The difference between Judas and Peter

christ_undivided

Well-known member

Now let’s look at these branches and just consider what this is saying. The vine is flourishing, growing luxuriantly, but some serious steps are taken by the vinedresser, the farmer. First of all, when He sees a branch that has no fruit, He takes it away, He takes it away. Down in verse 6, He throws it away, it dries up. Those branches are gathered, cast into the fire, and burned. That is drastic judgment by God on false believers, false believers. No fruit.
You say, “Does every Christian have fruit?” Yes, every Christian has fruit. That’s how you know you’re a Christian. What is fruit? Righteous attitudes, righteous longings, righteous desires, righteous affections, righteous virtues, righteous behaviors. That is the manifestation of life; and where the life of God exists, the fruit must be there.


I quoted MacArthur above to summarize his position with his own words.

In the sermon linked above, Judas is mentioned. Judas is used as an example of a branch being cast away and burned. I can't disagree. I agree.

However, the problem I have is what I've quoted above. Peter is only mentioned from an apostolic sense in this article. However, I would like to ask.

1. What is the difference between what Judas did and what Peter did? Jesus didn't "chase" Judas but Jesus certainly "chased" Peter.

As far as works are concerned. Both Peter and Judas denied Christ. Both weep after realizing their own sinful actions. Judas killed himself and Peter "left his former state" went back to his old ways.
 

shnarkle

Well-known member
1. What is the difference between what Judas did and what Peter did? Jesus didn't "chase" Judas but Jesus certainly "chased" Peter.
Satan entered Judas.
As far as works are concerned. Both Peter and Judas denied Christ. Both weep after realizing their own sinful actions. Judas killed himself and Peter "left his former state" went back to his old ways.
Judas may have had help killing himself. Suicides have always been a fact of life, but Judas' suicide was known throughout Jerusalem.
 

christ_undivided

Well-known member
Satan entered Judas.

Judas may have had help killing himself. Suicides have always been a fact of life, but Judas' suicide was known throughout Jerusalem.

I mentioned that Judas killed himself. I also mentioned what Judas and Peter had in common.

Would you agree that they had things in common? Which includes rejecting Jesus Christ?
 

American Gothic

Well-known member
Judas, the only Judean, had connection to the illegitimate priests in Jerusalem
Judas was not a Believer
Jesus would have known he wasn't one of His

Cain was grieved after killing Abel
what were Peter's "old ways"?
they were both spiritually dead men at that point
were any of the disciples not in hiding, scared that they were next? (where was John?)
 
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PeanutGallery

Well-known member
...1. What is the difference between what Judas did and what Peter did? Jesus didn't "chase" Judas but Jesus certainly "chased" Peter.
...
Godly sorrow vs worldly sorrow?
2Cor 7:10 For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death.
 

christ_undivided

Well-known member
Did Peter hang himself?
Was Peter alone when fishing?
Did Jesus go to all the disciples that were fishing, or only to Peter?

I agree. Hanging is different than what Peter did. However, I don't see how that makes a difference. Are you saying "sin isn't sin"?

No. Peter wasn't alone in doing bad things. How does that help Peter?
 

PeanutGallery

Well-known member
I agree. Hanging is different than what Peter did. However, I don't see how that makes a difference. Are you saying "sin isn't sin"?

No. Peter wasn't alone in doing bad things. How does that help Peter?
I'm saying godly sorrow is not worldly sorrow; which provides a scriptural basis for your OP:
...
1. What is the difference between what Judas did and what Peter did? Jesus didn't "chase" Judas but Jesus certainly "chased" Peter.
...
 

shnarkle

Well-known member
I mentioned that Judas killed himself. I also mentioned what Judas and Peter had in common.

Would you agree that they had things in common? Which includes rejecting Jesus Christ?
No. Judas didn't reject Christ. He believed he was the messiah and therefore he would free Israel from bondage. He tried to speed things up though. Jesus says, that he must be betrayed, and one of them is going to have to do it so Judas volunteers for the position, but he also sees this as an opportunity to make some money on the side.

This amounts to a tale of incomprehensible cosmic self-loathing. He has misunderstood the gospel message. He believes Christ has come to set Israel free, but he doesn't understand how that has to come about. He doesn't know that it can't come about by force, yet he forces it and serves Mammon at the same time. We already know one cannot serve Mammon and God. He knows who he serves so he kills himself.

Peter thinks he can save Christ, but then realizes that he's the one who needs to be saved from himself.

Judas mistakenly identifies with the body believing that this is what needs to die, but the reality is that it is the identity itself that needs to die, e.g. "deny yourself"
 

christ_undivided

Well-known member
Judas expressed worldly sorrow when he hung himself.
Peter expressed godly sorrow when he wept.
Judas gave back the money. Judas was remorseful. You can't say anything more than the Scriptures say.

Peter was remorseful. Peter didn't believe the words of Jesus that he was rise from the grave. As much as you want to see them differently in their actions, the only real difference is Peter lived. He wouldn't have if Jesus hadn't chased Peter down.

Why?

The Arminian narrative is that Jesus abandons those that abandon Him.
 

PeanutGallery

Well-known member
... the only real difference is Peter lived. He wouldn't have if Jesus hadn't chased Peter down.

Why?
...
Judas killed himself; therefore, Jesus did not chase after him.
Peter wept and lived, saw and believed at Christ's resurrection; then, Jesus went to the living disciples including Peter while they were fishing.
 
G

guest1

Guest
Judas killed himself; therefore, Jesus did not chase after him.
Peter wept and lived, saw and believed at Christ's resurrection; then, Jesus went to the living disciples including Peter while they were fishing.
The simple truth seem to escape many .
 

Synergy

Well-known member
Judas gave back the money. Judas was remorseful. You can't say anything more than the Scriptures say.

Peter was remorseful. Peter didn't believe the words of Jesus that he was rise from the grave. As much as you want to see them differently in their actions, the only real difference is Peter lived. He wouldn't have if Jesus hadn't chased Peter down.

Why?

The Arminian narrative is that Jesus abandons those that abandon Him.
Before the cross, Jesus didn't "chase" or "straighten out" Judas at least so "that the scripture may be fulfilled". One of those extremely rare cases where human salvation was in the balance.
 
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