THE DAY OF THE LORD AND THE COMING JUDGEMENT

JDS

Well-known member
There are 4 major themes in the prophetic word of God that one must be aware of if he is going to properly understand eschatology. They are as follows in no particular order.
1) The Kingdom of God
2) The two comings of Jesus Christ - once to suffer and once to rule
3) The remnant
4) The day of the Lord.

I will give some information about the day of the Lord that is true in a KJV Bible. It may not be true in some other translations. If it is not true in your Bible you need to hold it suspect.

The phrase “day of the Lord” is found in the scriptures 30 times in 29 verses. It is always future and it is always associated with fire, indignation, and judgement of God. Interestingly, the number thirty is the number in scripture for maturity. Jesus was 30 years old when he began his ministry and the priests of Israel must be 30 years old to enter the priesthood. When John began to write his Revelation of Jesus Christ he said he was on the isle called Patmos on the Lord’s day. That was a little different but if it is referencing the same day and the difference in phrasing was purposeful then one should pursue studying it and asking the text why it is different. There is an answer.

Twelve different Bible writers discussed the day of the Lord. Eleven of the Bible writers discussed the beginning of the day under this heading and one discussed the end of the day. This is a very important doctrine to the Jews and they were so familiar with it that it could be stated to them as “that day” with no other context and they would understand it was the day of the Lord.

Here is a passage where that occurs.

Matthew 7:22
Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

This is the sermon on the mount. Read the context.

The Lord’s coming judgement is described under this heading.
 

Arkycharlie

Active member
Joel 2:
1 Blow a trumpet in Zion, and sound an alarm on My holy mountain! Let all the inhabitants of the land tremble. For the day of the Lord is coming; Surely it is near,
2 A day of darkness and gloom. A day of clouds and thick darkness. As the dawn is spread over the mountains,
So there is a great and mighty people; There has never been anything like it, nor will there be again after it
To the years of many generations
.
3 A fire consumes before them and behind them a flame burns. The land is like the garden of Eden before them but a desolate wilderness behind them, and nothing at all escapes them.​
Ezekiel 36:
33 ‘This is what the Lord God says: “On the day that I cleanse you from all your wrongdoings, I will populate the cities, and the places of ruins will be rebuilt.​
34 The desolated land will be cultivated instead of being a desolation in the sight of everyone who passes by.​
35 And they will say, ‘This desolated land has become like the Garden of Eden; and the waste, desolated and ruined cities are fortified and inhabited.’​
36 Then the nations around you that are left will know that I, the Lord, have rebuilt the ruined places and planted that which was desolated; I, the Lord, have spoken, and I will do it.”​

Have you factored in the Book of Joel in your study of the Day of the LORD? If not, I suggest that you’re really not in a position to speak with any authority on its timing or purpose! JMO
 

JDS

Well-known member
Joel 2:
1 Blow a trumpet in Zion, and sound an alarm on My holy mountain! Let all the inhabitants of the land tremble. For the day of the Lord is coming; Surely it is near,​
2 A day of darkness and gloom. A day of clouds and thick darkness. As the dawn is spread over the mountains,​
So there is a great and mighty people; There has never been anything like it, nor will there be again after it
To the years of many generations.​
3 A fire consumes before them and behind them a flame burns. The land is like the garden of Eden before them but a desolate wilderness behind them, and nothing at all escapes them.​
Ezekiel 36:
33 ‘This is what the Lord God says: “On the day that I cleanse you from all your wrongdoings, I will populate the cities, and the places of ruins will be rebuilt.​
34 The desolated land will be cultivated instead of being a desolation in the sight of everyone who passes by.​
35 And they will say, ‘This desolated land has become like the Garden of Eden; and the waste, desolated and ruined cities are fortified and inhabited.’​
36 Then the nations around you that are left will know that I, the Lord, have rebuilt the ruined places and planted that which was desolated; I, the Lord, have spoken, and I will do it.”​

Have you factored in the Book of Joel in your study of the Day of the LORD? If not, I suggest that you’re really not in a position to speak with any authority on its timing or purpose! JMO
The day of the Lord is the theme of the prophecy of Joel. It begins at the midway point of the seventieth week of Daniel’s seventy weeks of years prophecy and is precipitated by the revealing of the man of sin of 2 Thess 2 when he breaks his seven year covenant he has with Israel by presenting himself as God in the rebuilt Jewish temple in the holy of Holies. This is the abomination of desolation spoke of by Daniel the prophet. This is called “ the great tribulation” and during it’s course of 3.5 years at least 75% of the earth’s inhabitants will die from the 4 things mentioned in Re. 5.
It is also called the time of Jacob’s trouble when God will purge his people of all her rebels as gold in a refiners fire, his metaphor for this cleansing of his people.
It brings to pass the prophecy of John the Baptist where he says that Israel will be baptized fire.

Matthew 3:7-12
7 But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees come to his baptism, he said unto them, O generation of vipers, who hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come?
8 Bring forth therefore fruits meet for repentance:
9 And think not to say within yourselves, We have Abraham to our father: for I say unto you, that God is able of these stones to raise up children unto Abraham.
10 And now also the axe is laid unto the root of the trees: therefore every tree which bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
11 I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:
12 Whose fan is in his hand, and he will throughly purge his floor, and gather his wheat into the garner; but he will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire.

I have more to say about this but I will give you space for your input.
 

Arkycharlie

Active member
The day of the Lord is the theme of the prophecy of Joel. It begins at the midway point of the seventieth week of Daniel’s seventy weeks of years prophecy and is precipitated by the revealing of the man of sin of 2 Thess 2 when he breaks his seven year covenant he has with Israel by presenting himself as God in the rebuilt Jewish temple in the holy of Holies. This is the abomination of desolation spoke of by Daniel the prophet. This is called “ the great tribulation” and during it’s course of 3.5 years at least 75% of the earth’s inhabitants will die from the 4 things mentioned in Re. 5.
It is also called the time of Jacob’s trouble when God will purge his people of all her rebels as gold in a refiners fire, his metaphor for this cleansing of his people.
It brings to pass the prophecy of John the Baptist where he says that Israel will be baptized fire.

