The 144,000, Evangelists?

[Yodas_Prodigy]

What proof is there that the 144,000 are Evangelists?

 

[SteveB]

What proof is there that the 144,000 are Evangelists?

David Jeremiah uses Revelation 7:9-10 as evidence that the 144,000 are evangelists.
None of the other articles I'm finding are identifying them.

Who Are the 144,000 in the Book of Revelation?

Like much of Revelation, mystery surrounds the 144,000 Tribulation witnesses. Who are they? What will be their objective? Will they be protected? Will they have any effect on the lost people of the Last Days? Although we do not know everything about the events that will take place and those...

davidjeremiah.blog

 

[Keraz]

The 144,000
Much controversy surrounds them. Who are they and what do they do?

Revelation 7:1-8 sets an earthly scene and says that 12,000 will come from each of the 12 tribes of Israel. This is immediately followed by verses 9-14, telling about a huge crowd of people from every tribe, race, nation and language, who have just passed through a great ordeal.

This ordeal is logically and literally; the just previous, Sixth Seal worldwide disaster, that will destroy the attackers of Israel, as well as the ungodly Israelis. Many prophesies tell us that all of the holy Land will be cleared and cleansed at that time, in preparation for the establishment of a righteous nation there. Isaiah 62:1-5

A people who will be God’s witnesses, Isaiah 43:10, John 15:27 and His Light to the nations. Isaiah 49:8, Matthew 5:14-16

Revelation 14:1-5 also tells us about the 144,000. The Lord stands on Mt Zion and they are with Him. John then sees a flying angel, who is loudly proclaiming the Gospel throughout the earth.
An angel flying above and shouting loudly, is hardly the way to proclaim a message; it would terrify people!


We know that Bible prophecy is a little here, a little there, so to gain more understanding on this subject, we look at Isaiah 66:15-17, where it says the Lord will judge with fire and many will be killed by Him.

After that, He will gather His people, as many prophesies clearly state; Ezekiel 34:11-16, Isaiah 35:1-10, Jeremiah 23:3-4, +

Isaiah 66:18b-21 They are people from every nation, coming on every means of transport, a huge number of people, Jeremiah 31:8-9, some of whom, God will put a sign on and will send to the nations to proclaim His Glory . The 144,000



From these and other Bible prophesies, we are told that the Lord will correct the current situation of having ungodly people in His holy Land. Jeremiah 12:14 says He will uproot all of them and it will be only the righteous believers who will live there. Psalms 37:9-29, Isaiah 35, Isaiah 62:1-5, Romans 9:24-26

Therefore, the sequence is: a soon to happen Day of disaster for the world and all who stood firm in their faith and called out to the Lord for His protection, will go to live in all of the holy Land. There: soon after the fiery Judgement, the Lord will be revealed to them, as 2 Thessalonians 1:4b-10, Revelation 14:1, exactly states.

He will stand on Mt Zion, in Jerusalem and all the people will be divided into 12 groups according to their family characteristics. From each of them, He will select 12,000 young men, who will go out in pairs to proclaim the coming Kingdom of Jesus. The ‘angel’ of Revelation 14:6-7 is symbolic for them and Luke 10:1-10 is the precursor.

There will be more trials and testing for those people, as prophesied, but it will not be more than 20 years, before Jesus Returns to commence His Millennium reign.

 

[TribulationSigns]

The 144,000 are not "Tribulation Witnesses"
The 144,000 are not "converted Jewish men"
The 144,000 are not the headcount of literal people.

The problem with many people is that those who attempt to read Revelation as a literal narrative must say that this means that only literally 144,000 Jews are converted. But this number is used elsewhere and is understood as symbolic in nature. The root numbers of 144,000 are quite obviously the numbers 10 and 12. The number 10 and its multiples (100, 1000, etc) are the numbers of fullness. As demonstrated in the 10 virgins, or the 100 sheep with one going astray, or the 1000 years being as one day. They all signify the fullness of whatever is in view. And the number 12 is illustrative of the Congregation of the Lord, as seen in the Old Covenant 12 tribes of Israel, or the New Covenant 12 Apostles. 1000 times 12 is 12,000. That is the fullness of those children of God who are sealed. And of course, 12,000 times each tribe is 144,000. The perfect measured fulness of the house of God from ALL tribes, as also illustrated in the perfect City of Jerusalem.

