The birds came and devoured them.

Carbon

Well-known member
I’ve been asked by some, why would the birds (devil) come and take the seeds (the gospel) away if these wont, or can’t believe anyway? I’m curious why Arminians would ask this question? Those who asked, would you clarify? What do you mean exactly?

“A sower went out to sow. And as he sowed, some seeds fell along the path, and the birds came and devoured them. Other seeds fell on rocky ground, where they did not have much soil, and immediately they sprang up, since they had no depth of soil, but when the sun rose they were scorched. And since they had no root, they withered away. Other seeds fell among thorns, and the thorns grew up and choked them. Other seeds fell on good soil and produced grain, some a hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty. He who has ears, let him hear.” Matthew 13.
 
Last edited:

ReverendRV

Well-known member
I’ve been asked by some, why would the birds (devil) come and take the seeds (the gospel) away if these wont believe anyway? I’m curious why Arminians would ask this question? Those who asked, would you clarify? What do you mean exactly?

“A sower went out to sow. And as he sowed, some seeds fell along the path, and the birds came and devoured them. Other seeds fell on rocky ground, where they did not have much soil, and immediately they sprang up, since they had no depth of soil, but when the sun rose they were scorched. And since they had no root, they withered away. Other seeds fell among thorns, and the thorns grew up and choked them. Other seeds fell on good soil and produced grain, some a hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty. He who has ears, let him hear.” Matthew 13.
My favorite Parable...
 

Predestined

Well-known member
I’ve been asked by some, why would the birds (devil) come and take the seeds (the gospel) away if these wont, or can’t believe anyway? I’m curious why Arminians would ask this question? Those who asked, would you clarify? What do you mean exactly?

“A sower went out to sow. And as he sowed, some seeds fell along the path, and the birds came and devoured them. Other seeds fell on rocky ground, where they did not have much soil, and immediately they sprang up, since they had no depth of soil, but when the sun rose they were scorched. And since they had no root, they withered away. Other seeds fell among thorns, and the thorns grew up and choked them. Other seeds fell on good soil and produced grain, some a hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty. He who has ears, let him hear.” Matthew 13.

I think this parable is used by Jesus to teach us the effectiveness of his word. I think Satan is much more aware of the effectiveness of God’s Word than many of us. The devil will do anything he can to nullify the efforts of those of us that present the Gospel to the lost. That may have been Christ’s point in the Parable of the Sower and the Seed. When I did street ministry I found it to be most effective when the Holy Spirit Would guide me "go talk to that guy." As compared to just walking up to anyone. That's when I seemed to meet the most resistance. What's really interesting is when the person you're witnessing to isn't buying it at all but the people that are within the sound of your voice are all Ears. So his word doesn't go out and come back avoid, It's powerful, "For the word of God is alive and active. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart." Hebrews 4:12 You can plant the seed into someone your not even talking to.
 

Buzzard

Well-known member
Proverbs 1:1
The proverbs of Solomon the son of David, king of Israel;

2 To know wisdom and instruction;
to perceive the words of understanding;
3 To receive the instruction of wisdom, justice, and judgment, and equity;
4 To give subtilty to the simple, to the young man knowledge and discretion.

5 A wise man will hear, and will increase learning;
and a man of understanding shall attain unto wise counsels:

6 To understand a proverb,
and the interpretation;
the words of the wise,
and their dark sayings.

Matthew 13:1
The same day went Jesus out of the house,
and sat by the sea side.

2 And great multitudes were gathered together unto him,
so that he went into a ship, and sat;
and the whole multitude stood on the shore.

3 And he spake many things unto them in parables,
saying,
Behold, a sower went forth to sow;

4 And when he sowed, some seeds fell by the way side,
and the fowls came and devoured them up
:
................
18 Hear ye therefore the parable of the sower.

19 When any one heareth the word of the kingdom,
and understandeth it not,
then cometh the wicked one,
and catcheth away that which was sown in his heart.
This is he which received seed by the way side
.

So where did all these Fowls these dirty Birds,
Devils and Demons end up ??????????

-------------------- Babylon and Babylon the Great -------------------

Rev.18:1
And after these things I saw another angel come down from heaven,
having great power; and the earth was lightened with his glory.

2 And he cried mightily with a strong voice, saying,
Babylon the great is fallen, is fallen,
and is become the habitation of devils,
and the hold of every foul spirit,
and a cage of every unclean and hateful bird.
 

Sethproton

Well-known member
I’ve been asked by some, why would the birds (devil) come and take the seeds (the gospel) away if these wont, or can’t believe anyway? I’m curious why Arminians would ask this question? Those who asked, would you clarify? What do you mean exactly?