Matthew 3:7-12
7 But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees come to his baptism, he said unto them, O generation of vipers, who hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come?
8 Bring forth therefore fruits meet for repentance:
9 And think not to say within yourselves, We have Abraham to our father: for I say unto you, that God is able of these stones to raise up children unto Abraham.
10 And now also the axe is laid unto the root of the trees: therefore every tree which bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
11 I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:
12 Whose fan is in his hand, and he will throughly purge his floor, and gather his wheat into the garner; but he will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire.

I have more to say about this but I will give you space for your input.
Well, you somehow overlooked the point that I was trying to make, which is that when the Day of the LORD begins, the Land of Israel will be "like the Garden of Eden". Only the LORD can recreate a Garden of Eden in this world as is indicated by Ezekiel 36 which you ignored. That alone is indicative that it occurs at the end of the MK. There is a functioning temple and priesthood which also will not be in place until the MK.

Then there is this verse: "Beat your plowshares into swords and your pruning hooks into spears; Let the weak say, “I am a mighty man.” (Joel 3:10) During the MK, all modern weaponry will be disposed of. Thus the need to make ancient weapons for the invading army. As I have said many times here, The Day of the LORD is postmillennial and is the Gog-Magog invasion of Ezekiel 38-39 and Revelation 20. That's why ancient weapons are listed in Ezekiel 38-39 as well as invaders on horses.

Then we have this passage: "17 Then you will know that I am the Lord your God, dwelling in Zion, My holy mountain. So Jerusalem will be holy, and strangers will pass through it no more. (Joel 3:17". Which leads us to this verse in Ezekiel 39:7: "My holy name I will make known in the midst of My people Israel; and I will not let My holy name be profaned anymore And the nations will know that I am the LORD, the Holy One in Israel. The well known OT phrase "the Holy One OF Israel" is found 22 times in the OT, the vast majority in Isaiah but not once in Ezekiel. And the phrase "the Holy One IN Israel" is found nowhere else in Scripture. The Lord will not be dwelling in Israel until His return to establish the MK.

You also have bought in to the traditional dispensational view of Daniel’s 70 weeks which is, according to the predetermined plan and purpose of the Lord, simply wrong. The first half of the 70th week was fulfilled in our Lord’s 3 ½ year earthly ministry, leaving only the last half to be fulfilled. I wrote an article in 2011 that makes the case for this assertion and have attached it to this post for any who may care to look it over. The ball is now back in your court!
 

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JDS

Well-known member
Well, you somehow overlooked the point that I was trying to make, which is that when the Day of the LORD begins, the Land of Israel will be "like the Garden of Eden". Only the LORD can recreate a Garden of Eden in this world as is indicated by Ezekiel 36 which you ignored. That alone is indicative that it occurs at the end of the MK. There is a functioning temple and priesthood which also will not be in place until the MK.
Actually, the rule of thumb is when you see that one thing is like another you are looking at a metaphor or a similitude. God is merely drawing a stark contrast between what the land of Israel looks like before and after this army he is describing comes through. This is within the Baptism of fire for Israel that is in the context of the day of the Lord as it relates to Israel.
You don’t really think this could happen if Jesus Christ the King were dwelling in Jerusalem, as he will be doing in the days at the end of the MK, do you.
There is a functioning temple built sometimes in the first 3.5 years of the seven year tribulation time and there is a restoration of temple worship, probably guaranteed by the seven year covenant that is broken in the middle of those years when the abomination of desolation spoken of by Daniel the prophet and mentioned by Jesus Christ in Matt 24 as the beginning of the great tribulation takes place.
Then there is this verse: "Beat your plowshares into swords and your pruning hooks into spears; Let the weak say, “I am a mighty man.” (Joel 3:10) During the MK, all modern weaponry will be disposed of. Thus the need to make ancient weapons for the invading army. As I have said many times here, The Day of the LORD is postmillennial and is the Gog-Magog invasion of Ezekiel 38-39 and Revelation 20. That's why ancient weapons are listed in Ezekiel 38-39 as well as invaders on horses.

Here is my take on Joel 2 and 3 at this point in my study.

Joel has "the day of the Lord" for his theme of his prophecy. So, I am going to think that most of his prophecy is going to deal with that day. Here are some verses.

First, chapter 2.
Joel 2:1 Blow ye the trumpet in Zion, and sound an alarm in my holy mountain: let all the inhabitants of the land tremble: for the day of the Lord cometh, for it is nigh at hand;
This means what he is saying is that it has not come yet but he is about to say what it will be like when it does.

Second - chapter 3
Joel 3:1 For, behold, in those days, and in that time, when I shall bring again the captivity of Judah and Jerusalem

This could not be referring to the time after the MK because Israel would have been in her land for 1000 years with Christ in the midst as King and she is not dispersed after the MK.
Many things happens in the day of the Lord judgement which is 3.5 years. Israel is dispersed by the man of sin and God regathers them at the end of this judgement.

This happens at the blowing of the trumpet the second time. Look.
Joel 2:15 Blow the trumpet in Zion, sanctify a fast, call a solemn assembly:
16 Gather the people, sanctify the congregation, assemble the elders, gather the children, and those that suck the breasts: let the bridegroom go forth of his chamber, and the bride out of her closet.

This is the second trump, and the last trump. Here is the first trump.