Revelation 21:16

• "And the city lieth foursquare, and the length is as large as the breadth: and he measured the city with the reed, twelve thousand furlongs. The length and the breadth and the height of it are equal."

Moreover, there are peculiarities that should readily alert us to the fact that this 144,000 is not the tribes of earthly Israel. First of all, we've seen symbolism all throughout Revelation, and why would God suddenly have this chapter to be curiously understood as a literal narrative, in the midst of all this symbolism? It makes no sense whatsoever.

Secondly, those sealed are said to be made up all the tribes of Israel, and yet all the literal tribes of Israel are not listed. This is because this is Spiritual Israel, an Israel in Christ, not the nation in the middle east. When we examine the census carefully, we find there are significant differences from lists in other places in scripture.

Thirdly, the number 144,000 is 12000 times the 12 tribes, signifying the measured congregation of the Lord's Chosen. 12 is the number of the Church, both seen in the Old and New Covenant. And each tribe here has "exactly" 12,000 sealed, which is yet another indication of the spiritual signification, as also seen in the City of God.

Revelation 21:12-17

• "And had a wall great and high, and had twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels, and names written thereon, which are the names of the twelve tribesof the children of Israel:
  
  
• On the east three gates; on the north three gates; on the south three gates; and on the west three gates.
  
  
• And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and in them the names of the twelve apostlesof the Lamb.
  
  
• And he that talked with me had a golden reed to measure the city, and the gates thereof, and the wall thereof.
  
  
• And the city lieth foursquare, and the length is as large as the breadth: and he measured the city with the reed, twelve thousand furlongs.The length and the breadth and the height of it are equal.
  
  
• And he measured the wall thereof, an hundred and forty and four cubits, according to the measure of a man, that is, of the angel."

The City of God is not 12,000 furlongs by coincidence anymore than each tribe has 12,000 sealed by coincidence. The wall is not 144,000 cubits by coincidence anymore than those sealed of Israel are 144,000. These numbers are God-ordained to signify the full measure of the Israel of God. This liberal use of the number 12 in Revelation illustrates this. Whether the 12 Apostles, the 12 tribes, the tree of life which bare 12 manner of fruit, the 12 gates, the 12 pearls, the 12 foundations, etc., these are spiritual significations of the fullness, for, and of, the body of believers. Not a literal city Jerusalem in the middle east, but a Spiritual Jerusalem in Israel which is Christ. Not a worldly Israel, but a heavenly habitation of God. This Israel is also illustrated in revelation chapter 14.

Revelation 14:1-5

• "And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads.
  
  
• And I heard a voice from heaven, as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of a great thunder: and I heard the voice of harpers harping with their harps:
  
  
• And they sung as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth.
  
  
• These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb.
  
  
• And in their mouth was found no guile: for they are without fault before the throne of God."

Here God tells us clearly who these 144,000 represent! The body of Christ are those who stand on Mount Zion with this Lamb and all have the Father's name written on their foreheads. All part of a New Covenant with Israel, which is not an earthly nation, but spiritual agreement or promise, which is something far superior. As also seen in Hebrews chapter 12. Read carefully and compare:

Hebrews 12:22-24

• "But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels,
• To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,
• And to Jesus the mediator of the New Covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel."

This is the heavenly Jerusalem, the City of God which is 12,000 furlongs and the wall of which is 144,000 cubits. Quite obviously a Spiritual City made up of all those in Christ. Hebrews tells us, "this" is the City which those who are sealed have come unto. "This" is the Mount Sion that the New Covenant signifies, it's not just literally 12,000 each, or 144,000, but an innumerable company of messengers. We are the Children of God. Jew, Greek, or Roman, we are all "one" in Christ. He has broken down that middle wall of partition that separated Jew and Gentile and has reconciled both as one unto God[8]. There is no separate New Covenant with an Israel of Jews and a New Covenant with the Israel of Gentiles, there is only "one" New Covenant, and one mediator, which is Christ! Hebrews chapters 8 and 9 make that abundantly clear if we will receive it. It is the whole congregation of God.

 

[Yodas_Prodigy]

David Jeremiah uses Revelation 7:9-10 as evidence that the 144,000 are evangelists.
None of the other articles I'm finding are identifying them.

Who Are the 144,000 in the Book of Revelation?

Like much of Revelation, mystery surrounds the 144,000 Tribulation witnesses. Who are they? What will be their objective? Will they be protected? Will they have any effect on the lost people of the Last Days? Although we do not know everything about the events that will take place and those...

davidjeremiah.blog

I like Dr. David Jeremiah. I think he is reading into the text.