“A sower went out to sow. And as he sowed, some seeds fell along the path, and the birds came and devoured them. Other seeds fell on rocky ground, where they did not have much soil, and immediately they sprang up, since they had no depth of soil, but when the sun rose they were scorched. And since they had no root, they withered away. Other seeds fell among thorns, and the thorns grew up and choked them. Other seeds fell on good soil and produced grain, some a hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty. He who has ears, let him hear.” Matthew 13.
The ground represents the heart of a man, by which he receves the gospel. So the ground represents, thoughts. desires etc.
What is different in each case is the condition of the heart, and the Bible teaches us that we are to guard our hearts. That is our job to watch the condition of our thoughts and desires. The parable teaches the effect of the way we live our lives, and how that makes us open to or closed to God.
 

Carbon

Well-known member
The ground represents the heart of a man, by which he receves the gospel.
I agree.
So the ground represents, thoughts. desires etc.
Don’t thoughts and desires come from the heart?
What is different in each case is the condition of the heart,
Okay, I agree. The thoughts and desires then, come from the condition of the heart. So the ground does not represent the thoughts and desires. But instead, the condition of the heart.
and the Bible teaches us that we are to guard our hearts.
Okay. But how does that relate to the parable? Are you suggesting that fallen man needs to guard his heart and keep it prepared so if he hears the gospel it will be ready to bear fruit?
That is our job to watch the condition of our thoughts and desires. The parable teaches the effect of the way we live our lives, and how that makes us open to or closed to God.
How is fallen man to watch the condition of his heart for the hearing of the gospel? Especially if he never read it?

I’m not seeing how you could logically come to such a conclusion.
 

Sethproton

Well-known member
I agree.

Don’t thoughts and desires come from the heart?

Okay, I agree. The thoughts and desires then, come from the condition of the heart. So the ground does not represent the thoughts and desires. But instead, the condition of the heart.

Okay. But how does that relate to the parable? Are you suggesting that fallen man needs to guard his heart and keep it prepared so if he hears the gospel it will be ready to bear fruit?

How is fallen man to watch the condition of his heart for the hearing of the gospel? Especially if he never read it?

I’m not seeing how you could logically come to such a conclusion.
A good post thanks. I appreciate a reasoned out response void of the normal personal insults. I like it.
The heart of the difference between our understandings is the definition of Total Depravity (or do they now call it Total Inability?)
Your position demands that an unregenerate man is not capable of trusting God. Mine says trust is the only way a man can be regenerated.

This parable shows four heart conditions, one of which you would deem regenerate, but then you have to explain how the seed began to grow in two of the unregenerate hearts.
 

ReverendRV

Well-known member
A good post thanks. I appreciate a reasoned out response void of the normal personal insults. I like it.
The heart of the difference between our understandings is the definition of Total Depravity (or do they now call it Total Inability?)
Your position demands that an unregenerate man is not capable of trusting God. Mine says trust is the only way a man can be regenerated.

This parable shows four heart conditions, one of which you would deem regenerate, but then you have to explain how the seed began to grow in two of the unregenerate hearts.
There are two reasons the Gospel Seed succeeded in the Good Soil; IE the Soil was Tilled/Regenerated, and because the Seed was left alone by the Birds...
 

Sethproton

Well-known member
There are two reasons the Gospel Seed succeeded in the Good Soil; IE the Soil was Tilled/Regenerated, and because the Seed was left alone by the Birds...
Really? You think a tilled ground is a metaphor for regenerated? In that understanding how did the seed get receieved and grow in soil 2 and 3?
 

ReverendRV

Well-known member
How did in grow in unregenerated land?
The Gospel Seed grows in Unregenerated Soil because the Gospel is the Power of God unto Salvation; not Regeneration...

But the Good Soil is where Jesus Christ the Scarecrow is staked out to keep the Birds away...
 

TibiasDad

Well-known member
The Gospel Seed grows in Unregenerated Soil because the Gospel is the Power of God unto Salvation; not Regeneration...

But the Good Soil is where Jesus Christ the Scarecrow is staked out to keep the Birds away...
You know there are treatments for split hairs....;)

Doug
 

ReverendRV

Well-known member
Sounds like a colorful sermon.
Read this then...

The Birds ~ by Reverend RV

Matthew 13:4 GW; Some seeds were planted along the road, and birds came and devoured them.