Joel 2:1 Blow ye the trumpet in Zion, and sound an alarm in my holy mountain: let all the inhabitants of the land (of Israel) tremble: for the day of the Lord cometh, for it is nigh at hand;

The sound of the trumpet is the alarm and Jesus speaks of this event here.

Matt 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days, shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.


Then we have this passage: "17 Then you will know that I am the Lord your God, dwelling in Zion, My holy mountain. So Jerusalem will be holy, and strangers will pass through it no more. (Joel 3:17". Which leads us to this verse in Ezekiel 39:7: "My holy name I will make known in the midst of My people Israel; and I will not let My holy name be profaned anymore And the nations will know that I am the LORD, the Holy One in Israel. The well known OT phrase "the Holy One OF Israel" is found 22 times in the OT, the vast majority in Isaiah but not once in Ezekiel. And the phrase "the Holy One IN Israel" is found nowhere else in Scripture. The Lord will not be dwelling in Israel until His return to establish the MK.
My bible does not have the word "then" shall you know in Joel 3:17. It has "so" shall you know. Words makes a difference.

Let us look at the following words more closely and try to use some reason just from what we are told.

Ezekiel 39:7: "My holy name I will make known in the midst of My people Israel; and I will not let My holy name be profaned anymore And the nations will know that I am the LORD, the Holy One in Israel.

Re 19:11 And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.

12 His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself.
13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.
14 And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.
15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.
16 And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, King Of Kings, And Lord Of Lords.
17 And I saw an angel standing in the sun; and he cried with a loud voice, saying to all the fowls that fly in the midst of heaven, Come and gather yourselves together unto the supper of the great God;
18 That ye may eat the flesh of kings, and the flesh of captains, and the flesh of mighty men, and the flesh of horses, and of them that sit on them, and the flesh of all men, both free and bond, both small and great.
19 And I saw the beast, and the kings of the earth, and their armies, gathered together to make war against him that sat on the horse, and against his army.
20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.
21 And the remnant were slain with the sword of him that sat upon the horse, which sword proceeded out of his mouth: and all the fowls were filled with their flesh.

Israel knew his name for 1000 years.

You also have bought in to the traditional dispensational view of Daniel’s 70 weeks which is, according to the predetermined plan and purpose of the Lord, simply wrong. The first half of the 70th week was fulfilled in our Lord’s 3 ½ year earthly ministry, leaving only the last half to be fulfilled. I wrote an article in 2011 that makes the case for this assertion and have attached it to this post for any who may care to look it over. The ball is now back in your court!

God has determined 7000 years of history in time. This is one week or 7 days of 1000 years days, as God counts time. He says in 2 Peter that one day is as a thousand years and a thousand years as one day. He said in Ps 90 that a thousand years are as but yesterday when it is passed, and as a watch in the night. This relates to the physical type of his creation when he made the world in 6 literal 24 hour days and then rested on the seventh day and sanctified it as the holy day and the Lord's day when no work should be done. He said in John, I believe, chapter 12, that his Father works and he works and God is working in the six days of his thousand year days to redeem man. We are at the end of the sixth day and the sabbath rest is very near. The Jewish days are defined as the evening and the morning. It is dark in the evening and then the light. The seventh day is 1000 years long and is a time of unapparelled peace over the whole world when Jesus reigns. However, he must first rid the world of rebels and during the tribulation time every person alive must make a choice for who they will serve. There are only two choices. Only redeemed people will enter his kingdom but there will be little death and those who are born during the 1000 years must be redeemed by the blood of the Lamb like any one before them. The scriptures shows us there will be many who will not in their hearts serve the Lord and he will deal with them at the end of the week just before eternity when he begins a new week, called the eighth day. Jesus Christ arose on the eighth day, the day after the sabbath, see John 20.

The number 8 is God's number for new things in his scriptures and the beginning of the day after the sabbath, called the day of God, he will have a new heaven and a new earth, a new Jerusalem, where his new creation in Christ will dwell. Behold, he says, I make all things new.

You can give me your thoughts.
 
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JDS

Well-known member
We're talking past each other. For me, that's simply a waste of time.....
Isa 13:1 - Under the heading "the burden of Babylon." Time frame - Day of the Lord.

6 Howl ye; for the day of the Lord is at hand; it shall come as a destruction from the Almighty.

7 Therefore shall all hands be faint, and every man's heart shall melt:

8 And they shall be afraid: pangs and sorrows shall take hold of them; they shall be in pain as a woman that travaileth: they shall be amazed one at another; their faces shall be as flames.

9 Behold, the day of the Lord cometh, cruel both with wrath and fierce anger, to lay the land (of Israel) desolate: and he shall destroy the sinners thereof out of it (the land of Israel).

10 For the stars of heaven and the constellations thereof shall not give their light: the sun shall be darkened in his (the Almighty) going forth, and the moon shall not cause her light to shine.

11 And I will punish the world for their evil, and the wicked for their iniquity; and I will cause the arrogancy of the proud to cease, and will lay low the haughtiness of the terrible.

If the Lord had been ruling from Jerusalem over Israel, the land would not have been loaded up with sinners needing to be destroyed, do you think?

The day of the Lord judgement is describing a time of 3.5 years just before the setting up of his righteous kingdom, after he destroys the rebel off the world. No one, including God, can have a righteous kingdom with rebels in it. They must be eliminated, and this is the plan.
_________________

Take a look at what God has in store for the phyical property of Babylon, the city and region.
________________

Isa 13:19 And Babylon, the glory of kingdoms, the beauty of the Chaldees' excellency, shall be as when God overthrew Sodom and Gomorrah.

20 It shall never be inhabited,
neither shall it be dwelt in from generation to generation:
neither shall the Arabian pitch tent there;
neither shall the shepherds make their fold there.