Another place where the 144,000 are mentioned is followed by this passage:

Revelation 14
6 Then I saw another angel flying in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach to those who dwell on the earth—to every nation, tribe, tongue, and people— 7 saying with a loud voice, “Fear God and give glory to Him, for the hour of His judgment has come; and worship Him who made heaven and earth, the sea and springs of water.”

 

[Shilohsfoal]

What proof is there that the 144,000 are Evangelists?

There's proof that they are of all the tribes of the children of Israel.


7 And after these things I saw four angels standing on the four corners of the earth, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, nor on the sea, nor on any tree.
2 And I saw another angel ascending from the east, having the seal of the living God: and he cried with a loud voice to the four angels, to whom it was given to hurt the earth and the sea,
3 Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads.
4 And I heard the number of them which were sealed: and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel.


There's proof that they have overcome.
Revelation 3:12
Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name.

There's proof that they are redeemed.

Revelation 14:3
These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb.


I would say they probably do everything Jesus tells them to do in the gospel .

 

[SteveB]

I like Dr. David Jeremiah. I think he is reading into the text.

It seemed like that to me too.
FWIW, I have always been taught that the 144000 are witnesses who travel all Israel, telling the people to believe in Jesus.
Another version is that they travel the whole world telling people about Jesus.

It's been long enough that I just don't recall where their being "evangelists" comes from.
🤷🏽‍♂️

Another place where the 144,000 are mentioned is followed by this passage:

Revelation 14
6 Then I saw another angel flying in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach to those who dwell on the earth—to every nation, tribe, tongue, and people— 7 saying with a loud voice, “Fear God and give glory to Him, for the hour of His judgment has come; and worship Him who made heaven and earth, the sea and springs of water.”

I've known that there are Christian television stations that use this to base their existence on.

 

[Shilohsfoal]

It seemed like that to me too.
FWIW, I have always been taught that the 144000 are witnesses who travel all Israel, telling the people to believe in Jesus.
Another version is that they travel the whole world telling people about Jesus.

It's been long enough that I just don't recall where their being "evangelists" comes from.
🤷🏽‍♂️


I've known that there are Christian television stations that use this to base their existence on.

I believe they just travel throughout Israel for 3.5 years .Jesus covers much of what happens between these verses.
Like the scripture says,they follow the Lamb where ever he goes.

Mathew 10:5-6
These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not:
But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.

Mathew 10:23
But when they persecute you in this city, flee ye into another: for verily I say unto you, Ye shall not have gone over the cities of Israel, till the Son of man be come.

 

[SteveB]

I believe they just travel throughout Israel for 3.5 years .Jesus covers much of what happens between these verses.
Like the scripture says,they follow the Lamb where ever he goes.

Mathew 10:5-6
These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not:
But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.

Mathew 10:23
But when they persecute you in this city, flee ye into another: for verily I say unto you, Ye shall not have gone over the cities of Israel, till the Son of man be come.

While I don't specifically have a problem with this, the question is where the bible says they're doing the work of evangelism.

These passages are indeed good, but they're talking about the disciples at that time.

🤷🏽‍♂️

 

[e v e 21]

What proof is there that the 144,000 are Evangelists?

none


the 144k are restored to their original glorious eden body and return
with Christ

just as christ returned after His resurrection

 

[e v e 21]

they comfort jacob left behind during trib…
from which
much of jacob will give their allegiance to God
and after their death during trib
will receive their original glorious eden body
and go home to eden paradise
in the other reality


this earth will pass
and we will not remember it anymore

 

[Shilohsfoal]

While I don't specifically have a problem with this, the question is where the bible says they're doing the work of evangelism.

These passages are indeed good, but they're talking about the disciples at that time.

🤷🏽‍♂️

Are you positive Jesus is only speaking to a few disciples and not many?

Mathew 10:23
But when they persecute you in this city, flee ye into another: for verily I say unto you, Ye shall not have gone over the cities of Israel, till the Son of man be come.

I may have missed the coming of the Son of man,but I don't think I have.

 

[Keraz]

, I have always been taught that the 144000 are witnesses who travel all Israel, telling the people to believe in Jesus.
Another version is that they travel the whole world telling people about Jesus.

