The Church vs. The Individual

[Arch Stanton]

That is why I am staying far away from your false teachings

They are not my teachings, they are Christ's teachings through HIS Church!

Never said such a thing.

If you are not of His Church, you are following man-made doctrines outside of His teachings.

You still think the RCC is built on Peter right?

Christ is the head, we are the body

 

[Manfred]

They are not my teachings, they are Christ's teachings through HIS Church!

No, rather mans musings apart from the Holy Spirit as per your own admission.

If you are not of His Church, you are following man-made doctrines outside of His teachings.

I am in the Church Jesus Christ is building. His Spirit indwells me and other believers, we make up His church.
You are left with following men and tradition devoid of the Spirit of God and pretend it is God's church.

Christ is the head, we are the body

Of your church? Nah, if you said Mary is the head, I would have believed you.

 

[Arch Stanton]

No, rather mans musings apart from the Holy Spirit as per your own admission.

'life within me' [Christ in the Eucharist] is not a negative

I am in the Church Jesus Christ is building.

Christ already established His Church .... you are following man-made traditions whether you see it or not 🧐

His Spirit indwells me and other believers, we make up His church.

you are in imperfect communion with Christ and His Church

 

[Manfred]

'life within me' [Christ in the Eucharist] is not a negative

Well Christ does not indwell believers temporarily as you falsely teach.
You do know that Jesus died once.... Oh, no, I forgot, you prefer to ignore that because then you sacrificing Him every week would be wrong...

Christ already established His Church .... you are following man-made traditions whether you see it or not 🧐

And you still think a church is some denomination built on the shoulders of people like the Borgia Pope.
Fortunately for us believes, Jesus said that He would send the Holy Spirit to indwell us and to give us discernment.

Christ is building His church and adding those who He chooses to reveal the Father to.
This pains you so, as it would rob your so called church of the glory it craves for itself.
The Borgia Pope did NOT glorify God, and only your depraved minds would believe that he did.

you are in imperfect communion with Christ and His Church

With your false christ and false church yes.
You are in perfect communion with a false spirit and his deception.

 

[Arch Stanton]

You do know that Jesus died once....

Yes, you learned that through His Catholic Church.

And you still think a church is some denomination built on the shoulders of people

The Catholic Church is not a denomination.

Fortunately for us believes, Jesus said that He would send the Holy Spirit to indwell us and to give us discernment.

You are a 'partial' believer.

 

[Manfred]

Yes, you learned that through His Catholic Church.

No, you did. That is why your faith is based on man and not God.
I received revelation from God, and I can confirm it in the scriptures.

The point you and your man made church are so desperate to ignore, and why you keep going down rabbit trails, is that Jesus died once.

It seems, that your man made church ignores this, as they would sacrifice Him as often as they can. This they do, because the scriptures are folly to them.

The Catholic Church is not a denomination.

Of course the Roman Catholic Church is. Tell me Arch, what does the Roman Catholic church have in common with any of the seven churches mentioned in Revelation?

I can list quite a few it doesn't have in common. Your denomination differs from those churches. There is no pope in Rome for example, no succession etc.

You are a 'partial' believer.

Whatever floats your boat.
I believe Jesus died once for all.
Scripture confirms that Jesus died once for all.

You believe Jesus did not die, once for all.
You are therefore not a believer.

 

[Arch Stanton]

No, you did. That is why your faith is based on man and not God.
I received revelation from God, and I can confirm it in the scriptures.

You would be quite lost without the Catholic Church.... The bible was given to you by Christ's Catholic Church!

The point you and your man made church are so desperate to ignore, and why you keep going down rabbit trails, is that Jesus died once.

Indeed, Christ died once and you learned about this through His only Church [Catholic].

It seems, that your man made church ignores this,

Since you are blinded to the truth, 'It seems' is appropriate. [without 'life within you', you are allowing the deceiver to do his job quite easily.

Tell me Arch, what does the Roman Catholic church have in common with any of the seven churches mentioned in Revelation?

They are all unified under the 'universal' [Catholic] Church.

I believe Jesus died once for all.

Once again, you learned the Christian faith from Christ's Catholic Church.

You are therefore not a believer.

You remain outside of full Communion with Christ and His only Church

 

[Manfred]

You would be quite lost without the Catholic Church.... The bible was given to you by Christ's Catholic Church!

No it wasn't. Lol
A church is nothing more than a building. God uses men. He inspired men like John to write scripture. He inspired men to compile His cannon.

It is funny how you like to give men glory and not God.

