The Bodily Resurrection & Ascension of Jesus

glenlogie

Well-known member
The big question to those who deny that Jesus is God is what caused devout Jews to all of a sudden be willing to preach and die for him being God then if was not?
There is a difference who look to scripture to see what is says, to consider all of scripture and try to figure out what it means. And there are those who come in with preconceived ideas and accept or reject certain verses depending on whether they fit their preconceptions
 

YeshuaFan

Well-known member
The big question to those who deny that Jesus is God is what caused devout Jews to all of a sudden be willing to preach and die for him being God then if was not?

There is a difference who look to scripture to see what is says, to consider all of scripture and try to figure out what it means. And there are those who come in with preconceived ideas and accept or reject certain verses depending on whether they fit their preconceptions
We must understand that for the Apostles to then preach that Jesus was very God in human flesh appearing would be just as if a devout Muslim stated Muhammed was Allah in human flesh, sheer Blasphemy if not true to them!
 

Gary Mac

Well-known member
Wrong Jesus called himself "i am", which to the Jewish ment he was claiming to be God,
No he did not, he said I Am has been here from the beginning, he wasnt refering to himself LOL, he was refering To His God who is SPirit and who is Love and is the same in Adam as he was in Abraham, Moses, Mary, Jesus 120 and in me and will be the same tomorrow, for I Am that I am because of He who is in me just as all of these were who they were in Him. Lover is perfect and never changes, for God lis Love, you just never have met Him, But if you ever do see Him as He is ye shall be like Him as well. 1 John 3, which simply is Love, Holy Love, or Holy SPirit as He is called.

You dont have a clue who I am is.

BTW - the Jews falsely accused him of being God from not knowing God themselves just as you are doing, that is why thy had him crucified, not because he said he was Gods son but because they couldn't identify with being a son of God themselves, and that is exactly why you falsely accuse him of being God.
 
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glenlogie

Well-known member
No he did not, he said I Am has been here from the beginning, he wasnt refering to himself LOL, he was refering To His God who is SPirit and who is Love and is the same in Adam as he was in Abraham, Moses, Mary, Jesus 120 and in me and will be the same tomorrow, for I Am that I am because of He who is in me just as all of these were who they were in Him. Lover is perfect and never changes, for God lis Love, you just never have met Him, But if you ever do see Him as He is ye shall be like Him as well. 1 John 3, which simply is Love, Holy Love, or Holy SPirit as He is called.

You dont have a clue who I am is.

BTW - the Jews falsely accused him of being God from not knowing God themselves just as you are doing, that is why thy had him crucified, not because he said he was Gods son but because they couldn't identify with being a son of God themselves, and that is exactly why you falsely accuse him of being God.
Is it safe to say that you cannot read either Greek or Hebrew? I am relying on people that can, so they are more trustworthy than you,
 

civic

Well-known member
Is it safe to say that you cannot read either Greek or Hebrew? I am relying on people that can, so they are more trustworthy than you,
Correct he cannot read Greek or Hebrew and cannot comprehend our English translations. He denies the Deity of Christ and says he is exactly the same a Jesus.
 

civic

Well-known member
Jesus was very clear that you cant see SPirit as you see me, God is a SPirit not a man rodney
In 1 Corinthians 15, Paul considers the reign of Christ: 25 For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet. 26 The last enemy to be destroyed is death. 27 For "God has put all things in subjection under his feet." Paul is proving that Christ must reign until everything is put under his feet by appealing to Psalm 8:6: You have given him dominion over the works of your hands; you have put all things under his feet. But who is David referring to in this Psalm? Who does God put all things under his feet? The Christ? The Messiah? The King? His Son? No in verse 4 David asks ‘what is man that you are mindful of him, and the son of man that you care for him? […] 6 You have given him dominion over the works of your hands; you have put all things under his feet.’ What is man that you are mindful of him? David is speaking about mankind. About humanity. In other words God’s purpose for man is that he rule everything under God. And so when Paul applies this Psalm to Jesus in 1 Corinthians 15 he is applying it to Jesus as man. Jesus is the true man, the true human being who fulfils this Psalm. And so, if when he ascended into heaven Jesus somehow stopped being a human being – well he could not fulfil this Psalm – he could not fulfil God’s charter for humanity.

What does it matter?

First of all
, it is important that we remember Jesus’ humanity because it shows us that human life is extremely valuable in the eyes of God. When God’s Son became a man he did so for eternity – not just for 30 years, not just for 2000 years, but for eternity. We live in a fallen world and as we look around there often seems as if there is nothing very noble about humanity. In many ways we are often no better than the ‘brute beasts’. But Jesus shows us that humanity will not always be like this. Jesus shows us what humanity is meant to be and what humanity one day will be. Human beings are special in God’s eyes, and we know that because the Son of God became a man and remains a man forever.

