The deep connection between the RCC and Calvinism

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Is Calvinism Really a Protestant Belief?

That many prominent evangelicals today are still under the spell of Augustine is evident—and astonishing, considering his numerous heresies. Norm Geisler has said, “St. Augustine was one of the greatest Christian thinkers of all time.”32 Yet Augustine said, “I should not believe the gospel unless I were moved to do so by the authority of the [Catholic ] Church.”33 That statement was quoted with great satisfaction by Pope John Paul II in his 1986 celebration of the 1600th anniversary of Augustine’s conversion. The Pope went on to say:

Augustine’s legacy...is the theological methods to which he remained absolutely faithful...full adherence to the authority of the faith...revealed through Scripture, Tradition and the Church.... Likewise the profound sense of mystery—“for it is better,” he exclaims, “to have a faithful ignorance than a presumptuous knowledge....” I express once again my fervent desire...that the authoritative teaching of such a great doctor and pastor may flourish ever more happily in the Church....34

In my debate with him, James White claims that “Calvin refuted this very passage in Institutes, and any fair reading of Augustine’s own writings disproves this misrepresentation by Hunt.”35 In fact, Calvin acknowledged the authenticity of the statement and attempted to defend it as legitimate reasoning for those who had not the assurance of faith by the Holy Spirit.36

Vance provides numerous astonishing quotations from Calvinists praising Augustine: “One of the greatest theological and philosophical minds that God has ever so seen fit to give to His church.”37 “The greatest Christian since New Testament times...greatest man that ever wrote Latin.”38 “[His] labors and writings, more than those of any other man in the age in which he lived, contributed to the promotion of sound doctrine and the revival of true religion.”39

Warfield adds, “Augustine determined for all time the doctrine of grace.”40 Yet he [Augustine] believed that grace came through the Roman Catholic sacraments. That Calvinists shower such praise upon Augustine makes it easier to comprehend why they heap the same praise on Calvin.

As for the formation of Roman Catholicism’s doctrines and practices, Augustine’s influence was the greatest in history. Vance reminds us that Augustine was “one of Catholicism’s original four ‘Doctors of the Church’ [with] a feast day [dedicated to him] in the Catholic Church on August 28, the day of his death.”41 Pope John Paul II has called Augustine “the common father of our Christian civilization.”42 William P. Grady, on the other hand, writes, “The deluded Augustine (354–430) went so far as to announce (through his book, The City of God?) that Rome had been privileged to usher in the millennial kingdom (otherwise known as the ‘Dark Ages’).”43 https://www.thebereancall.org/content/july-2012-classic

hope this helps !!!
 
continued :

There is no question as to the important role Augustine played in molding Calvin’s thinking, theology, and actions. This is particularly true concerning the key foundations of Calvinism. Warfield refers to Calvin and Augustine as “two extraordinarily gifted men [who] tower like pyramids over the scene of history.”19 Calvin’s Institutes of the Christian Religion make repeated favorable references to Augustine, frequently citing his writings as authoritative and using the expression, “Confirmed by the authority of Augustine.”20 Calvin often credits Augustine with having formulated key concepts, which he then expounds in his Institutes. The following are but a very small sampling of such references:

• “We have come into the way of faith,” says Augustine: “Let us constantly adhere to it....”21

• The truth of God is too powerful, both here and everywhere, to dread the slanders of the ungodly, as Augustine powerfully maintains.... Augustine disguises not that...he was often charged with preaching the doctrine of predestination too freely, but...he abundantly refutes the charge.... For it has been shrewdly observed by Augustine (De Genesi ad litteram, Lib V) that we can safely follow Scripture....22

• For Augustine, rightly expounding this passage, says....23

• I say with Augustine, that the Lord has created those who, as he certainly foreknew, were to go to destruction, and he did so because he so willed.24

• If your mind is troubled, decline not to embrace the counsel of Augustine....25

• I will not hesitate, therefore, simply to confess with Augustine that...those things will certainly happen which he [God] has foreseen [and] that the destruction [of the non-elect] consequent upon predestination is also most just.26

• Augustine, in two passages in particular, gives a [favorable] portraiture of the form of ancient monasticism. [Calvin then proceeds to quote Augustine’s commendation of the early monks.]27

• Here the words of Augustine most admirably apply....28

• This is a faithful saying from Augustine; but because his words will perhaps have more authority than mine, let us adduce the following passage from his treatise....29

• Wherefore, Augustine not undeservedly orders such, as senseless teachers or sinister and ill-omened prophets, to retire from the Church.30

We could multiply many times over the above examples of Augustine’s influence upon Calvin from the scores of times Calvin quotes extensively from Augustine’s writings. Leading Calvinists admit that Calvin’s basic beliefs were already formed while he was still a devout Roman Catholic, through the writings of Augustine—an influence that remained with him throughout his life.

Augustinian teachings that Calvin presented in his Institutes included the sovereignty that made God the cause of all (including sin), the predestination of some to salvation and of others to damnation, election and reprobation, faith as an irresistible gift from God—in fact, the key concepts at the heart of Calvinism.

We search in vain for evidence that Calvin ever disapproved of any of Augustine’s heresies. Calvinist Richard A. Muller admits, “John Calvin was part of a long line of thinkers who based their doctrine of predestination on the Augustinian interpretation of St. Paul.”31 In each expanded edition of his Institutes, Calvin quotes and relies upon Augustine more than ever.
 
