Open Heart
Well-known member
conversations that make no sense don't teach us anything.Nonsense. We can learn from most anything.
conversations that make no sense don't teach us anything.Nonsense. We can learn from most anything.
You never made a case. You did not mention even one single specific example. I'm very close to just placing you on ignore so that I don't have to bother with you. It is wrong for you to accuse someone unjustly, and it is weird that so many of your posts are nonsensical. I don't think it's worth the energy to reply to you further.Sure I can. The case is "lost on you". You don't have a solid theology. It appears you will accept most any position as long as some "Jew" holds it.
conversations that make no sense don't teach us anything.
Which is PROBABLY the reason that Paul limited his presentation to Jesus, and Him crucified. "Theology" doesn't mean squat to the unregenerate.Over and over again, Christians quote teh New Testament in this forum as if this accomplishes anything. The New Testament is NOT considered God's word by Jews.
You never made a case. You did not mention even one single specific example. I'm very close to just placing you on ignore so that I don't have to bother with you. It is wrong for you to accuse someone unjustly, and it is weird that so many of your posts are nonsensical. I don't think it's worth the energy to reply to you further.
It's been one sided.And we've exchanged how many words between one another?
Or to banjo players.Which is PROBABLY the reason that Paul limited his presentation to Jesus, and Him crucified. "Theology" doesn't mean squat to the unregenerate.
Levitical is eternal, Jeremiah 33:17-26. David and his sons are priests too, 2 Samuel 8:18. They will serve in the 3rd temple, Ezekiel 37-45, with the prince offering his own sin sacrifices.
Actually, each covenant has built on the previous. The Sinai covenant is permanent. It is written.
Yes, and God willed His commandments to be eternal. You can't change that.
Psalm 119:160
All your words are true; all your righteous laws are eternal.
Sure. Jeremiah 31:31
Behold, the days are coming, declares the LORD, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah.
Not going forward, just like they were before the split. It's not hard to understand.
You still not part of it.
In the true God's service.
Just chiming in...This is silly and anti-intellectual. Sorry. Anyone can read, and reading the Quran will convince you that the warlord Muhammed had no encounter with God in his cave. What establishes the New Testament is that it speaks with the same voice and in the same context as the Old, in fact the New Testament is born out of the context of the old. " 6For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given, and the government will be upon His shoulders. And He will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace. 7Of the increase of His government and peace there will be no end. He will reign on the throne of David and over his kingdom, to establish and sustain it with justice and righteousness from that time and forevermore. The zeal of the LORD of Hosts will accomplish this.…"Over and over again, Christians quote teh New Testament in this forum as if this accomplishes anything. The New Testament is NOT considered God's word by Jews. Your quotes accomplish NOTHING. So, as long as you are spinning your wheels, let's hear from other books that have no authority.
Judah is already included in v31.Jeremiah 31:33 LXX http://qbible.com/brenton-septuagint/jeremiah/31.html
For this is my covenant which I will make with the house of Israel; after those days, saith the Lord, I will surely put my laws into their mind, and write them on their hearts; and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people.
But° this° [shall be] the covenant° that° I will make°° with° the house° of Israel;° After° those° days,° saith°° Yahweh,° I will put°°° my law° in their inward parts,° and write°° it in° their hearts;° and will be° their Elohim,° and they° shall be° my people.°
Jeremiah 31:33 Targum Jonathan https://www.sefaria.org/Targum_Jonathan_on_Jeremiah.31.33?lang=bi&with=all&lang2=en
When the decree that was made with the house of Israel has been fulfilled after those days," says the Lord, "I will put my Torah within them, and I will write it on their hearts, and I will be their God, and they shall be my people."
Yes, the Lord clarifies the new covenant which He will make "specifically" with the house of Israel after those days. (i.e. Jeremiah 31:33; Ezekiel 36:26-27) No mention of the house of Judah here.
In Messiah’s (Christ’s) service,
David Behrens
Soli Deo Gloria!