Secondly, because Jesus retains a human body we know that one day we will be like him. We will be transformed, we will be different, but we will still retain our bodies. Our eternal future will be a physical, bodily future. It is very common for Christians to pit the ‘spiritual’ against the ‘physical’, as if the spiritual was somehow more holy than the physical. We too easily think of redemption in terms of escaping from our bodies. But the problem is that the spiritual can seem vague and so seems less attractive. Images of eternity involve floating around on clouds playing harps. That is part of the reason, if we are honest, that in our heart of hearts we are not sure we really want ‘to go to heaven’ – at least not yet.

We feel like we have so much more that we want to experience here. Eternity just feels less substantial than our current existence on earth. And yet, in reality we are looking forward to the day when our bodies will be redeemed when they will be transformed and glorified - not when they will be dissolved. We are looking forward to a future when we experience more of what it means to be human, because Jesus has gone before us. The on-going humanity of Jesus, then, is a wonderful biblical truth with powerful implications for us as Christians. Orr

hope this helps !!!
 

rod.ney

Well-known member
Oh No, Jesus is not in anyone, only his SPirit is in man. ANd you yourself should Let this same mind, spirit, be in you who was in Christ Jesus. And Gary, just as Jesus was, is rebuked by your religious beliefs that is void of his resurrection in you.

Jesus was very clear that you cant see SPirit as you see me, God is a SPirit not a man rodney
FYI Gary, God the WORD of John 1:1 ( As it clearly says he " was God " ) became " FLESH " in John 1:14 as Jesus Christ! So yes indeed He is God-Man! Case closed Gary!
 

Gary Mac

Well-known member
Is it safe to say that you cannot read either Greek or Hebrew? I am relying on people that can, so they are more trustworthy than you,
As you say you are relying one what others say instead of listening to God Himself. Jesus said that in that day ye shall ask me nothing but go to the Father for yourself and he will give it you. That is the one you should rely instead of mans opinions as you say you rely on. That right there should tell you someting about who I am is if Jesus said go Father yourself. But evidently Jesus words dont count.

You can read it in Hebrew, Greek, Latin, English, and a host of others, fact is I am has been here from the beginning Adam was the first to be as I AM, Jesus didnt come along for another 4000 years, read it yourself. The same I AM who came to Adam where he became like Him is the same I AM who came to Jesus in Matt 3:16 and did the same in hm. Read it yourself. Buyt evidently that doesnt count for you.

The real issue is that you never have me the same I AM, as for me I am that I am because of He who is in me just as these received form Him His same mind, same Spirit, same disposition and walk in His same light. ANd you can read how you are supposed to be as I AM as well, Read 1 John 3 and when you see Who I AM is ye shall be like Him as well. And evidently what is written doesnt count for you.

You dont have a clue what you are talking about from lack in being as I AM is as these were like Him. Abraham, Moses 120 all became like Him. Your religious beliefs will never expose who I Am is to you as He did in all of these, especially Jesus.

See Matt 3:16 this is when all of who I Am is was opened to Jesus. But to you that doesnt count.

There is One that you do not know and it is the same One who all of these became like. But to you that doesnt count.

So these you say you rely on dont have a clue who God is and what they are talking about. WHich explains your comment clearly.
 
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Gary Mac

Well-known member
In 1 Corinthians 15, Paul considers the reign of Christ: 25 For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet. 26 The last enemy to be destroyed is death. 27 For "God has put all things in subjection under his feet." Paul is proving that Christ must reign until everything is put under his feet by appealing to Psalm 8:6: You have given him dominion over the works of your hands; you have put all things under his feet. But who is David referring to in this Psalm? Who does God put all things under his feet? The Christ? The Messiah? The King? His Son? No in verse 4 David asks ‘what is man that you are mindful of him, and the son of man that you care for him? […] 6 You have given him dominion over the works of your hands; you have put all things under his feet.’ What is man that you are mindful of him? David is speaking about mankind. About humanity. In other words God’s purpose for man is that he rule everything under God. And so when Paul applies this Psalm to Jesus in 1 Corinthians 15 he is applying it to Jesus as man. Jesus is the true man, the true human being who fulfils this Psalm. And so, if when he ascended into heaven Jesus somehow stopped being a human being – well he could not fulfil this Psalm – he could not fulfil God’s charter for humanity.

What does it matter?

First of all
, it is important that we remember Jesus’ humanity because it shows us that human life is extremely valuable in the eyes of God. When God’s Son became a man he did so for eternity – not just for 30 years, not just for 2000 years, but for eternity. We live in a fallen world and as we look around there often seems as if there is nothing very noble about humanity. In many ways we are often no better than the ‘brute beasts’. But Jesus shows us that humanity will not always be like this. Jesus shows us what humanity is meant to be and what humanity one day will be. Human beings are special in God’s eyes, and we know that because the Son of God became a man and remains a man forever.