Jesus used four examples of ground to teach about our Hearts and described them like different kinds of Soils which received a Farmers seed. One was freshly tilled soil, another was weedy soil, yet another was rocky soil, but one was the hardest soil of them all; the trodden path where nothing grew. Jesus would go on to explain that the seed symbolizes his Gospel and its effect on the different types of ‘Souls’. ~ You may have the hardest heart there is and the birds just carry the seed away, but I have news for you; Jesus went on to say that if the birds didn’t fly away with the Gospel seed, you WOULD believe and be Saved. The reason for this conversion is because of how dynamic the Gospel is! The Gospel is the power of God unto Salvation. It is the same power that God raised people from the dead with. You don’t stand a chance and have no control over it; the Gospel can penetrate your Heart no matter what. If you don’t like feeling out of control like this, wait until you hear the rest of the story; the worse is yet to come…

Jesus said that the birds are Satan stealing the Gospel seed from those who don’t understand, lest they believe and be Saved. There is a Spiritual War going on and we’re in the middle of a battle. If you don’t like being out of control regarding the Power of the Gospel, you really shouldn’t like having no control over Satan taking away your best chance in life! What you need is Understanding; let me help you. ~ Have you ever Lied? What name do you call a person if they tell Lies? Have you ever stolen something? What name do you call someone that steals? Are you beginning to understand? Jesus said that Hatred is Murder in the Heart, certainly a hard Heart has hated; right? Have you ever hated anyone? These are only three of the Ten Commandments, shall we go on? If God judged you by this standard would you be innocent or guilty? If you understand, you’d be guilty. Does this bother you?? God sends guilty Sinners to an eternal Hell; but you don’t have to go. You can hang up a scarecrow to keep the birds away…

Jesus was hung on a Cross like a scarecrow. The reason for this was so that he could receive the Wrath of God for Sins he never committed. Jesus lived his whole life and never Sinned by breaking any of God’s Laws. This made him like a spotless lamb whose fleece is white as snow. Jesus gladly gave up his life and shed his blood so that we wouldn’t have to go through this as punishment for our Sins. He died and was buried in a borrowed tomb, but rose from the dead after three calendar days. He conquered death and the grave, and after forty days he ascended to Heaven where he awaits the day he’ll bring us to himself. We’re Saved by Grace through Faith in Jesus as our Risen Lord and Savior, without our tilling the ground. Repent and go to a Church that teaches the Gospel and the Bible. ~ Alfred Hitchcock made a horror film called ‘The Birds’. Nature began to turn on Mankind and the fowls of the air started to attack. No eye or ear was safe from them and many would lose their lives. Stay close to Jesus and you will be safe…

Matthew 13:18 KJV; But blessed are your eyes, for they see: and your ears, for they hear.
 

Carbon

Well-known member
A good post thanks. I appreciate a reasoned out response void of the normal personal insults. I like it.
The heart of the difference between our understandings is the definition of Total Depravity (or do they now call it Total Inability?)
Your position demands that an unregenerate man is not capable of trusting God. Mine says trust is the only way a man can be regenerated.

This parable shows four heart conditions, one of which you would deem regenerate, but then you have to explain how the seed began to grow in two of the unregenerate hearts.
I appreciate your replies also.
I’ll try to answer these later. Thanks
 

Carbon

Well-known member
This parable shows four heart conditions, one of which you would deem regenerate, but then you have to explain how the seed began to grow in two of the unregenerate hearts.
First Seth, we can’t make a doctrine off a parable. The seed (gospel) is the word of God, it has power. When people hear the good news, they react in many different ways.

I have been asked by free willers, why would the devil take the gospel away from those on the wayside if they aren’t going to believe anyway?
That question is rooted in error.
The only way that question would have any true meaning is if I (Reformed believers) believed those on the path were reprobate. I assume, to ask that question they must assume that’s what we believe. But I can only speak for myself here.

I believe if we look at that parable and break it into sections (heart conditions) were looking at it all wrong, we don’t have the ability to divide people up, as these are regenerate, these are reprobate, etc… ext…
Jesus brings this out as He continues with the parable of the “Tares among the Wheat.”
So I believe we can have a wrong way of looking at the parables. Becides didn’t Jesus himself say he speaks in parables to confuse? Matt 13:13-14

With these I’m mind, the gospel goes out into the world where we will have tares mixed with the wheat. We don’t know what God is doing, who He is regenerating or not.
We can see the effects as John 3:7-8 states. We also know there will be many who will hear the words, “depart from Me for I never knew you!”
There is a mystery here.
Picture all men together throughout the world, tares among the wheat, the devil takes the seed from where he is allowed (he’s God’s devil) and we do not know what God is doing with those among the path.
 
Top