The Eucharist is the New Testament

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dingoling. said:
Would it be possible for Abraham to have been justified by faith if he had not offered his son Isaac on the altar?
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Then he would not have had faith.... duh
are you seriously asking if someone without faith is justified by faith?

He would not have had faith in God's promise that through his offspring God would make a great nation
" we will come back to you.”

Gen 22:
3 Early the next morning Abraham got up and loaded his donkey. He took with him two of his servants and his son Isaac. When he had cut enough wood for the burnt offering, he set out for the place God had told him about. 4 On the third day Abraham looked up and saw the place in the distance. 5 He said to his servants, “Stay here with the donkey while I and the boy go over there. We will worship and then we will come back to you.”
" we will come back to you.”
Seems like Abraham had faith in God's promise


what do you think justified by God means?
 
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dingoling. said:
Is that a yes or a no? Thanks.
Click to expand...

Then he would not have had faith.... duh
are you seriously asking if someone without faith is justified by faith?

He would not have had faith in God's promise that through his offspring God would make a great nation
" we will come back to you.”

Gen 22:
3 Early the next morning Abraham got up and loaded his donkey. He took with him two of his servants and his son Isaac. When he had cut enough wood for the burnt offering, he set out for the place God had told him about. 4 On the third day Abraham looked up and saw the place in the distance. 5 He said to his servants, “Stay here with the donkey while I and the boy go over there. We will worship and then we will come back to you.”
" we will come back to you.”
Seems like Abraham had faith in God's promise
 
1Thess521 said:
Then he would not have had faith.... duh
are you seriously asking if someone without faith is justified by faith?
Click to expand...
No, Abraham had faith but decided not to offer his son Isaac on the altar - would his faith have justified him?

So how is the bread and wine not the body and blood of Christ?
 
dingoling. said:
Is that a yes or a no? Thanks.

Justified - declared or made righteous in the sight of God.
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are these verses describing justification?
Romans 4:5 However, to the one who does not work but trusts God who justifies the ungodly, their faith is credited as righteousness.
4:9 We have been saying that Abraham’s faith was credited to him as righteousness.
4:11 seal of the righteousness that he had by faith
in order that righteousness might be credited to them.
13 the righteousness that comes by faith.

21being fully persuaded that God had power to do what he had promised. 22 This is why “it was credited to him as righteousness.”
 
1Thess521 said:
are these verses describing justification?
Romans 4:5 However, to the one who does not work but trusts God who justifies the ungodly, their faith is credited as righteousness.
4:9 We have been saying that Abraham’s faith was credited to him as righteousness.
4:11 seal of the righteousness that he had by faith
in order that righteousness might be credited to them.
13 the righteousness that comes by faith.
Click to expand...

We are off topic.

1Thess521 said:
21being fully persuaded that God had power to do what he had promised. 22 This is why “it was credited to him as righteousness.”
Click to expand...

That is why he offered his son Isaac on the altar - being fully persuaded that God had power to do what he had promised.
 
dingoling. said:
I just copied it off of a google search.

What did the Greek word mean to the early Christians?
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Context
to be declared as righteous by God
"righteousfied"
(we don't have an English word for it.)
or to be vindicated
( the Greeks did not have a verb for that)
 
dingoling. said:
We are off topic.
Click to expand...
it is not off topic : I don't think you realize those verses are about justification

Romans 4:5 However, to the one who does not work but trusts God who justifies the ungodly, their faith is credited as righteousness.
4:9 We have been saying that Abraham’s faith was credited to him as righteousness.
4:11 seal of the righteousness that he had by faith
in order that righteousness might be credited to them.
13 the righteousness that comes by faith.
 
1Thess521 said:
it is not off topic : I don't think you realize those verses are about justification

Romans 4:5 However, to the one who does not work but trusts God who justifies the ungodly, their faith is credited as righteousness.
4:9 We have been saying that Abraham’s faith was credited to him as righteousness.
4:11 seal of the righteousness that he had by faith
in order that righteousness might be credited to them.
13 the righteousness that comes by faith.
Click to expand...
The thread is about the Eucharist.
 
dingoling. said:
We are off topic.



That is why he offered his son Isaac on the altar - being fully persuaded that God had power to do what he had promised.
Click to expand...
see your post 2633 for who changed the topic

please address this point

If the bread and wine being were the body and blood of Christ.
then we would expect there to specific effects or results.

Since these results did not happen until the death of Christ.
therefore bread and wine being were NOT the body and blood of Christ.
 
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