LadyLilly
Active member
It wasn't an insult it was a statement. He didn't specify this to a person.
The 7 Sacraments of the Roman Catholic Church
- Thread starter RayneBeau
- Start date
It was an insult and a clear insult. An insult does not have to be directed to a person, it can be general which this one was. But I understand why you wish to defend the poster.
It is just another way of them saying that it went over their heads, they were poor students, they are heretics. There is no difference they are RC insults meaning we are not as smart as them etc.
LadyLilly
Active member
I don't even remember who the poster was. I just didn't see it as you do.
Yep, that s because you have not been here long or RC trained.
LadyLilly
Active member
No.
leonard03782
Well-known member
That is not what your catechism says.
Ccc 1129 The Church affirms that for believers the sacraments of the New Covenant are necessary for salvation.
CCC1257 The Lord himself affirms that Baptism is necessary for salvation.60 He also commands his disciples to proclaim the Gospel to all nations and to baptize them.61 Baptism is necessary for salvation for those to whom the Gospel has been proclaimed and who have had the possibility of asking for this sacrament.62 The Church does not know of any means other than Baptism that assures entry into eternal beatitude; this is why she takes care not to neglect the mission she has received from the Lord to see that all who can be baptized are "reborn of water and the Spirit." God has bound salvation to the sacrament of Baptism, but he himself is not bound by his sacraments.
God is not bound by his sacraments. God can save whomever He desires.
R
Really, infants know the gospel really!
JohnDeVitoOfOld
Well-known member
"Baptism is necessary for salvation for those to whom the Gospel has been proclaimed and who have had the possibility of asking for this sacrament."
Infants can't ask.
"The Church does not know of any means other than Baptism that assures entry into eternal beatitude; this is why she takes care not to neglect the mission she has received from the Lord to see that all who can be baptized are "reborn of water and the Spirit.""
Where is that quote, "reborn of water and the spirit"?
pilgrim
Well-known member
Jesus said, “Let the little children come to me, and do not hinder them, for the kingdom of heaven belongs to such as these.”
John 3:5
JohnDeVitoOfOld
Well-known member
Without even discussing the context developed chapters ealier, I submit this is a misuse of Scripture and an eisegesis. The easy way out is to whine that protestants just oppose what catholics say. "See? I told you that those heretical prots would only say that what I say isn't what Scripture says.". But that is lazy. It does not address the fact that the verse does not speak of baptism whatsoever, nor does it support the implied point that infants do ask to be baptized. Make an effort, try to show that this was spoken of about baptism without reading into it an making assumptions.
Another misuse of Scripture. The verse does not say that whatsoever. The catechism provides it as a direct quote. What does the verse say?
Catholic DRC, John 3:5 - Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
My catholic NAB says "begotten of water and spirit"
Could it possibly that "born of water and of the Spirit" refer to the same birth, the rebirth, hence making the quote in the CCC essentially correct (even though it doesn't exist)?
Catholic DRC, John 3:6 - That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
The association between the words is such that "water" in v5 is "flesh" in v6, and "Spirit" in v5 is "Spirit" in v6. v6 makes it clear that they are two separate items, so they are two separate items in 5, hence two different births, fitting the context of the passage. Born of water and of the Spirit would then mean born of water and reborn of the spirit, not as the CCC says, "reborn of water and the Spirit". What is particularly telling that the catholic church knew full well that this was not a direct quote or that they had any source for the quote is that there is no reference for the quote in the CCC (reminder: paragraph 1257). They knew they were playing fast and loose with it and therefore never provided a reference for people to look up.
leonard03782
Well-known member
So in other words, the rcc contradicts itself. Thank you for admitting that it is not the one true church that Jesus founded.
Children not infants.
Question: Are we saved by knowledge?
Showing your lack of biblical knowledge.
Eph 2
8 For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9 not by works, so that no one can boast.
We are saved by a gift.
pilgrim
Well-known member
And babies can and should receive that gift.
Acts 3:39. "The promise is
for you and your children and for all who are far off—for all whom the Lord our God will call.”
It is a gift and it does not come from baptism. You make an assumption that babies need saving, this assumption has led to the false teaching of limbo, infant baptism and the false practices of refusing to bury unbaptised infants in consecrated grounds.
Of course will they answer the call, is the big question?
JohnDeVitoOfOld
Well-known member
Catholics will and have spoken of man's free will here, and they will and have said here that God does not force a man...until we look here and see that a baby's free will has nothing to do with their salvation and that God forces Himself on the baby, following your logic.
By the way, the verse is Acts 2:39.
Can you tell us what the promise is that Peter is speaking about?