If you think the Catholic church is anything close to resembling the RCC then a good read of the Word of God should set you straight. But as your trust is in men and a so called church, and not God, I doubt you will.

Indeed, Christ died once and you learned about this through His only Church [Catholic].

Nope. You think God does not indwell believers but a church?
You think the RCC owns the Cannon?
You are funny, God established His cannon long before your corrupt organization started killing people.

Since you are blinded to the truth, 'It seems' is appropriate. [without 'life within you', you are allowing the deceiver to do his job quite easily.

Thanks for the blasphemy of the Holy Spirit.
As by your testimony above you accuse Him, you will answer to God of course.

They are all unified under the 'universal' [Catholic] Church.

And none of them has a Pope, they were not in Rome and did not make claims like you do.

Once again, you learned the Christian faith from Christ's Catholic Church.

Definitely not the RCC which is NOT the church Christ is building.

You remain outside of full Communion with Christ and His only Church

Nope, I am part of the church Christ is building. Not a church built by men. You are the sadly mistaken.

Why do you sacrifice Christ again and again? Is it because some man in a dress told you, you should.... Lol

 

[Arch Stanton]

No it wasn't. Lol

I noticed you gave no other name

A church is nothing more than a building.

Tell that to the earliest Christians who didn't have buildings

God uses men.

Yes, and they were/are Catholic

He inspired men like John to write scripture. He inspired men to compile His cannon.

Quite Catholic

It is funny how you like to give men glory and not God.

That would be the protesters in the 16th century..... Luther, Zwingli, Calvin, etc.

If you think the Catholic church is anything close to resembling the RCC then a good read of the Word of God should set you straight.

The NT was written by Catholics... and I love reading my Bible

But as your trust is in men

Zwingli, Calvin, Luther....

You think God does not indwell believers but a church?

God gave us the Catholic Church established 2,000 years ago. Your obedience is long overdue

You think the RCC owns the Cannon?

We come in peace.... no cannons here

You are funny,

you will answer to God of course.

and you will as well... every word against His Catholic Church.

Mt 12:36 But I tell you that men will give an account on the day of judgment for every careless word they have spoken.

I am part of the church Christ is building.

Hope you can swim.... crossing the Tiber

 

[Manfred]

I noticed you gave no other name

Why take me out of context?
Is that another trait of the RCC, to misrepresent?

Tell that to the earliest Christians who didn't have buildings

My point exactly. I said a church is not a building. How does your answer address that when your statement was that it is the church that taught me about Jesus. How can a building teach me anything about Jesus?
Your man made church did not teach me. You think your church can cause people to be born again?

God alone grants the free gift of grace. Your apostate church is not involved in that process.

Yes, and they were/are Catholic

Quite Catholic

Definitely not RCC

Where is the church of Rome mentioned in the book?
Lying about something speaks more and more to your character and emulates the RCC.

That would be the protesters in the 16th century..... Luther, Zwingli, Calvin, etc.

The NT was written by Catholics... and I love reading my Bible

Not by RCC. You should stop misrepresenting the church Jesus is building.
You may love reading your Bible, but without Spiritual discernment it means nothing.
Like you not believing that Jesus was sacrificed once, for all. You prefer to put your own spin on what you read, and love to change the Bible to fit with your teaching and then to ignore it when it does not tie up with your tradition.

Quite sad...

Zwingli, Calvin, Luther....

God gave us the Catholic Church established 2,000 years ago. Your obedience is long overdue

You are funny. God did not give us a church. That is how sad your theology is.
God is building His church, and will keep building His church. God certainly did not give anyone the corrupt RCC

If you had a leg to stand on, you would be able to show us in the book of Acts how Peter ever started wearing fine clothes, and a crown. Where Peter instituted the practice of a confessional or how they prayed to Mary, or even went to her for prayer while she was still alive.

You are so absolutely brainwashed that you imagine these things to be true, then you look at your history and see the absolute depravity and you ascribe these atrocities to Christ.

It is shameful Arch, and you should be ashamed to even associate yourself with such filth, yet you delight yourself in it!

We come in peace.... no cannons here



and you will as well... every word against His Catholic Church.

Not afraid of speaking out against cults that are leading people away from Christ.
The sad thing is that you even do it with little children.
Jesus gave you a warning regarding leading the little ones astray. Your Popes and Cardinals are great examples of men leading little children astray.
And you carry it around like a badge

Mt 12:36 But I tell you that men will give an account on the day of judgment for every careless word they have spoken.