Secondly, because Jesus retains a human body we know that one day we will be like him. We will be transformed, we will be different, but we will still retain our bodies. Our eternal future will be a physical, bodily future. It is very common for Christians to pit the ‘spiritual’ against the ‘physical’, as if the spiritual was somehow more holy than the physical. We too easily think of redemption in terms of escaping from our bodies. But the problem is that the spiritual can seem vague and so seems less attractive. Images of eternity involve floating around on clouds playing harps. That is part of the reason, if we are honest, that in our heart of hearts we are not sure we really want ‘to go to heaven’ – at least not yet.

We feel like we have so much more that we want to experience here. Eternity just feels less substantial than our current existence on earth. And yet, in reality we are looking forward to the day when our bodies will be redeemed when they will be transformed and glorified - not when they will be dissolved. We are looking forward to a future when we experience more of what it means to be human, because Jesus has gone before us. The on-going humanity of Jesus, then, is a wonderful biblical truth with powerful implications for us as Christians. Orr

hope this helps !!!
Ok -- so the Spirit, who God is, came to Jesus in Matt 3:16 and opened all of His heaven to him was not God. So perhaps you tell me who or what spirit that was?
 
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civic

Well-known member
Ok -- so the Spirit who God is came to Jesus in Matt 3:16 and opened all of His heaven to him was not God. So perhaps you tell me who or what spirit that was?
Christ is God. You were not God prior to your human existence. The Son is the Eternal God who became Incarnate- John 1:1;14.
 

Gary Mac

Well-known member
FYI Gary, God the WORD of John 1:1 ( As it clearly says he " was God " ) became " FLESH " in John 1:14 as Jesus Christ!
Yes Gods word is in us all who has received Him just as Jesus received Him where all of His heaven, word, was opened to him as well. See Matt 3:16. Jesus didnt know His word until God gave it to him, nor do you or anyone else.
So yes indeed He is God-Man! Case closed Gary!
And that is exactly why His word is not in you as He was in Jesus and these others who received Him.
 

glenlogie

Well-known member
As you say you are relying one what others say instead of listening to God Himself. Jesus said that in that day ye shall ask me nothing but go to the Father for yourself and he will give it you. That is the one you should rely instead of mans opinions as you say you rely on. That right there should tell you someting about who I am is if Jesus said go Father yourself. But evidently Jesus words dont count.

You can read it in Hebrew, Greek, Latin, English, and a host of others, fact is I am has been here from the beginning Adam was the first to be as I AM, Jesus didnt come along for another 4000 years, read it yourself. The same I AM who came to Adam where he became like Him is the same I AM who came to Jesus in Matt 3:16 and did the same in hm. Read it yourself. Buyt evidently that doesnt count for you.

The real issue is that you never have me the same I AM, as for me I am that I am because of He who is in me just as these received form Him His same mind, same Spirit, same disposition and walk in His same light. ANd you can read how you are supposed to be as I AM as well, Read 1 John 3 and when you see Who I AM is ye shall be like Him as well. And evidently what is written doesnt count for you.

You dont have a clue what you are talking about from lack in being as I AM is as these were like Him. Abraham, Moses 120 all became like Him. Your religious beliefs will never expose who I Am is to you as He did in all of these, especially Jesus.

See Matt 3:16 this is when all of who I Am is was opened to Jesus. But to you that doesnt count.

There is One that you do not know and it is the same One who all of these became like. But to you that doesnt count.

So these you say you rely on dont have a clue who God is and what they are talking about. WHich explains your comment clearly.
You have failed to convince that you have heard God
 

Gary Mac

Well-known member
So if Jesus tells me different than what he told you, what do you do?
First Jesus didnt tell me anything, he is no longer with us. All I do is repeat what was written of Jesus and what he said I should be in the Father myself. If you are any different from what he says you should be in the Father then you do not follow what is written of him at all.

All of Gods revelations are sealed until they are opened to you by obediance just as they were opened to Jesus. See Matt 3:16. You will never get them opened by philosophy or thinking in which you are displaying. You can read tomes on the work of the Holy Spirit and through philosophy and thinking miss the very One who opens His revelation just as He did in Jesus and these others who through obediance received from God Himself WHo made things as clear as light, they they walked in that light as He is in the light.

And in that comparison with your doctrine from that of Jesus, it is easy to see who has seen Him and who hasnt and who are like Him and who isnt, and when ye see Him as He is ye shall be like Him to. 1 John 3.
 
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