The 144k will go out to all the world to proclaim the coming Kingdom of Jesus. As Isaiah 66:19 plainly says.
Two of them will be in Jerusalem for the final 1260 days of this age before Jesus Returns, Revelation 11:1-13

the 144k are restored to their original glorious eden body and return
with Christ

Sorry; just not Biblical.
Rather like a lot of what Dr David Jeremiah says. He is wise and learned.....Matthew 11:25 Too bad for him.

 

[SteveB]

Are you positive Jesus is only speaking to a few disciples and not many?

Mathew 10:23
But when they persecute you in this city, flee ye into another: for verily I say unto you, Ye shall not have gone over the cities of Israel, till the Son of man be come.

I may have missed the coming of the Son of man,but I don't think I have.

I was referring to the people on site, at that time in history.

 

[Shilohsfoal]

I was referring to the people on site, at that time in history.

Well,like the scripture says,they follow the Lamb where ever he goes.This we know.The Lamb traveled through Israel preaching the gospel.
I can't see any of those who follow the Lamb where ever he goes going to NY or California because the Lamb didn't go there.At least not in scripture.

 

[SteveB]

Well,like the scripture says,they follow the Lamb where ever he goes.This we know.The Lamb traveled through Israel preaching the gospel.
I can't see any of those who follow the Lamb where ever he goes going to NY or California because the Lamb didn't go there.At least not in scripture.

Yet Jesus told the disciples to preach the gospel throughout the world.

He further stated that the gospel of the Kingdom would be preach to all nations and then the end would come.

🤷🏽‍♂️

 

[Shilohsfoal]

Yet Jesus told the disciples to preach the gospel throughout the world.

He further stated that the gospel of the Kingdom would be preach to all nations and then the end would come.

🤷🏽‍♂️

As Ive stated already.The Lamb covers alot between these verses.The fact that they are told to not carry money is very telling.

Mathew 10:5-6
These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not:
But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.

Mathew 10:23
But when they persecute you in this city, flee ye into another: for verily I say unto you, Ye shall not have gone over the cities of Israel, till the Son of man be come.

You get a good idea when reading the gospel,the Lamb isn't just talking to 12 disciples.

Take this verse for instance.

Luke 21:28
And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.

Now we know the 144000 are redeemed from the earth being the first fruits to God and to the Lamb.
And we know Jesus was speaking to his disciples because they recorded his words.But I don't believe those 12 disciples witnessed the things leading up to this verse,nor do I believe they were redeemed 2000 years ago.
This leads me to one conclusion, The Lamb of God is speaking directly to those who will be redeemed when they see those things.

Revelation 14:3
These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb.

 

[Keraz]

Now we know the 144000 are redeemed from the earth being the first fruits to God and to the Lamb.

This is speculation. Nowhere does scripture say the 144k will ever leave the earth.
They will do the task the Lord assigns to them; to proclaim the coming Kingdom. Isaiah 66:19
Luke 10:1-10 is the precursor for them.

 

[Shilohsfoal]

This is speculation. Nowhere does scripture say the 144k will ever leave the earth.
They will do the task the Lord assigns to them; to proclaim the coming Kingdom. Isaiah 66:19
Luke 10:1-10 is the precursor for them.

I didn't say they leave the earth.For goodness sakes Keraz.Try to comprehend what your reading before arguing.
I said we know the 144000 are redeemed from the earth being the first fruits to God and to the Lamb.
Now read the following verses and try to actually pay attention to what the verse says.Ive highlighted the part you just called speculation.



Revelation 14:3-14
And they sang a new song before the throne and before the four living creatures and the elders. No one could learn the song except the 144,000 who had been redeemed from the earth.
These are those who did not defile themselves with women, for they remained virgins. They follow the Lamb wherever he goes. They were purchased from among mankind and offered as firstfruits to God and the Lamb.


This is what I said and this is what you call speculation.Your ignorance is not what is bad.Its the fact that you argue based upon ignorance.
It's very annoying.

 

[Keraz]

I re read your post. You don't say what you think the purpose is for the 144k.
The word translated 'redeemed' in Rev 14:3, is 'ransomed' in the REBible. Jesus stands on Mt Zion and selects them out of the vast multitude of Christian peoples. Rev 7:1-10
I proved that their task is to go out to all the world and proclaim the Gospel of the coming Kingdom. Isaiah 66:19

As for frustration caused by misunderstandings, I get that; plenty, as people like you have fixed beliefs about Bible Prophecy and for me to show where they are wrong, causes upset.