21 But wild beasts of the desert shall lie there; and
their houses shall be full of doleful creatures; and
owls shall dwell there,
and satyrs shall dance there.

These dirty birds are metaphors for devils in the scriptures. This is a gate of hell, one of two. The other is in Edom. They are completely desolate all through the 1000 year of the MK.

22 And the wild beasts of the islands shall cry in their desolate houses, and dragons in their pleasant palaces: and her time is near to come, and her days shall not be prolonged.

Just for a point of reference: Sodom and Gomorrah has not been inhabited for nearly 4000 years, since God reigned fire and brimstone down on them. See verse 19 above. He put the dead sea on top of those cities and it is still there.
 
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Keraz

Member
Like the dawn, it covers the earth

Joel 1:15 The day is near, the Day of the Lord it comes as a mighty destruction from Almighty God.

Joel 2:1-5 Blow the trumpet in Israel, sound the alarm in Jerusalem. Let all who live in the Land tremble, for the day of the Lord is coming – it is close at hand. A Day of darkness and clouds. Like [at] the dawn, an innumerable host comes across the land, such as never was and will never be again. A fire goes before them, leaving wasteland behind. With a great noise they leap mountains and consume everything to stubble.

Joel 2:6-11 At the sight of them, all the nations are in anguish. They march in line, none swerving against any defense. They rush upon cities and enter houses through the windows. The earth quakes and the sky is darkened. The Lord thunders at the head of His army, beyond number are those who obey His command. The Day of the Lord is great and dreadful, who can endure it?

Joel 1:6-12 & 19-20 this invading host destroys trees and crops. Fire has burnt the pastures and trees. All the streams have dried up.

The Day of the Lord, as described by Joel is not Armageddon, at the Return of Jesus or at the Great White Throne judgement. It is plainly an event before then, also prophesied in Isaiah 2:12-21, Revelation 6:12-17, Ezekiel 7:2-9: + over other 100 times.

Joel uses the metaphor of an army to describe how this destruction moves across the earth as it rotates- ‘with the dawn’. As nations turn to face the sun, the effects of a Coronal Mass Ejection- sunstrike will hit them. Initially, it will strike the earth as a light flash - Isaiah 30:26a, within 8 minutes, then the highly charged cosmic particles arrive about 24 hours later, causing immense destruction and deaths. Fires and volcanic eruptions will result in smoke and ash clouds, covering the sky. Isaiah 29:5-6, Psalms 18:7-15, Jeremiah 4:23-28

Judah [the current State of Israel] is affected- Hosea 8:14, Eze. 20:45-48, Isa 4:3-4, Isaiah 6:11-13

And the Lord’s enemies: Isaiah 22:5-14, Psalms 83:1-18, Isaiah 63:1-6, Jeremiah 12:14, plus many others.

Deuteronomy 32:34-43 says how He will act when His enemies ‘foot will slip”. That is they make a mistake. That mistake will be their instigating an attack against Israel.



Malachi 4:1-3 Surely the day of the Lord is coming, it will burn like a furnace. All the evildoers will be as stubble, they will be burned up. They will be ashes under your feet. But for you, who revere My Name, righteousness will rise with healing in its wings. You will rejoice and prevail over the wicked on the Day that I act against them.

THEN the many prophecies that describe the migration of all true believers into the Promised Land will come to pass. This great exodus of His faithful Christian people will fulfil the promises that God made to the Patriarchs and they will, at last be a people that will be a ‘light to the nations’. They will prepare themselves and the world for the Return of Jesus. Ezekiel 35:11-30, Ezekiel 36:8-12, Deuteronomy 30:1-10, Zechariah 10:6-12, Isaiah 46:27-28, Ezekiel 39:25-29, Zephaniah 10:6-12

That Jesus is not yet present at this time, is clear from the many verses saying: ‘You will know that I am the Lord, when... And how it ‘will be as in the days of Egypt’.

Eze. 14:6-11, Eze 39:22, Joel 2:27, Isa 41:20. Reference: REB, NIV. Some verses abridged
 

101G

Well-known member
2) The two comings of Jesus Christ - once to suffer and once to rule
Addressing the OP. not saying that you're right or wrong, but consider this.
Three coming.... two in "Apperance", one in "Manifestation", which is identified as a "TWO FOLD RETURN".

PICJAG,
101G.
 

Kade Rystalmane

Well-known member
Peter said Joel was talking about that time at Pentecost, not some yet future time (Acts 2:16). Everything Joel was talking about came to pass by the end of the first century with the fall of the Jewish state and the establishment of the church of Christ.
 

JDS

Well-known member
Peter said Joel was talking about that time at Pentecost, not some yet future time (Acts 2:16). Everything Joel was talking about came to pass by the end of the first century with the fall of the Jewish state and the establishment of the church of Christ
So okay, the prophetic feasts of Israel, of which the feast of weeks, Pentecost, is the forth one, and the second festival, is literally fulfilled with the sending of the Holy Ghost to immerse Israel and to regenerate them through faith in the risen Lord Jesus Christ, when was the final three feasts of Israel fulfilled? That would be the feast of trumpets, the feast of day of atonement, the feast of tabernacles, the fall festival?

To believe and teach that every prophecy of Joel was fulfilled because Peter quoted a couple of verses from his book is to bury ones head deep in the sand. That was in AD 30 when he quoted Joel in the context of the "day of the Lord." Yet, he wrote his 2nd letter to the strangers scattered abroad in or around AD 67, and he said this.

2 Peter 3:10
But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night;

Here is what Peter said in AD 30 in Jerusalem.

Acts 2:15 For these are not drunken, as ye suppose, seeing it is but the third hour of the day.
16 But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel;
17 And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:
18 And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy:
19 And I will shew wonders in heaven above, and signs in the earth beneath; blood, and fire, and vapour of smoke:
20 The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and notable day of the Lord come:
21 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved.

