SCC v. COJCOLDS Settlement agreement

Absolutely. There is not an ounce of compassion, humility, or Christ-like love. Just arrogance and sheer meanness.
I would like to believe it is out of necessity to keep his testimony from cracking, but wow, that last post makes me think otherwise. He is really saying why should we help the sick and hurting, if they can't do it on their own, and accept our message.
 
No, if that actually did happen, for twenty years...LDS lawyers, paid by the LDS church for legal counsel, were either purposely or ignorantly deceiving LDS prophets and apostles, who were and are themselves high profile businessmen, lawyers, and investment professionals, by purposely advising them to lie to the US government, four time a year for 20 years, then I am clearly not that naive one.

You wrote in another thread to Magdalena, about being upset because you were said to blindly follow the prophet...well, these kinds of posts don't help you out in those regards.
Me upset, how so and what are you reading that made you think I was upset....I'm alarmed at the damage folks like you are doing to the youth of our church and yes we do indeed follow our Prophet. The question being is if you believe in Jesus Christ are you fully following him?


Ralf, Eyring taught classes on investments at Stanford School of Business, Oaks is an attorney and managed a college. Uchtdorf, was a VP for a major airline, and a fighter pilot, Faust was a Lawyer, Nelson was a surgeon. Only Monson and Hinkley were educators. Are saying they are that stupid?
I doubt they are stupid. Me being a specialist in carpentry, cabinet making and house building does not mean I can know all about other specialties. So I admire those who are financial specialist and take care of the Church's finances. Again, you don't talk much about who is benefiting from all the investments and savings going on, why? In fact you have not one time given much thought to that question and seem to want to deflect away...



If regard to the first presidency...during the 20 years...

Merrill J. Batemen

Bateman was associate professor of economics at the United States Air Force Academy, 1964–67; professor of economics at BYU and director of Center for Business and Economic Research, 1967–71; and dean of the BYU business school, now the Marriott School of Business, 1975–79.[5] While he was dean, he instituted the BYU Management Society in 1977.[6] he was president of BYU. Bateman was an executive with Mars, Incorporated in England and the United States from 1971 to 1975, and for a brief time in 1979 before heading his own consulting and capital management companies in Orem, Utah.[3] Bateman's consulting involved analyzing patterns in raw food costs, foreign currency rates, and other factors for companies like Kraft Foods and General Foods.[3]

Harold David Burton
Prior to Church employment he worked for Kennecott Copper Corporation and the Utah State Tax Commission.
Burton oversaw the LDS Church's $1.5 billion mixed-use development project called City Creek Center in downtown Salt Lake City.

Richard Crockett Edgley

Prior to his call as a General Authority, Edgley was a vice president of General Mills and a managing director of the Finance and Records Department of the Church. He has a bachelor's degree in political science from Brigham Young University and a master's degree in business administration from Indiana University.

Keith B. McMullin

Bishop McMullin is a banking and finance graduate of the University of Utah. He had earlier been with Ford Motor Company as an investment and financial analyst and also managed several small businesses.

Gary E. Stevenson

Prior to his call as a general authority, Stevenson worked as the chief operating officer of ICON Health & Fitness.[4] He has also served on the Marriott School of Management National Advisory Council and the Utah State University Foundation Board.

Dean M. Davies

Previous to Church employment, Bishop Davies was employed by High Industries, Inc., of Lancaster, Pennsylvania, and by Bechtel Investments, Inc., of San Francisco, California, where he specialized in the identification, acquisition, development, and management of investment properties.

Gerald Causse

Prior to his call as a general authority, Caussé worked for a strategy consulting firm in Paris and London. He later returned to Paris to work for the Carrefour Retail Group. And finally, he was the general manager and a member of the board of Pomona, France's largest food distributor.

W. Christopher Waddell

Beginning in 1984 he worked with Merrill Lynch in several positions, including first vice president of investments.

L. Todd Budge

Bishop Budge worked for Bain & Company Japan, Citibank N.A., and GE Capital in both Atlanta and Japan. In 2003 he became president and chief executive officer of Tokyo Star Bank Limited. From 2008 to 2011 he served as chairman of the board. He retired from the bank in 2011. During this time, he also served as a member of the board of directors for Hawaiian Airlines.

So, Ralf...do you really believe every one of these men were hoodwinked by LDS attorneys to break the laws. These men were really that stupid?
What law Markk, if they did they would be in jail, they broke a regulation, you seem to love to put additional claims into a situation you don't really seem to know much about. You ought to stay on safer ground and keep asking did the Church lie... chuckle.