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Augustine, on the other hand, saw the church of his day as a mixture of believers and unbelievers, in which purity and evil should be allowed to exist side by side for the sake of unity. He used the power of the state to compel church attendance (as Calvin also would 1,200 years later): “Whoever was not found within the Church was not asked the reason, but was to be corrected and converted....”13 Calvin followed his mentor Augustine in enforcing church attendance and participation in the sacraments by threats (and worse) against the citizens of Geneva. Augustine “identified the Donatists as heretics...who could be subjected to imperial legislation [and force] in exactly the same way as other criminals and misbelievers, including poisoners and pagans.”14 Frend says of Augustine, “The questing, sensitive youth had become the father of the inquisition.”15

Though he preferred persuasion if possible, Augustine supported military force against those who were rebaptized as believers after conversion to Christ and for other alleged heretics. In his controversy with the Donatists, using a distorted and un-Christian interpretation of Luke:14:23
,16 Augustine declared:

Why therefore should not the Church use force in compelling her lost sons to return?... The Lord Himself said, “Go out into the highways and hedges and compel them to come in....” Wherefore is the power which the Church has received...through the religious character and faith of kings...the instrument by which those who are found in the highways and hedges—that is, in heresies and schisms—are compelled to come in, and let them not find fault with being compelled.17

Sadly, Calvin put into effect in Geneva the very principles of punishment, coercion, and death that Augustine advocated and that the Roman Catholic Church followed consistently for centuries. Henry H. Milman writes: “Augustinianism was worked up into a still more rigid and uncompromising system by the severe intellect of Calvin.”18 And he justified himself by Augustine’s erroneous interpretation of Luke:14:23
. How could any who today hail Calvin as a great exegete accept such abuse of this passage?

Compel? Isn’t that God’s job through Unconditional Election and Irresistible Grace? Compel those for whom Christ didn’t die and whom God has predestined to eternal torment? This verse refutes Calvinism no matter how it is intepreted!

hope this helps !!!
 
Chalcedon said:
Is Calvinism Really a Protestant Belief?

That many prominent evangelicals today are still under the spell of Augustine is evident—and astonishing, considering his numerous heresies. Norm Geisler has said, “St. Augustine was one of the greatest Christian thinkers of all time.”32 Yet Augustine said, “I should not believe the gospel unless I were moved to do so by the authority of the [Catholic ] Church.”33 That statement was quoted with great satisfaction by Pope John Paul II in his 1986 celebration of the 1600th anniversary of Augustine’s conversion. The Pope went on to say:

Augustine’s legacy...is the theological methods to which he remained absolutely faithful...full adherence to the authority of the faith...revealed through Scripture, Tradition and the Church.... Likewise the profound sense of mystery—“for it is better,” he exclaims, “to have a faithful ignorance than a presumptuous knowledge....” I express once again my fervent desire...that the authoritative teaching of such a great doctor and pastor may flourish ever more happily in the Church....34

In my debate with him, James White claims that “Calvin refuted this very passage in Institutes, and any fair reading of Augustine’s own writings disproves this misrepresentation by Hunt.”35 In fact, Calvin acknowledged the authenticity of the statement and attempted to defend it as legitimate reasoning for those who had not the assurance of faith by the Holy Spirit.36

Vance provides numerous astonishing quotations from Calvinists praising Augustine: “One of the greatest theological and philosophical minds that God has ever so seen fit to give to His church.”37 “The greatest Christian since New Testament times...greatest man that ever wrote Latin.”38 “[His] labors and writings, more than those of any other man in the age in which he lived, contributed to the promotion of sound doctrine and the revival of true religion.”39

Warfield adds, “Augustine determined for all time the doctrine of grace.”40 Yet he [Augustine] believed that grace came through the Roman Catholic sacraments. That Calvinists shower such praise upon Augustine makes it easier to comprehend why they heap the same praise on Calvin.

As for the formation of Roman Catholicism’s doctrines and practices, Augustine’s influence was the greatest in history. Vance reminds us that Augustine was “one of Catholicism’s original four ‘Doctors of the Church’ [with] a feast day [dedicated to him] in the Catholic Church on August 28, the day of his death.”41 Pope John Paul II has called Augustine “the common father of our Christian civilization.”42 William P. Grady, on the other hand, writes, “The deluded Augustine (354–430) went so far as to announce (through his book, The City of God?) that Rome had been privileged to usher in the millennial kingdom (otherwise known as the ‘Dark Ages’).”43 https://www.thebereancall.org/content/july-2012-classic

hope this helps !!!
Click to expand...
To assert a connection between Rome and Calvin reveals a gross misunderstanding of everything theological and historical, and among all the laughable and kooky things asserted by @Chalcedon in recent months, that is the most laughable and kooky ... ?
 
Howie said:
To assert a connection between Rome and Calvin reveals a gross misunderstanding of everything theological and historical, and among all the laughable and kooky things asserted by @Chalcedon in recent months, that is the most laughable and kooky ... ?
Click to expand...
the Apple ? doesn't fall far from the Tree ?

Hilarious to deny the Reformation came from practicing Catholics.

Revisionism lol .........

oops
 
Chalcedon said:
the Apple ? doesn't fall far from the Tree ?

Hilarious to deny the Reformation came from practicing Catholics.

Revisionism lol .........

oops
Click to expand...
You shouldn't use words you don't understand; you are the revisionist.

The writings of the Council of Trnet concerned many things, one of which was the condemnation of Protestantism as heresy.

That is historical fact, my revisionist fellow. ?
 
Howie said:
You shouldn't use words you don't understand; you are the revisionist.

The writings of the Council of Trnet concerned many things, one of which wad the condemnation of the Protestant as heresy.

That is historical fact, my revisionist fellow. ?
Click to expand...
Civic is on his way back to Rome. I wonder if he now embraces baptismal regeneration?
 
The OP has stumped them on their way to ad hom land- the land of make belief faith. a land where you are not required to defend your beliefs, just conflate, divert, equivocate, project, etc...

hope this helps !!!
 
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