Hope you can swim.... crossing the Tiber

Again, I am not afraid to speak out against false teachings. Your continuous support of the actions of "men of the cloth" and atrocities committed against children and your condoning of murder and ascribing it all to work of Christ is evidence enough for me and should be for anyone reading this exchange.

Your attempt at "scaring" me is baseless and quoting scripture to me as you judge me does not concern me.
God will be my Judge, and yours. He will also judge you for your supporting the Borgia Pope in every careless word he spoke, and for the murder and adultery he committed while representing Christ on earth.

 

[Arch Stanton]

Why take me out of context?

? ... you never give a name of the early Church. All you do is say the Catholic Church didn't exist at the time [study more Manfred!] 🤔

Is that another trait of the RCC, to misrepresent?

You have been misrepresenting Christ's Catholic Church for years!!!

I said a church is not a building.

Mustard seed Manfred, Mustard seed! 🥱

Your man made church did not teach me. You think your church can cause people to be born again?

Since you have no idea what 'born again' means, you are being tossed to and fro [Eph 4:14]

God alone grants the free gift of grace.

Yes indeed.... through His Church [Catholic]

Your apostate church is not involved in that process.

You mean the make believe ecclesial community you belong to, where they teach a false gospel [Gal 1:8, Mt 7:15]

Where is the church of Rome mentioned in the book?

The Catholic Church? [Acts 9:31-32]

God did not give us a church.

He did not give us a protesters ecclesial community.... that would be the deceiver, and you bought it hook, line, and sinker!

Not afraid of speaking out against cults that are leading people away from Christ.

Cults [Mormons] AND heresies from the 16th century! You should do more reading of truth Manfred, and spend less time believing your pastors false preaching.

Your attempt at "scaring" me is baseless and quoting scripture to me as you judge me does not concern me.

Mt 12:36 😟

 

[Manfred]

? ... you never give a name of the early Church. All you do is say the Catholic Church didn't exist at the time [study more Manfred!] 🤔

You want a name?
4 From John, to the seven churches that are in the province of Asia:
2 “To the angel of the church in Ephesus, write the following:
8 “To the angel of the church in Smyrna write the following:
12 “To the angel of the church in Pergamum write the following:
18 “To the angel of the church in Thyatira write the following:
3 “To the angel of the church in Sardis write the following:
7 “To the angel of the church in Philadelphia write the following:
14 “To the angel of the church in Laodicea write the following:

It would behoove you to read what is written about these and see the doctrinal differences.
And you think Peter was their Pope, sitting in Rome wearing a dress, and a crown, praying to Mary.

You have been misrepresenting Christ's Catholic Church for years!!!

The RCC is not the Church Christ is building.
You are building a church on men like the Borgia pope and then claim them to have represented Christ.
It is not good to say that Jesus Christ condoned a murderer, guilty of incest and all sorts of other depravities.

Mustard seed Manfred, Mustard seed! 🥱

And still not a building.
What is boring you? The fact that the church is not a building?

Since you have no idea what 'born again' means, you are being tossed to and fro [Eph 4:14]

That is almost funny.
Perhaps you want to try and teach me what born again means.
Give it your best go!
Perhaps a testimony?

Yes indeed.... through His Church [Catholic]

Where does it say such a thing Arch?
Arch Stanton chapter 5 verse 1?

You are only fooling yourself, and you are teaching others falsely.
Perhaps you just have that much disdain for the Holy Spirit, that you would rather glorify men than God.

As I have said, you follow men and not God and want to pretend the RCC is God's church?

You mean the make believe ecclesial community you belong to, where they teach a false gospel [Gal 1:8, Mt 7:15]

I meant what I said. No need to try and just claim something.
Make believe? You believe that Christ building His church is just make believe...
It is a sad state you are in.

The Catholic Church? [Acts 9:31-32]

No mention there about the RCC. Why the lie?
31 Then the church throughout Judea, Galilee, and Samaria experienced peace and thus was strengthened. Living in the fear of the Lord and in the encouragement of the Holy Spirit, the church increased in numbers.

How do you suppose the church kept growing? Where is Peter and Rome mentioned? Popery? Priests forgiving sin? Bowing down to and praying to Mary?

He did not give us a protesters ecclesial community.... that would be the deceiver, and you bought it hook, line, and sinker!

You call the Holy Spirit a deceiver. That is on you Arch...

Cults [Mormons] AND heresies from the 16th century! You should do more reading of truth Manfred, and spend less time believing your pastors false preaching.