The question is, did it turn out that way? Did he pour out his Spirit on all flesh "in those days?"

I know the day of the Lord has not come yet. How do I know? Several ways. First, Peter was still saying it is coming 37 years after he preached on Pentecost. and quoted Joel. Second, those signs in heaven above and the earth beneath have not been manifest yet. The prophecy does not say how long before the day of the Lord, it just says before the day of the Lord the Lord will shew them. Third, God is still saving those who will call upon him.

So far "those days" have been over 2000 years, which makes the total of world history 6000 years. God, in his counting system says a thousand years is as a day and a day is as a thousand years. The seventh day is the sabbath rest. This is the day of the Lord. One thousand years in which Jesus Christ will reign on earth in perfect righteousness and total goodness. However, we read these things in a Jewish bible that follows customs of the people of Israel. The evening and the morning is a day. This means the day of the Lord begins in the dark and gives way to light. All of the 30 references in the scriptures of the Day of the Lord says it begins as a day of intense darkness and judgement during which all rebels on the earth will be eliminated through several methods and divine judgements.

Believe the words.
 

Kade Rystalmane

Well-known member
So okay, the prophetic feasts of Israel, of which the feast of weeks, Pentecost, is the forth one, and the second festival, is literally fulfilled with the sending of the Holy Ghost to immerse Israel and to regenerate them through faith in the risen Lord Jesus Christ, when was the final three feasts of Israel fulfilled? That would be the feast of trumpets, the feast of day of atonement, the feast of tabernacles, the fall festival?
These were fulfilled a few decades later with the trumpets heralding the end of Judaism as the Zealots took over and rebelled against Rome and Rome marched against Israel. The day of atonement was a solemn day rather than a celebration when all the sins of the nation were remembered and they would be "afflicted" (Lev. 23:27-32). Those that were not afflicted - the word there means to humble, to bow low - would be cut off. When the Jews did not submit to the will of God in sorrow for their sins, in repentance of their murders (Matt. 23, the murder of Christ, the murder of the Christians afterwards), they were cut off. This was the destruction of the temple and the end of Judaism. The feast of tabernacles was a remembrance of God's deliverance of Israel from the slavery and oppression of Egypt, a celebration of freedom and God's Providence. It is fulfilled in the church being delivered from spiritual Egypt, the oppressors that were the Jews (Rev. 11:8). The new Temple, having been built (the church established), with Jesus as the light and providing living water (the gospel) - see John 7:37-38 and 8:12, God had delivered the The New Israel, spiritual Jerusalem, the church from evil and provided for them all that they need.

All of this was fulfilled by the end of the first century.
To believe and teach that every prophecy of Joel was fulfilled because Peter quoted a couple of verses from his book is to bury ones head deep in the sand.
This kind of language is unnecessary and accomplishes nothing. My head is not buried in the sand. Peter provides context and chronological association with Joel's prophecies, a key to help us understand. We cannot dismiss that out of hand because it doesn't match up with what we have been taught by uninspired men from the pulpit.
That was in AD 30 when he quoted Joel in the context of the "day of the Lord." Yet, he wrote his 2nd letter to the strangers scattered abroad in or around AD 67, and he said this.

2 Peter 3:10
But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night;
Yes, and He did come and destroyed the Jewish state for their wickedness. 66-74AD.
Here is what Peter said in AD 30 in Jerusalem.

Acts 2:15 For these are not drunken, as ye suppose, seeing it is but the third hour of the day.
16 But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel;
17 And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:
18 And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy:
19 And I will shew wonders in heaven above, and signs in the earth beneath; blood, and fire, and vapour of smoke:
20 The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and notable day of the Lord come:
21 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved.

The question is, did it turn out that way? Did he pour out his Spirit on all flesh "in those days?"
Yes. Both Jews and Gentiles received the Holy Spirit. Acts 2 is when the Jews received Him and Acts 10 is when the Gentiles received the Holy Spirit. So all flesh, both Jew and non-Jew, had the Spirit poured out on them.
I know the day of the Lord has not come yet. How do I know? Several ways. First, Peter was still saying it is coming 37 years after he preached on Pentecost. and quoted Joel.
He came right after that. The Jews were rebelling, wholly in the dark about the timing because they were high on their genetic heritage. Paul exclaimed that the day would not overtake the Christians that way because they were not ignorant, not in darkness, as to the timing (1 Thess. 5).

Second, those signs in heaven above and the earth beneath have not been manifest yet. The prophecy does not say how long before the day of the Lord, it just says before the day of the Lord the Lord will shew them.
Yes, they have. Every one of them. If you believe they were to have manifested in a literal, astronomical sense then you need to go back and understand the Old Testament a lot better. The sun and moon and stars refer to leaders of nations, the king, the high priest, the princes and leaders of the Jewish state. Start with Joseph's dream and work your way forward.
Third, God is still saving those who will call upon him.
Of course He is. There is nothing in the prophecy that says that saving souls will not continue after the events of the prophecy were fulfilled. In fact, if you read Revelation properly, that's exactly what John said would happen.

And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof.

24 And the nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honour into it.
25 And the gates of it shall not be shut at all by day: for there shall be no night there.
26 And they shall bring the glory and honour of the nations into it.
27 And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither whatsoever worketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life.
The city here is the New Jerusalem, the bride of Christ, the church. After the defeat of the Jewish State, there was nothing getting in the way of the expansion of the church. The nations were flowing into it here (can't happen after time ends) as people continued to convert to the cause of Christ after He had returned and conquered the Enemy persecuting His bride.
So far "those days" have been over 2000 years, which makes the total of world history 6000 years. God, in his counting system says a thousand years is as a day and a day is as a thousand years. The seventh day is the sabbath rest. This is the day of the Lord. One thousand years in which Jesus Christ will reign on earth in perfect righteousness and total goodness. However, we read these things in a Jewish bible that follows customs of the people of Israel. The evening and the morning is a day. This means the day of the Lord begins in the dark and gives way to light. All of the 30 references in the scriptures of the Day of the Lord says it begins as a day of intense darkness and judgement during which all rebels on the earth will be eliminated through several methods and divine judgements.