The church has agreed to pay $1 million and Ensign Peak will pay $4 million in penalties based on the violation. Federal investigators said that, for a period of 22 years, the firm violated agency rules and the Securities Exchange Act by not filing required paperwork that disclosed the value of its assets.Feb 21, 2023

CBS News.
 
LOL if you read the order you would know. They would have had to persuade the leadership to allow Roger Clarke and others to force "investment managers" to sign the 13f forms falsely. Ralf...you have absolutely no idea what the issue is, do you? Did you read the order?

So, to be very clear, "how you would know," is to read the order and what the church was guilty of and why they agreed to the plea bargain and fine.
Violations (not allowed by regulations) Markk!

SEC Charges The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and Its Investment Management Company for Disclosure Failures and Misstated Filings

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
2023-35

Washington D.C., Feb. 21, 2023 —

The Securities and Exchange Commission today announced charges against Ensign Peak Advisers Inc., a non-profit entity operated by The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints to manage the Church’s investments, for failing to file forms that would have disclosed the Church’s equity investments, and for instead filing forms for shell companies that obscured the Church’s portfolio and misstated Ensign Peak’s control over the Church’s investment decisions. The SEC also announced charges against the Church for causing these violations. To settle the charges, Ensign Peak agreed to pay a $4 million penalty and the Church agreed to pay a $1 million penalty.
 
I would like to believe it is out of necessity to keep his testimony from cracking, but wow, that last post makes me think otherwise. He is really saying why should we help the sick and hurting, if they can't do it on their own, and accept our message.
We teach self reliance Markk, its in the scriptures....

Ephesians 4:28

Let the thief no longer steal, but rather let him labor, doing honest work with his own hands, so that he may have something to share with anyone in need.
 
And...??? Two others did who were not exposed, and hopefully more will come forth.

The aftereffects will be with us for awhile that is a no brainer....

LOL...you don't know what a lie is? The lied Ralf, when they falsely filled out the 13f forms knowingly, falsely.
I really don't know all the in's and out's Markk, but I don't think the whistleblower knew everything either...

Pres. Waddell.
Since 2000, Ensign Peak received and relied upon legal counsel regarding how to comply with its reporting obligations while attempting to maintain the privacy of the portfolio. As a result, Ensign Peak established separate companies (LLCs) that each filed Forms 13F instead of a single aggregated filing. Ensign Peak and the Church believe that all securities required to be reported were included in the filings by the separate companies.

In June 2019, the SEC first expressed concern about Ensign Peak’s reporting approach. Ensign Peak adjusted its approach and began filing a single aggregated report. Since that time, 13 quarterly reports have been filed in full accordance with SEC requirements.

This settlement relates to how the forms were filed previously. Ensign Peak and the Church have cooperated with the government over a period of time as we sought resolution.



What they did is hid the wealth of the church from the American people who invest in Wall Street. They were hiding the church wealth. Maybe you don't have an issue with the LDS church lying to the government, and you think it is okay, but it is against the law, and they lied.
Waddell again:

It’s unfortunate ‘60 Minutes’ sought to elevate a story based on unfounded allegations by a former employee who has a different view on how the Church should manage its resources.

On February 21, 2023, the Church released the following statement as it came to a settlement with the Securities and Exchange Commission.

The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and its affiliated investment manager, Ensign Peak Advisors, Inc., have settled a matter with the Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC).

Investment managers who oversee a portfolio of public equities above a certain threshold are required to file Forms 13F with the SEC quarterly. These forms publicly disclose the names of the securities and their values.

Since 2000, Ensign Peak received and relied upon legal counsel regarding how to comply with its reporting obligations while attempting to maintain the privacy of the portfolio. As a result, Ensign Peak established separate companies (LLCs) that each filed Forms 13F instead of a single aggregated filing. Ensign Peak and the Church believe that all securities required to be reported were included in the filings by the separate companies.







Ralf the church lied, and you are throwing people under the bus that acknowledged it. Are you saying the church did not lie?

What are the facts...tell what the church did in your own words...
The Church admitted it was trying to keep privacy in its obligation to the Lord to keep substance in the Storehouse of God.

Since 2000, Ensign Peak received and relied upon legal counsel regarding how to comply with its reporting obligations while attempting to maintain the privacy of the portfolio.
 
