes understandable that the 1st analogy is much closer to spiritual reality than the 2nd analogy can ever be.
 

CrowCross

Super Member
Another anology is a guy is laying in his death bed....he needs medicine to survive. The doctor places the medicine next to his lips and all the patient needs to do is reach their tongue out and touch the medicine...in reality what needs to be done is the doctor has to open the mans mouth and spill the medicine into the patients mouth.
 

cadwell

Well-known member
Salvation can be seen in this analogy:

Some say man is in the middle of a lake drowning. Just before he goes under for the last time and dies a life preserver is thrown to him...all he has to do is grab onto the life preserver and be dragged to shore and live.

The real analogy is as follows:

The man has already drowned and laying at the bottom of the lake dead. Jesus has to jump into the lake and drag you to shore then restore life to you. Regenerate you.
I said before that I am not really a fan of either analogy, but yours in particular, Jesus "restore"s life? I thought everyone starts out dead until Jesus gives life?
 

cadwell

Well-known member
Another anology is a guy is laying in his death bed....he needs medicine to survive. The doctor places the medicine next to his lips and all the patient needs to do is reach their tongue out and touch the medicine...in reality what needs to be done is the doctor has to open the mans mouth and spill the medicine into the patients mouth.
What if the patient calls on the doctor, to administer them the medicine?
 

cadwell

Well-known member
I believe all the miracles performed by Christ were meant to point to mans total inability of obeying the commands of God. Good post. Whether you are deaf, dumb, blind, dead or demon posessed, you do not have the ability to come to Christ on your own.
Luke 18
First the blind man called on Jesus.......38 And he cried, saying, Jesus, thou son of David, have mercy on me.
Then Jesus drew him to Him..........40 And Jesus stood, and commanded him to be brought unto him: and when he was come near, he asked him,
Then Jesus told him what saved him........42 And Jesus said unto him, Receive thy sight: thy faith hath saved thee.

He called on Jesus by faith, a command. Where does this passage show inability?
 

ReverendRV

Well-known member
Luke 18
First the blind man called on Jesus.......38 And he cried, saying, Jesus, thou son of David, have mercy on me.
Then Jesus drew him to Him..........40 And Jesus stood, and commanded him to be brought unto him: and when he was come near, he asked him,
Then Jesus told him what saved him........42 And Jesus said unto him, Receive thy sight: thy faith hath saved thee.

He called on Jesus by faith, a command. Where does this passage show inability?
You have to look outside the Passage, and find Inability elsewhere; for instance, no one can say Jesus is Lord but by the Spirit...

This is a game to so many. We're at the table playing a board game, and it's my turn. I start to roll the dice, but you use a Trump Card that limits me to your one Passage; so I have to move my Man back home. The next time it's my turn, you are out of Trump Cards; so I move my Man to another Verse or Passage...
 

eternomade

Well-known member
He called on Jesus by faith, a command. Where does this passage show inability?
He was blind. Being blind physically means he is unable to see physically. It's a picture of a spiritual reality.

And Jesus said unto him, Receive thy sight: thy faith hath saved thee.
Luke 18:42 KJV

Faith=Christ.

"Thy Christ hath saved thee."
 

eternomade

Well-known member
You have to look outside the Passage, and find Inability elsewhere; for instance, no one can say Jesus is Lord but by the Spirit...

This is a game to so many. We're at the table playing a board game, and it's my turn. I start to roll the dice, but you use a Trump Card that limits me to your one Passage; so I have to move my Man back home. The next time it's my turn, you are out of Trump Cards; so I move my Man to another Verse or Passage...
Being physically deaf does not mean that you are spiritually deaf. A person may look on the outside unable to comprehend spiritual matters, but if God has done a work in them, they understand...
 

cadwell

Well-known member
You have to look outside the Passage, and find Inability elsewhere;
I was responding to a specific statement, concerning miracles of healing, and I chose to deal with blindness first. With very little effort, I found a miraculous healing of a blind man from a passage with ZERO inability.
for instance, no one can say Jesus is Lord but by the Spirit...
So the blind man was regenerated with the Spirit before pentecost?
This is a game to so many. We're at the table playing a board game, and it's my turn. I start to roll the dice, but you use a Trump Card that limits me to your one Passage; so I have to move my Man back home. The next time it's my turn, you are out of Trump Cards; so I move my Man to another Verse or Passage...
Thats a very nice way of admitting to dodging a question.
 
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