Mt 12:36 😟

False preaching? Like what?
You don't even have a clue as to what is taught by my Pastor. Why not enlighten everyone as to the false teachings of my Pastor?

Why do you need to be deceptive and lie about others you don't even know? Is it perhaps the spirit within you that allows you to do such things?

 

[Arch Stanton]

You want a name?
4 From John, to the seven churches that are in the province of Asia:
2 “To the angel of the church in Ephesus, write the following:
8 “To the angel of the church in Smyrna write the following:
12 “To the angel of the church in Pergamum write the following:
18 “To the angel of the church in Thyatira write the following:
3 “To the angel of the church in Sardis write the following:
7 “To the angel of the church in Philadelphia write the following:
14 “To the angel of the church in Laodicea write the following:

It would behoove you to read what is written about these and see the doctrinal differences.

John to the seven churches [Catholic] under him.... nothing wrong with correcting those that go astray [like you have fallen away from the truth and need guidance].

And you think Peter was their Pope,

no I don't, since John wrote this many years after Pierre's death.

The RCC is not the Church Christ is building.

Christ already built [established] His Catholic Church.

What is boring you?

Your lack of historical knowledge.

Perhaps you want to try and teach me what born again means.

Christ's Church teaches baptism.... you follow man-made beliefs from the 16th century. A false doctrine.

Where does it say such a thing Arch?

I already supplied the verse but here it is again....

Acts 9:31-32 The CHURCH THROUGHOUT all Judea, Galilee, and Samaria was at peace. It was being built up and walked in the fear of the Lord, and with the consolation of the holy Spirit it grew in numbers.

As PETER was passing THROUGH EVERY REGION, he went down to the holy ones living in Lydda.

I meant what I said.

and will have to answer for it ... alllllll of it

You call the Holy Spirit a deceiver.

You are lying once again....

False preaching? Like what?

Almost every post from you is preaching a false doctrine.

You don't even have a clue as to what is taught by my Pastor.

Since I have read hundreds of your posts on the Catholic board I can only imagine the lack of truth that is spewed.

Why do you need to be deceptive and lie about others you don't even know?

Hmmm, that is the point!!!! YOU don't know Christ's Church, and yet you lie about His Church allllllll the time.

Is it perhaps the spirit within you that allows you to do such things?

The Holy Spirit guides His Catholic Church and you are preaching false doctrines and hatred.

 

[Manfred]

John to the seven churches [Catholic] under him.... nothing wrong with correcting those that go astray [like you have fallen away from the truth and need guidance].

Nothing there about your RCC Arch
Why do you have to keep lying about it? All can see your error but you...

no I don't, since John wrote this many years after Pierre's death.

And? Where is the church of Rome or Peter's seat mentioned? Can you at least discern that they even had differing doctrine?
And you claim they were all part of the Church in Rome...

Christ already built [established] His Catholic Church.

And the church that He started building on the day of Pentecost is still not your RCC.
You keep saying Catholic and removing the Roman part. You therefore are partly correct.

Your lack of historical knowledge.

Historical knowledge that the church is not a building....
Now you are just boring everyone

Christ's Church teaches baptism.... you follow man-made beliefs from the 16th century. A false doctrine.

Nope. The word of God teaches everything that is required for salvation. It is the Spirit that teaches us about Baptism through the inspired scriptures.
Why do you accuse me of something you know nothing about? Why the need to lie?

I already supplied the verse but here it is again....

Acts 9:31-32 The CHURCH THROUGHOUT all Judea, Galilee, and Samaria was at peace. It was being built up and walked in the fear of the Lord, and with the consolation of the holy Spirit it grew in numbers.

Nothing there that the church is teaching people Arch?
It says it is the Holy Spirit

As PETER was passing THROUGH EVERY REGION, he went down to the holy ones living in Lydda.

and will have to answer for it ... alllllll of it

You are lying once again....

You accuse me of being a deceiver. I declare to you that I do not follow men and that as per Paul I walk in the Spirit and not in the flesh.
When you then say I have a deceiving spirit, as you did, you attribute deception to the Holy Spirit, and indeed you will have to answer to allllll of it Arch.
So where have I lied?

Almost every post from you is preaching a false doctrine.

Be specific? Because I am challenging you on your claims that the RCC, the church built by men is not the church Christ is building?

Since I have read hundreds of your posts on the Catholic board I can only imagine the lack of truth that is spewed.

Imagine away. That is why you accuse yourself. Prove things Arch, instead of imagining them.

Hmmm, that is the point!!!! YOU don't know Christ's Church, and yet you lie about His Church allllllll the time.