I told you a few times. The Corporation of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. They take tithing money in, and invest, and don't take it out unless it benefits the corporation. They did take out 1.3 billion for a mall, and they bailed out a for profit insurance company, with nonprofit fund from the shell companies.

The insurance co. was to secure it and the people who had insurance policies... I would have done the same. The Mall was a investment, a smart investment that is bring in revenue...Last time I looked they take in about 7 billion a year in tithing and only have a outlay of 6 billion... smart folks take the extra 1 billion and invest it...
Out of the 6 billion also comes human aid...


Wouldn't it have been easier and cheaper, much cheaper, if the church would just invest all its funds in the S&P 500, under one LCC...open and transparently? You tell me, why use 12 indiscrete shell companies? The 12 shell companies return's were average, in line with the S&P 500.

Well since you so knowledgable I can assume that is your own investment policy... you should be doing great, but you said the other day both you and I are poor... chuckle.



It was very intentional, and they benefited because they hid the money from the membership, knowing if they knew, many would not tithe to the church.

Confidentiality (Private Privilege) by those who were chosen by God to be shepherds (Spiritual Care) of His Kingdom here on earth...


It was preplanned because the corporation opened 12 shell companies, with phony investment managers, who did not actually manage the respective shell companies. They were fined for lying on the 13f forms...period.

So again, you tell me what they were fined for and make sure you give a CF...it is all in the order I pasted a link to.
The church responds:

The Church believes in being financially responsible by carefully ensuring it has adequate resources available to fulfill its divinely appointed responsibilities. To Church members who support the work of salvation through living the gospel of Jesus Christ, caring for those in need, inviting all to receive the gospel and uniting families for eternity, we’ll continue to move forward consistent with the gospel of Jesus Christ which makes this world a better place.
It’s unfortunate ‘60 Minutes’ sought to elevate a story based on unfounded allegations by a former employee who has a different view on how the Church should manage its resources.
 
Repent and be baptized and confirmed a member oh His Kingdom here on earth.... come fully onto Christ.
With money and resources, Ralf. Pay attention to the conversation. He told us to take care of those in need. That was His priority. That’s what the two commandments He brought us are all about. He told us not to store up earthly wealth, but use it to help alleviate suffering.
 
Violations (not allowed by regulations) Markk!

SEC Charges The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and Its Investment Management Company for Disclosure Failures and Misstated Filings

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
2023-35

Washington D.C., Feb. 21, 2023 —

The Securities and Exchange Commission today announced charges against Ensign Peak Advisers Inc., a non-profit entity operated by The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints to manage the Church’s investments, for failing to file forms that would have disclosed the Church’s equity investments, and for instead filing forms for shell companies that obscured the Church’s portfolio and misstated Ensign Peak’s control over the Church’s investment decisions. The SEC also announced charges against the Church for causing these violations. To settle the charges, Ensign Peak agreed to pay a $4 million penalty and the Church agreed to pay a $1 million penalty.
Yes, they lied on the 13F forms, they left out information.

What are the Disclosure failures and what did they misstated?
 
She was not a leper! read it again Markk...
My bad, I got really sloppy and in a hurry. I apologize.

I just read the accounts, and it is actually Mary saying goodbye to the Lord. She understood He was about to die. And Jesus said there will always be pour, but you won't always have me. It was an act of worship to Christ, in which He accepted.

This is not a proof text for hoarding Money and not feeding the poor. It is an intimate moment of Jesus knowing He is going to the cross.
 
Me upset, how so and what are you reading that made you think I was upset....I'm alarmed at the damage folks like you are doing to the youth of our church and yes we do indeed follow our Prophet. The question being is if you believe in Jesus Christ are you fully following him?
LOL, no Ralf you have been upset, and call fellow LDS members fools, often. Alarmed means all of a sudden being aware of something, yet you claim you have known about this stuff for years and years...so how can you be alarmed.

So, you're just alarmed and not upset that the church is hemorrhaging, and the youth are leaving? Give me a break.

How am I doing anything to the LDS youth? By talking to you? You are the one in position to help them...how do you do that, by hiding the truth from them?

So, do you follow the current prophet in his advancement of teaching the true History of how the BoM was translated? Or do you deny it and support group that oppose that Idea like Hannah Stoddard. Who are you following on this teaching, the prophet or a person making a lot of money opposing the teachings of the church?
 