Bringing Christian harmony to all the world
BTW, just so you know, when all of Israel is united, they are called the house of Israel, sometimes house of Jacob, i.e.,Jeremiah 31:33 LXX http://qbible.com/brenton-septuagint/jeremiah/31.html
For this is my covenant which I will make with the house of Israel; after those days, saith the Lord, I will surely put my laws into their mind, and write them on their hearts; and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people.
But° this° [shall be] the covenant° that° I will make°° with° the house° of Israel;° After° those° days,° saith°° Yahweh,° I will put°°° my law° in their inward parts,° and write°° it in° their hearts;° and will be° their Elohim,° and they° shall be° my people.°
You're still excluded.Jeremiah 31:33 Targum Jonathan https://www.sefaria.org/Targum_Jonathan_on_Jeremiah.31.33?lang=bi&with=all&lang2=en
When the decree that was made with the house of Israel has been fulfilled after those days," says the Lord, "I will put my Torah within them, and I will write it on their hearts, and I will be their God, and they shall be my people."
Yes, the Lord clarifies the new covenant which He will make "specifically" with the house of Israel after those days. (i.e. Jeremiah 31:33; Ezekiel 36:26-27) No mention of the house of Judah here.
In the true God's service.In Messiah’s (Christ’s) service,
David Behrens
Soli Deo Gloria!
Bringing Christian harmony to all the world
Chiming in as well. The reference to, "the zeal of the LORD of Hosts will accomplish this...", is used in reference to Hezekiah. That's the context.Just chiming in...This is silly and anti-intellectual. Sorry. Anyone can read, and reading the Quran will convince you that the warlord Muhammed had no encounter with God in his cave. What establishes the New Testament is that it speaks with the same voice and in the same context as the Old, in fact the New Testament is born out of the context of the old. " 6For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given, and the government will be upon His shoulders. And He will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace. 7Of the increase of His government and peace there will be no end. He will reign on the throne of David and over his kingdom, to establish and sustain it with justice and righteousness from that time and forevermore.... The zeal of the LORD of Hosts will accomplish this.…"
There...I just quoted the Old Testament in quoting the New Testament. That's what you missed when you were the "real deal."
Wow...That's how your hermeneutics work? You're going to shred the context to make Isaiah 9 speak of Isaiah 37? Here's a newsflash: the zeal of the Lord of Hosts is not addressed to a single king. They speak of His zeal that never changes. The verses I quoted were not written in the days of Hezekiah...but they were spoken of a light to come out of Galilee.Chiming in as well. The reference to, "the zeal of the LORD of Hosts will accomplish this...", is used in reference to Hezekiah. That's the context.
Isaiah 37
30And this will be a sign to you, O Hezekiah: This year you will eat what grows on its own,
and in the second year
what springs from the same.
But in the third year you will sow and reap; you will plant vineyards and eat their fruit.
31And the surviving remnant of the house of Judah will again take root below
and bear fruit above.
32For a remnant will go forth from Jerusalem, and survivors from Mount Zion.
The zeal of the LORD of Hosts will accomplish this.
And
2 Kings 19
29And this will be a sign to you, O Hezekiah: This year you will eat what grows on its own,
and in the second year
what springs from the same.
But in the third year you will sow and reap;
you will plant vineyards and eat their fruit.
30And the surviving remnant of the house of Judah
will again take root below
and bear fruit above.
31For a remnant will go forth from Jerusalem, and survivors from Mount Zion.
The zeal of the LORD of Hostsd
will accomplish this.
You've missed the real deal and real context.
Isaiah 9 was in Hezekiah's time. The zeal of the LORD...Wow...That's how your hermeneutics work? You're going to shred the context to make Isaiah 9 speak of Isaiah 37? Here's a newsflash: the zeal of the Lord of Hosts is not addressed to a single king. They speak of His zeal that never changes. The verses I quoted were not written in the days of Hezekiah...but they were spoken of a light to come out of Galilee.