Lie? What lie? I believe that Jesus Christ is building His church and that it is not the man made church known as the RCC. Is that a lie to you?

The Holy Spirit guides His Catholic Church and you are preaching false doctrines and hatred.

No Arch. Your church hangs onto doctrines about your Queen that goes against the Spirit of God. Saying it is lead by the Holy Spirit is wishful thinking. The Spirit of God does not indwell a so called representative of Christ and leads him to commit murder, and incest and all sorts of other atrocities.
Why do you want to say the Spirit guides you into such things?

 

[Arch Stanton]

Nothing there about your RCC Arch

The 'Church Throughout' is the universal Catholic Church.

You accuse me of being a deceiver.

Reading comprehension.... I said the deceiver [Satan].

So where have I lied?

Everything you say about Christ's Catholic Church is a lie.

Imagine away.

I imagine you 'crossing the Tiber' on a raft.

Why do you want to say the Spirit guides you into such things?

The HS guides His Catholic Church.

 

[Manfred]

The 'Church Throughout' is the universal Catholic Church.

Catholic means universal.
Roman Catholic is not the universal church.
Every person who is born again, is a member of the universal church. You are NOT born again through a church, but through the Spirit.
Jesus explains it in John chapter 3.

Reading comprehension.... I said the deceiver [Satan].

If Satan is deceiving me as you claim, then you are saying the spirit in me is from the deceiver.
I state that the Spirit in me is the Holy Spirit of God. So be careful not to call the Ho;y Spirit a spirit of deception.

Everything you say about Christ's Catholic Church is a lie.

I have nothing against the church (catholic) that Christ is building. What I see in the Roman Catholic Church, is not what Christ is building, and I have not lied.

Do you sacrifice Jesus whenever you can... Did I lie?
Does scripture say His sacrifice was done once for all.... Does scripture lie?
Was the Borgia pope the representative of Christ on earth..... Did I lie?
Is Jesus and not Peter the cornerstone on which the church is built...... Did I lie?

The HS guides His Catholic Church.

Not you then... So in order not to misrepresent you, you are admitting that you are lead through a church, and not by the Spirit as we are commanded in scripture? Perhaps you can explain how a church guides you.

 

[Arch Stanton]

Catholic means universal.

Correct

Roman Catholic is not the universal church.

It is where Peter and Paul were killed [Rome]... Peter could just as easily headquartered [stayed] in Antioch.

Every person who is born again, is a member of the universal church.

Yes, by being baptized.

You are NOT born again through a church, but through the Spirit.

Again, through baptism.

If Satan is deceiving me as you claim,

You have separated yourself from Christ's ONE True Church.... you can put that on yourself if you like.

I have not lied.

Do you sacrifice Jesus whenever you can... Did I lie?

You lied

Does scripture say His sacrifice was done once for all.... Does scripture lie?

You lied

Is Jesus and not Peter the cornerstone on which the church is built...... Did I lie?

You lied about Peter's mission given to him by Christ.

Not you then... So in order not to misrepresent you, you are admitting that you are lead through a church,

The Church is the pillar and foundation of [the] truth.
The wisdom of God in made known through the Church.

 

[Gary Mac]

What should be the outcome when there is a conflict or disagreement between “the church” and the “individual" about what Scripture teaches? Should the individual submit to the church's interpretation of Scripture or should the church submit to the individual interpretation of Scripture? Or should the individual leave the church if no agreement can be reached?

Gods church is like Him, walk as He walks in His same light, perfect even as your Father in heaven is perfect, holy pure and without sin. if what ever creed one clings to and they do not have from God that what Jesus had from Him then they are not Gods church at all. Walk away from the and cling to the commands of Jesus to be one in the Father was he was one in Him, He in you and you in Him as one.

 

[Anselm01]

Gods church is like Him, walk as He walks in His same light, perfect even as your Father in heaven is perfect, holy pure and without sin. if what ever creed one clings to and they do not have from God that what Jesus had from Him then they are not Gods church at all. Walk away from the and cling to the commands of Jesus to be one in the Father was he was one in Him, He in you and you in Him as one.

So, you would say then that the Church must submit to your interpretation.

 

[Our Lord's God]

What should be the outcome when there is a conflict or disagreement between “the church” and the “individual" about what Scripture teaches? Should the individual submit to the church's interpretation of Scripture or should the church submit to the individual interpretation of Scripture? Or should the individual leave the church if no agreement can be reached?

It's not your problem to solve but God's. The individual should be led by the Spirit of God and so what He says.