Believe the words.
If you take 2 Peter 3:8 as a mathematical equation so that every time you read day you equate it to 1000 years and every time you see 1000 years you equate it to 24 hours, then your millennial reign of Christ isn't going to be very long. I'd estimate approximately 24 hours or so.

2 Peter 3:8 isn't a mathematical statement or key. It's an expression that God is eternal, outside of time, and is not subject to it. His perception is superior to ours and fulfills His promises when it is appropriate to do so. It does not mean anything more than that.

In Truth and Love.
 

JDS

Well-known member
These were fulfilled a few decades later with the trumpets heralding the end of Judaism as the Zealots took over and rebelled against Rome and Rome marched against Israel. The day of atonement was a solemn day rather than a celebration when all the sins of the nation were remembered and they would be "afflicted" (Lev. 23:27-32). Those that were not afflicted - the word there means to humble, to bow low - would be cut off. When the Jews did not submit to the will of God in sorrow for their sins, in repentance of their murders (Matt. 23, the murder of Christ, the murder of the Christians afterwards), they were cut off. This was the destruction of the temple and the end of Judaism. The feast of tabernacles was a remembrance of God's deliverance of Israel from the slavery and oppression of Egypt, a celebration of freedom and God's Providence. It is fulfilled in the church being delivered from spiritual Egypt, the oppressors that were the Jews (Rev. 11:8). The new Temple, having been built (the church established), with Jesus as the light and providing living water (the gospel) - see John 7:37-38 and 8:12, God had delivered the The New Israel, spiritual Jerusalem, the church from evil and provided for them all that they need.

All of this was fulfilled by the end of the first century.

This kind of language is unnecessary and accomplishes nothing. My head is not buried in the sand. Peter provides context and chronological association with Joel's prophecies, a key to help us understand. We cannot dismiss that out of hand because it doesn't match up with what we have been taught by uninspired men from the pulpit.

Yes, and He did come and destroyed the Jewish state for their wickedness. 66-74AD.

Yes. Both Jews and Gentiles received the Holy Spirit. Acts 2 is when the Jews received Him and Acts 10 is when the Gentiles received the Holy Spirit. So all flesh, both Jew and non-Jew, had the Spirit poured out on them.

He came right after that. The Jews were rebelling, wholly in the dark about the timing because they were high on their genetic heritage. Paul exclaimed that the day would not overtake the Christians that way because they were not ignorant, not in darkness, as to the timing (1 Thess. 5).


Yes, they have. Every one of them. If you believe they were to have manifested in a literal, astronomical sense then you need to go back and understand the Old Testament a lot better. The sun and moon and stars refer to leaders of nations, the king, the high priest, the princes and leaders of the Jewish state. Start with Joseph's dream and work your way forward.

Of course He is. There is nothing in the prophecy that says that saving souls will not continue after the events of the prophecy were fulfilled. In fact, if you read Revelation properly, that's exactly what John said would happen.

And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof.

24 And the nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honour into it.
25 And the gates of it shall not be shut at all by day: for there shall be no night there.
26 And they shall bring the glory and honour of the nations into it.
27 And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither whatsoever worketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life.
The city here is the New Jerusalem, the bride of Christ, the church. After the defeat of the Jewish State, there was nothing getting in the way of the expansion of the church. The nations were flowing into it here (can't happen after time ends) as people continued to convert to the cause of Christ after He had returned and conquered the Enemy persecuting His bride.

If you take 2 Peter 3:8 as a mathematical equation so that every time you read day you equate it to 1000 years and every time you see 1000 years you equate it to 24 hours, then your millennial reign of Christ isn't going to be very long. I'd estimate approximately 24 hours or so.

2 Peter 3:8 isn't a mathematical statement or key. It's an expression that God is eternal, outside of time, and is not subject to it. His perception is superior to ours and fulfills His promises when it is appropriate to do so. It does not mean anything more than that.

In Truth and Love.
The day of the Lord is a prophetic theme that runs through the prophetic books of the scriptures. The phrase "day of the Lord" is in 15 books of scripture by 12 different prophets and it is always, in every one, a future event. The first book chronologically it is in is Isaiah and the last book is second Peter. It is in those books 30 times in 29 verses. John, the revelator, used a similar phrase as a present tense description in John chapter 1. He said he was on the Isle of Patmos on the Lord's day.

Now, what we know about the revelation is what we are specifically told by John as he wrote down what God said to "write." Here is what we are told as the revelation opens in the beginning. The Revelation was not written until AD 94, the last book to be written.

Re 1:1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:

4 John to the seven churches which are in Asia:

He wrote specifically to these 7 churches and the letters were delivered to them.
Following are two statements that must be considered literally.

7 Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.

This has not happened yet. It is the Revelation.

8 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.

He is the beginning and ending of the church at his resurrection from the dead, the context when you are writing to the churches.

Col 1:18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
Acts 11:15 And as I began to speak, the Holy Ghost fell on them, as on us at the beginning.
16 Then remembered I the word of the Lord, how that he said, John indeed baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost.
The ending - Rom 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
26 And so all Israel (as opposed to a remnant) shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.

It is important to understand that two strains of prophecy goes on in the NT. The Israel and the church. They are different. They are not the same. The church goes up to heaven in Re 4:1 and is not mentioned again until after the revelation of Jesus Christ to the world when every eye shall see him.