Here, in context, Isaiah chapter 9, is where Immanuel issues from: 1Nevertheless, there will be no more gloom for those in distress. In the past He humbled the land of Zebulun and the land of Naphtali, but in the future, He will honor the Way of the Sea, beyond the Jordan, Galilee of the nations: 2The people walking in darkness have seen a great light; on those living in the land of the shadow of death, a light has dawned. a 3You have enlarged the nation and increased its joy. The people rejoice before You as they rejoice at harvest time, as men rejoice in dividing the plunder.
That's why your apostate priests missed Jesus. They snarled and declared nothing comes out of Nazareth. They didn't know the Tenakh and the promise of redemption and light from Galilee. They swore nothing comes out of Nazareth, though he was prophesied clearly with His names and title, in Isaiah 9.
No...It was Ahaz' day...and not Hezekiah. Both our claims are surmise, but yours suggests that Isaiah is not presented in chronological order. I disagree. And why did you ignore the rest o my post, that proves that Messiah comes out of Galilee...and has name and title.Isaiah 9 was in Hezekiah's time. The zeal of the LORD...
Isaiah 7 speaks of King Ahaz. Hezekiah was his son.No...It was Ahaz' day...and not Hezekiah.
Actually, my idea is Chronological.Both our claims are surmise, but yours suggests that Isaiah is not presented in chronological order. I disagree. And why did you ignore the rest o my post, that proves that Messiah comes out of Galilee...and has name and title.
Ahaz reigned 21 years...Your presumption gives his reign a single chapter, and you award Hezekiah with thirty? You have no reason but your own desire to do that.Isaiah 7 speaks of King Ahaz. Hezekiah was his son.
Actually, my idea is Chronological.
Help me understand what "YHWH Strengthens contributes to this argument.Why do avoid what Hezekiah's name means, and that Jesus was never called any of the names in Isa 9:6?
I never said Ahaz is spoken about in one chapter. You can check out the book of Kings as well. Same with Hezekiah.Ahaz reigned 21 years...Your presumption gives his reign a single chapter, and you award Hezekiah with thirty? You have no reason but your own desire to do that.
Mighty God. The person in question is named after the ideas presented.Help me understand what "YHWH Strengthens contributes to this argument.
Clearly, your argument fell dead and is unsupported in the NT.And clearly, you have not yet called Messiah by those names, but you will when you know Him. He is all of those. We actually do call him by those names, without ever being prompted by Isaiah. He is all of those names, and they're found in the NT, although "counselor" is not His Spirit, the "paraklete".
You're missing the point.I never said Ahaz is spoken about in one chapter. You can check out the book of Kings as well. Same with Hezekiah.
Huh? Mighty God is אֵ֣ל גִּבּ֔וֹר, el gibbowr, not Hezekiah. The person in question in Isaiah 9, who comes from Galilee...of whom the increase of government will know no end, Who is your Messiah, is not Hezekiah, whose government ended without increase.Mighty God. The person in question is named after the ideas presented.
You do not know the New Testament as well as you claim. John 20:28Clearly, your argument fell dead and is unsupported in the NT.
I'm saying Hezekiah is the son spoken of. He is witness to the miracles in the other verses I gave.You're missing the point.
You suggest that Isaiah 9 speaks in the context of Isaiah 37.
Why?I suggest that Isaiah 9 was written in the days of Isaiah 7, while Ahaz was still king.
Actually, I made the connection.You want to connect "the zeal of the Lord" to Hezekiah, so that you can avoid the implications that are so clearly made.
Jesus was never called the names, let alone ruled as in Isa 9:7.This is not exegesis. It's contorting the Tenakh for the sake of your requisite denial of the facts. Isaiah nine was written about your Messiah, whose name and titles are clearly spelled out, and who proceeds from Galilee to bring light, in fact, as John wrote, the Light of the World.
My Might, Stength is YH.Huh? Mighty God is אֵ֣ל גִּבּ֔וֹר, el gibbowr, not Hezekiah.
See above.The person in question in Isaiah 9, who comes from Galilee...of whom the increase of government will know no end, Who is your Messiah, is not Hezekiah, whose government ended without increase.
You don't understand that the house of David are Lords and Gods, Zechariah 12:8. Divinity doesn't die.You do not know the New Testament as well as you claim. John 20:28