saved by God's grace?

dberrie2020

Well-known member
Hi Theo--we have been told by a certain poster on the last board that we are saved only by grace--not by faith or works. And yet, we must obey the commandments in order to be saved...how is that grace--God's UNdeserved favor?

So--if it isn't God's grace which saves--can you reveal to us what does save mankind?(as the saving agent)

Also--what is your evidence God does not give His grace to them which obey His commandments?

Revelation 22:14---King James Version
14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

Or--is that an example of works salvation to you? Is God extending the right to the tree of life--to them which do His commandments--undeserved favor?
 

Theo1689

Well-known member
So--if it isn't God's grace which saves--can you reveal to us what does save mankind?(as the saving agent)

Also--what is your evidence God does not give His grace to them which obey His commandments?

Revelation 22:14---King James Version
14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

Or--is that an example of works salvation to you? Is God extending the right to the tree of life--to them which do His commandments--undeserved favor?

The natural reading of the verse is not "works salvation", no, since it DOES NOT STATE that the "doing his commandments" is what CAUSES "having the right to the tree of life".

But you seem to keep ASSUMING that it demonstrates "causation", which WOULD make it "works salvation".

You keep being asked to show where you see "causation" in the proof-texts you give, and you always RUN AWAY from such challenges. Why is that, I wonder?
 

dberrie2020

Well-known member
The natural reading of the verse is not "works salvation", no, since it DOES NOT STATE that the "doing his commandments" is what CAUSES "having the right to the tree of life".

It connects doing His commandments with the tree of life--that's enough to give faith alone theology serious heartburn, IMO.


Revelation 22:14---King James Version
14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
 

Our Lord's God

Well-known member
The natural reading of the verse is not "works salvation", no, since it DOES NOT STATE that the "doing his commandments" is what CAUSES "having the right to the tree of life".

But you seem to keep ASSUMING that it demonstrates "causation", which WOULD make it "works salvation".

You keep being asked to show where you see "causation" in the proof-texts you give, and you always RUN AWAY from such challenges. Why is that, I wonder?

Just can't see how one thing results in another there eh?
 
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