I put this information out because we must understand that the day of the Lord begins in this epistle and these things are future.

So, my efforts in discussing the day of the Lord is to look at the 29 passages one by one and see what is said about it by the Lord himself, and to whom he says it. If every prophet writes as if it is future, then I want to know the time frame of when it comes. Right now I have a definite time frame of AD 67 when Peter wrote his second epistle.

I do want to address this statement briefly.

If you take 2 Peter 3:8 as a mathematical equation so that every time you read day you equate it to 1000 years and every time you see 1000 years you equate it to 24 hours, then your millennial reign of Christ isn't going to be very long. I'd estimate approximately 24 hours or so.

This is exactly the point. Peter says by the word of the Lord that one day is with the Lord “as” a thousand years. He did not say it was a thousand years. He did not say it was a thousand years to men. He is giving us a formula in order for us to understand how he thinks. He always explains his symbolism and we must recognize it when he does. His words, he says, in John 6 are spiritual.

So, the creation week of 7 literal days are seven 24 hour days as man sees time and seven one thousand year days as God sees it. The seventh day for both man and God is a sabbath rest when the work is done.

There are multiplied many passages in scripture where this principle can be demonstrated but I offer one, Mark nine where Jesus promises to show the kingdom to his three inner circle disciple.and so after six days he takes them up on a high mountain and is transfigured before them with two OT saints, Moses and Elijah. After six days is the sabbath or the seventh day for men and he establishes his kingdom on earth for a thousand years after six of his thousand year days.There is no conflict.

I am ready to discuss the day of the Lord.
 

Keraz

Member
The Lords Day of Vengeance and The Great Day of the Sovereign Lord:

2 Thessalonians 1:7-10 ... when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven with His mighty angels in blazing fire. Then he will mete out punishment to those who refuse to acknowledge God and who will not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus. They will suffer the penalty of eternal destruction, cut off from the presence of God. When, on that great Day He comes to reveal His glory amongst His own and His majesty to all believers.

Do not confuse this passage with the Return of Jesus in His glory. He does NOT come in fire then, or punish all the ungodly. This time, at the Sixth Seal event, He reveals Himself only to those who believe in Him and keep His Laws. Isaiah 24:23, Zechariah 9:14-17

1/ The Day of Vengeance and the wrath of God;

Psalms 11:4-6 The Lord is in heaven,….. He will rain fiery coals onto the wicked….

Isaiah 66:15-16 See, the Lord is coming in fire, His sword will test mankind.

Micah 5:15 In anger and fury, I shall wreak vengeance on the nations who disobey Me.

Habakkuk 3:12 Furiously; You trample down the nations.

Malachi 4:1 The Day comes; burning like a furnace, evildoers will be as stubble.

Hebrews 10:27...a terrifying judgement of fire that will consume God’s enemies.

Isaiah 30:26 On the day that the Lord saves His people,[born again Christians] the sun will shine with seven times its usual strength and the moon will be as bright as the sun.

Revelation 14:17-20 ..the angel with authority over fire....the winepress of God’s wrath…

So, we see that the first event is the Lord sending fire by the means of an earth directed explosion of the suns surface, literally causing all the graphic effects prophesied.



2/ The Great Day of the Sovereign Lord; the Return of the Lord Jesus; Rev 16:14b

Matthew 24:29-31 As soon as this time of distress has passed [the Tribulation] the sun will be darkened and the moon will not give light, the stars will fall and all the heavenly bodies will be shaken. Then ALL the peoples will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven, with power and great glory. With a trumpet blast He will send His angels to gather His chosen from the farthest corners of the world. These will be all the people who have kept faithful to the Lord during the Tribulation as all the Christians will be living in the Land soon after the Day of vengeance. Rev 12:6-17

Revelation 19:11-21....Jesus Returns and the destroys Satan’s armies, by the Sword of His Word and Satan is bound until the end of the 1000 years. Zechariah 14:3-5



There will be four judgement/punishments, the first to happen soon, the Lord’s Day of vengeance and wrath, a worldwide judgement of fire, earthquakes, storms and tsunamis against the nations, that will particularly affect the Middle East. Zephaniah 1:14-18, Ezekiel 30:1-5 This will enable His people, every faithful Christian person, Jew or Gentile, to resettle the Land. Ezekiel 34:11-16

Then, later comes the Gog/Magog attack and their destruction. Ezekiel 38 & 39

At the Return of Jesus, He destroys the armies of the Anti Christ. Revelation 19:17-21 Then, at the end of the Millennium, there is another attack by a huge army, then comes the Great White Throne judgement of all people alive and dead.

Note: that in Rev 19:13 Jesus Returns in a garment dyed in blood. In Isaiah 63:3 He tramples the nations....and their blood spattered all his clothing. From this and the sequence in 2 Thessalonians, we can say that the Day of the Lord’s wrath- the Sixth Seal, Revelation 6:12-17 will be the next prophesied event of the end times.

Reference REB, NIV, KJV. Some verses abridged
 

Kade Rystalmane

Well-known member
The day of the Lord is a prophetic theme that runs through the prophetic books of the scriptures. The phrase "day of the Lord" is in 15 books of scripture by 12 different prophets and it is always, in every one, a future event. The first book chronologically it is in is Isaiah and the last book is second Peter. It is in those books 30 times in 29 verses. John, the revelator, used a similar phrase as a present tense description in John chapter 1. He said he was on the Isle of Patmos on the Lord's day.
Agreed.
Now, what we know about the revelation is what we are specifically told by John as he wrote down what God said to "write." Here is what we are told as the revelation opens in the beginning. The Revelation was not written until AD 94, the last book to be written.
Why do you believe that it was written in 94 AD?
Re 1:1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:

4 John to the seven churches which are in Asia:

He wrote specifically to these 7 churches and the letters were delivered to them.
Following are two statements that must be considered literally.