Ralf...focus, she was a leper who did not care about her expensive perfume, which she could have sold...but gave it away with a good heart.
One correction, Markk...the woman was not a leper, but the host had been one until Jesus had healed him. :) However, the perfume was not worth billions of dollars, either, and hoarded, doing no good for anyone.

The $100 billion plus the LDS Enseign Peaks has squirreled away collecting interest isn't being used to help anyone. How is that a gift of love to Jesus Christ?
 
We teach self reliance Markk, its in the scriptures....

Ephesians 4:28

Let the thief no longer steal, but rather let him labor, doing honest work with his own hands, so that he may have something to share with anyone in need.
This is about thieves learning honest labor to SHARE WITH ANYONE IN NEED.

Did you miss that part? Too bad the folks who handled the $100 plus billion collecting interest in various LDS accounts should have been taught ro use that surplus to "share with anyone in need." And to do "honest labor with their hands."
 
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My bad, I got really sloppy and in a hurry. I apologize.

I just read the accounts, and it is actually Mary saying goodbye to the Lord. She understood He was about to die. And Jesus said there will always be pour, but you won't always have me. It was an act of worship to Christ, in which He accepted.

This is not a proof text for hoarding Money and not feeding the poor. It is an intimate moment of Jesus knowing He is going to the cross.
This is true. The woman could give this gift directly to Jesus since He was physically on the earth. We can't do that now. But Jesus DID say that whenever we do something kind to someone, we do it unto Him. And when we do NOT do something kind to someone, when we have the opportunity, then to the Lord we do NOT do it. The LDS did NOT use any of that huge profit to help ANYONE. So to the Lord, they did NOT do it. Sad.
 
This is true. The woman could give this gift directly to Jesus since He was physically on the earth. We can't do that now. But Jesus DID say that whenever we do something kind to someone, we do it unto Him. And when we do NOT do something kind to someone, when we have the opportunity, then to the Lord we do NOT do it. The LDS did NOT use any of that huge profit to help ANYONE. So to the Lord, they did NOT do it. Sad.
When you read the other Gospel accounts, for me, it is a very touching moment. Mary seemed to understand what was coming more so than the Disciples.

Read Johns account. It was Judas that wanted the oil sold...that puts another twist on this altogether. It was Judas, who was stealing from the offerings...that wanted it.

It reads "This he said, not that he cared for the poor, but because he was a thief, and had the money box; and he used to take what was put in it."

Context is everything.
 
With money and resources, Ralf. Pay attention to the conversation. He told us to take care of those in need. That was His priority. That’s what the two commandments He brought us are all about. He told us not to store up earthly wealth, but use it to help alleviate suffering.
Christ Storehouse is His and He can do with it as He pleases...so you disagree with God and this verse, if so how do you read and interpret it?

Bible:
Bring ye all the tithes into the storehouse, that there may be meat in mine house, and prove me now herewith, saith the LORD of hosts
 
When you read the other Gospel accounts, for me, it is a very touching moment. Mary seemed to understand what was coming more so than the Disciples.

Read Johns account. It was Judas that wanted the oil sold...that puts another twist on this altogether. It was Judas, who was stealing from the offerings...that wanted it.

It reads "This he said, not that he cared for the poor, but because he was a thief, and had the money box; and he used to take what was put in it."

Context is everything.
Yes, very good Markk, what is you point though!
 
Yes, very good Markk, what is you point though!
My point overall is that you created a straw-man, or maybe better stated an excuse for the church to invest monies into the stock market instead of clothing the naked, feed the hungry, giving water to the thirst etc.

Your opinion is that the church owes only the gospel, and teaching people to be self-sufficient...correct?
 
The insurance co. was to secure it and the people who had insurance policies... I would have done the same. The Mall was a investment, a smart investment that is bring in revenue...Last time I looked they take in about 7 billion a year in tithing and only have a outlay of 6 billion... smart folks take the extra 1 billion and invest it...
Out of the 6 billion also comes human aid...
One at a time...

You would have used nonprofit funds, to bail out a for profit business?

What was the total costs of the mall, including dirt and consultant fees, and what is the amount of revenue brought in each year, after expenses, maintenance, and upkeep?

No, you just looked, those are the numbers given by the WM. if I am mistaken, where did you look last to get that data?

Over the past 20 years, out of tithing, how much does the church give to humanitarian aid? Also, how does the church calculate the aid costs? Do the project hourly costs for volunteer help and state that is aid?

How do you know any of what you wrote in the above post...quote your source of information Ralf.
 
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