dingoling.
Well-known member
No, not a joke. It's the real thing.Time travel huh? (joke).
No, not a joke. It's the real thing.Time travel huh? (joke).
I understand ding. I apologize if my joke missed the mark.No, not a joke. It's the real thing.
Can a pastor at an evangelical church do the same? [give the elements as Christ's body and blood]I received the body and blood of Christ today, on All saints. Amen.
The faith of the Evangelical Church, like Scripture, is Christocentric. They both proclaim Christ for you, so in this case the One who consecrates the bread is the One through whom all things were created, see Genesis 1.Could someone point me to the Scripture that tells us that a priest is supposed to "consecrate" the elements of Communion?
Sure if they intended to.Can a pastor at an evangelical church do the same? [give the elements as Christ's body and blood]
Proper Christology is paramount. No escaping that because when ones Christology is wrong, such as Roman Catholicism, then the whole of their belief system is wrong.The faith of the Evangelical Church, like Scripture, is Christocentric. They both proclaim Christ for you, so in this case the One who consecrates the bread is the One through whom all things were created, see Genesis 1.
Paul wrote about that in 1 Corinthians 11, right?When we look at the first hearers of, "Take and eat, this is my body, given for you, etc," the question which comes to mind is how did they understand what Jesus said about the bread and the wine from Scripture?
Jesus is referred to, symbolically, as many things we all love and hold dear. The Living Water. The First and the Last. The Great I AM. The Son of God. And when He used cup in some of His teachings and words it wasn't that He was going to drink a cup or His disciples were going to drink the same cup He was, but was referencing His coming sacrifice and their pending martyrdom.Here are a few examples from the Scriptures of that time. The bread and the wine are a victory meal, see Melchizedek and Abraham. The bread and the wine are gifts from the LORD, the Creator, for the benefit of the body, for example, wine makes the heart glad, bread is for our strength, Psalm 104. There is wine and bread which can't be bought, Isaiah 55. Etc.
You are welcome to believe that. I do not believe when He broke bread and gave the cup the disciples were literally eating His flesh nor drinking His blood. As Passover was a memorial of the flight from Egypt Jesus used that memorial to create the new one, the memorial, remembrance of His sacrifice and like the Passover meal that uses food to represent their trials Jesus used the bread and wine as a representation of what He would go through, what He would accomplish, how He would accomplish, our salvation on the cross.The faith of the disciples in Jesus, the one through whom all things were created and who gave His life for the sins of the world, received the words of institution at face value, that is, as true bread and wine and the true body and blood of the LORD GOD incarnate given for the forgiveness of sins.
Everyone that I know of in the fellowship I belong to understand and believe that Jesus is God and man, the creator. Also, we do not hold that the bread and wine is actually Him but used to symbolize what He accomplished for us on the cross. I am not divisive over this and only seek to understand your understanding but that does not change the challenge of understanding what Jesus did at the Last Supper. Was it literal. Was it symbolic. This is such a deep theological question, not unlike predestination, Melchizedek and other mysteries of God. I would not let our differences to keep me from fellowshipping with you though. You are a brother in the Lord as Bonnie is a sister in Him, and I am grateful for that.Those who do not receive Jesus as true GOD and true man err in the same way with regard to the Supper. Consequently, they believe that the bread and wine are only bread and wine, or that the bread and wine are only bread and wine and here's an imaginative story on how you can get around the LORD GOD's words that they are His body and blood. Others tell a story of how the bread and the wine are really no longer bread and wine.
Thanks BJ.The sum of all this with regard to your question is that the words of institution are part of the Eucharistic prayer, but unlike Roman Catholicism there is no claim of a priest confecting the body and blood of the LORD.
So if I intend it as well, what happens to the bread? Does it become the body of Christ?Sure if they intended to.
Yes it does. Pastors don't have magic powers that only they can bless communion.So if I intend it as well, what happens to the bread? Does it become the body of Christ?
So if I am at home and I pray over bread, does it become the body of Christ?Yes it does. Pastors don't have magic powers that only they can bless communion.
Yes, if you are intending to do the eucharist. Though you would certainly being receiving it illicitly and to your own judgement.So if I am at home and I pray over bread, does it become the body of Christ?
So Christ would allow the bread to become His body even if it is forbidden ^?Yes, if you are intending to do the eucharist. Though you would certainly being receiving it illicitly and to your own judgement.
So Christ would allow the bread to become His body even if it is forbidden ^?
Priest don't have magic power they have the authority.Yes it does. Pastors don't have magic powers that only they can bless communion.
Priest don't have magic power they have the authority.
All Roman Catholics arguments rest on asserted authority, no?Priest don't have magic power they have the authority.
not sure what you mean.... could you elaborate --thanksOf course, even Rome acknowledged this.
Rome acknowledges that there is such a thing as a valid but illicit mass. Example the SSPX.not sure what you mean.... could you elaborate --thanks
I was referring to bread being prayed over at my home -- you said it would become His body [The Eucharist]. Do we [all] have that ability? ThanksRome acknowledges that there is such a thing as a valid but illicit mass. Example the SSPX.
Matthew 18:20 20 "For where two or three gather in my name, there am I with them.”I was referring to bread being prayed over at my home -- you said it would become His body [The Eucharist]. Do we [all] have that ability? Thanks
Mt 18 has nothing to do with the EucharistMatthew 18:20 20 "For where two or three gather in my name, there am I with them.”
Your calling Jesus down for your RC eucharist is for naught for He is already with those of us who are gathered in His name.