7 Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.

This has not happened yet. It is the Revelation.
John is building on the words of the Old Testament, especially the apocalyptic texts. What do clouds and earth mean in those contexts?

Also, what do the phrases "quickly", "shortly come to pass", and "time is at hand" mean?
8 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.

He is the beginning and ending of the church at his resurrection from the dead, the context when you are writing to the churches.

Col 1:18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
Acts 11:15 And as I began to speak, the Holy Ghost fell on them, as on us at the beginning.
16 Then remembered I the word of the Lord, how that he said, John indeed baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost.
The ending - Rom 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
26 And so all Israel (as opposed to a remnant) shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.

It is important to understand that two strains of prophecy goes on in the NT. The Israel and the church. They are different. They are not the same. The church goes up to heaven in Re 4:1 and is not mentioned again until after the revelation of Jesus Christ to the world when every eye shall see him.
Why do you believe that it is the church in Revelation 4:1 that is called up to Heaven and not John?

1 After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter.
2 And immediately I was in the spirit: and, behold, a throne was set in heaven, and one sat on the throne.

I put this information out because we must understand that the day of the Lord begins in this epistle and these things are future.
These things were future when John wrote the book of Revelation, so it is important to solidify when that letter was written. That's why I asked why you believe it was written in 94 AD.
So, my efforts in discussing the day of the Lord is to look at the 29 passages one by one and see what is said about it by the Lord himself, and to whom he says it. If every prophet writes as if it is future, then I want to know the time frame of when it comes. Right now I have a definite time frame of AD 67 when Peter wrote his second epistle.
Why do you believe that 2 Peter is 67 AD?
I do want to address this statement briefly.



This is exactly the point. Peter says by the word of the Lord that one day is with the Lord “as” a thousand years. He did not say it was a thousand years. He did not say it was a thousand years to men. He is giving us a formula in order for us to understand how he thinks. He always explains his symbolism and we must recognize it when he does. His words, he says, in John 6 are spiritual.

So, the creation week of 7 literal days are seven 24 hour days as man sees time and seven one thousand year days as God sees it. The seventh day for both man and God is a sabbath rest when the work is done.

There are multiplied many passages in scripture where this principle can be demonstrated but I offer one, Mark nine where Jesus promises to show the kingdom to his three inner circle disciple.and so after six days he takes them up on a high mountain and is transfigured before them with two OT saints, Moses and Elijah. After six days is the sabbath or the seventh day for men and he establishes his kingdom on earth for a thousand years after six of his thousand year days.There is no conflict.
I do not see this as a necessary, or even reasonable conclusion. What I mean by that is that there is nothing in the text of the scriptures, old or new testament, that requires this as an interpretation. God is not bound by time. There is no limitation to God in some kind of super-time where God sees things only for a thousand years for every day that we see. He isn't existing in some kind of higher time or heavenly time. He is eternal, completely above and outside of time and not subject to it. All of the bold underlined parts above are not necessary conclusions from any text in scripture.

2 Peter 3 is sufficient to understand what Peter means in verse 8.

7 But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.
8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.
9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

The Lord is not slack concerning His promises. The Christians were crying out how long, how long in reference to the persecution they were suffering at the hands of the Jews. God tells them "not yet, I will do things at the appropriate time, there are still more I will gather to me first". He is longsuffering that is, He is willing to be patient until all who would come to repentance would do so before that judgment came. What then is that judgment against? The current heavens and earth. What are the current heavens and earth that Peter speaks of? Read Isaiah 1:2, 10...it's the Jewish State (rulers) and the Jewish people.
I am ready to discuss the day of the Lord.
I look forward to hearing why you think Revelation was written in 94 AD.

In Truth and Love.
 

Timtofly

Member
If you take 2 Peter 3:8 as a mathematical equation so that every time you read day you equate it to 1000 years and every time you see 1000 years you equate it to 24 hours, then your millennial reign of Christ isn't going to be very long. I'd estimate approximately 24 hours or so.
No one is equating 24 hours to 1000 years, and 1000 years to 24 hrs., except the skeptics who use that as a strawman argument. The Day of the Lord is compared to 1000 years, and the Day of the Lord is not a 24 hr. Day. It is eternal in God's view. It would be like saying when in eternity, it would only seem like 24 hours. To God, yes 1000 years are as nothing, not even 24 hrs. To us 1000 years will still seem like 1000 years. Until the end, then in hindsight, it will seem like yesterday.
 

Timtofly

Member
And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof.

24 And the nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honour into it.
25 And the gates of it shall not be shut at all by day: for there shall be no night there.
26 And they shall bring the glory and honour of the nations into it.
27 And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither whatsoever worketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life.


The city here is the New Jerusalem, the bride of Christ, the church. After the defeat of the Jewish State, there was nothing getting in the way of the expansion of the church. The nations were flowing into it here (can't happen after time ends) as people continued to convert to the cause of Christ after He had returned and conquered the Enemy persecuting His bride.

So we live in an eternal metaphor? We do not live in reality?
 

Kade Rystalmane

Well-known member
And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof.

24 And the nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honour into it.
25 And the gates of it shall not be shut at all by day: for there shall be no night there.
26 And they shall bring the glory and honour of the nations into it.
27 And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither whatsoever worketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life.


The city here is the New Jerusalem, the bride of Christ, the church. After the defeat of the Jewish State, there was nothing getting in the way of the expansion of the church. The nations were flowing into it here (can't happen after time ends) as people continued to convert to the cause of Christ after He had returned and conquered the Enemy persecuting His bride.

So we live in an eternal metaphor? We do not live in reality?
No. That's not how metaphors work.
 
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