The Eucharist

[mica]

mica said:
do you plan to argue in favor of the teachings of the RCC over God's word on judgment day?

The same question could be asked to us all. Does a "Bible-believing Christian" plan to argue his or her own interpretation over the Church established by Christ on Judgement Day?

you didn't answer my question (above). just more non answers and diversions. Just like the ones you follow.

no, no need to. We believe His word. We also believe in Him as Lord and Savior from our hearts, so we are already His. We aren't the ones on here arguing against His word, catholics are. We also don't believe in and follow a false teacher who claims to be 'His church' but doesn't know what it is to be born again or how one is born again and teaches something contrary to it. that same false teacher makes false demands on its followers (under penalty of sin) - demands not found in God's word, but made up by men.

 

[balshan]

The same question could be asked to us all. Does a "Bible-believing Christian" plan to argue his or her own interpretation over the Church established by Christ on Judgement Day?

I am so tired of RCs making false claims which its fruit shows are false. Your institution was not established by Jesus that is just a fib. Therefore its interpretation is not reliable at all. By the way its interpretation is not listed as infallible either.

 

[Arch Stanton]

I am so tired of RCs making false claims which its fruit shows are false. Your institution was not established by Jesus that is just a fib. Therefore its interpretation is not reliable at all. By the way its interpretation is not listed as infallible either.

The Catholic Church was established by Christ 2,000 years ago balshan.

 

[balshan]

The Catholic Church was established by Christ 2,000 years ago balshan.

No it wasn't that is just a lie. Jesus would not touch it with a ten foot barge pole, it is so full of rotten fruit. What you are saying by that false claim is Jesus is responsible for the evil done by your institution.

 

[Arch Stanton]

No it wasn't that is just a lie. Jesus would not touch it with a ten foot barge pole, it is so full of rotten fruit. What you are saying by that false claim is Jesus is responsible for the evil done by your institution.

by that logic, Is Jesus responsible for the original 12's behavior?

 

[jonathan_hili]

The same question could be asked to to you . Does a "Church-believing Catholic" plan to demand an infallible interpretation from the Church of the words of Christ on Judgement Day?

Yes, this game could go on for hours!

 

[balshan]

by that logic, Is Jesus responsible for the original 12's behavior?

Well let me see Judas was picked for the part he had in the plan of salvation. The original 12 were before Pentecost and my how Peter changed after Pentecost. Jesus would never have selected child rapists to be leaders, He would not select popes who had orgies, who the one who dug up the dead. None of those activities are part of the salvation plan and is after Pentecost.

Scripture tells us to use discernment. It tells us the fruit of the spirit and fruit of the world. Your institution wallows in the fruit of the world. If it is Jesus' bride it must meet certain standards and it doesn't. We are told to flee from false teachers your institution has false doctrines because it has strayed so far away from the Word of God.

Arch that is such a poor excuse for evil fruit, to bring up the 12. They would not have tolerated the sexual sin of leaders that your church has hidden, lied about. Jesus said sin will be exposed. Your institution's sin has been exposed throughout the centuries and shows it is not what it claims to be.

Luke 12:2
But there is nothing covered up that will not be revealed, and hidden that will not be known.
Galations 5

17 for the flesh desires what is contrary to the Spirit, and the Spirit what is contrary to the flesh. They are in conflict with each other, so that you are not to do whatever you want. 18 But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law.

19 The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; 20 idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions 21 and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.

Your institution has the acts of the flesh, its leaders have been involved in:
sexual immorality, impurity and debaucher, idolatry, hatred, discord, jealousy, selfish ambition, envy, fits of rage, fractions, orgies throughout the centuries.

 

[balshan]

Yes, this game could go on for hours!

Well let us know the answer when you demand an infallible interpretation.

 

[jonathan_hili]

you didn't answer my question (above). just more non answers and diversions. Just like the ones you follow.

no, no need to. We believe His word. We also believe in Him as Lord and Savior from our hearts, so we are already His. We aren't the ones on here arguing against His word, catholics are. We also don't believe in and follow a false teacher who claims to be 'His church' but doesn't know what it is to be born again or how one is born again and teaches something contrary to it. that same false teacher makes false demands on its followers (under penalty of sin) - demands not found in God's word, but made up by men.

Oh, okay, since Jesus established the Church, he won't have a problem reconciling the two... and I'm sure he will have other issues to bring me up on.

 

[jonathan_hili]

The Catholic Church was established by Christ 2,000 years ago balshan.

That's irrelevant, AS. Many Protestants on this forum basically treat any denomination like a club and disavow association from them (so that they don't have to answer for their problems - while happily criticising the Church). Obviously, they have the Bible that fell out of the sky like mana and the experience of a few score years to know the truth, compared to Churches with historical pedigree, like the Catholic and and Orthodox Churches.

 

[1Thess521]

Please resolve what?

you agreed Christ is omnipresent
and
you said Christ is not present in hell.

both statements cannot be true:
Please resolve

 

[jonathan_hili]

you agreed Christ is omnipresent
and
you said Christ is not present in hell.

both statements cannot be true:
Please resolve

I'm going to weigh in here too... I think Christ is present in hell because hell is an essentially existential state (rather than geographical place).

 

[ding]

you agreed Christ is omnipresent
and
you said Christ is not present in hell.

both statements cannot be true:
Please resolve

One of the greatest sufferings of those in hell is the absence of God. God may be present in hell in a sense, but those in hell have no knowledge of his presence.

 

[1Thess521]

One of the greatest sufferings of those in hell is the absence of God. God may be present in hell in a sense, but those in hell have no knowledge of his presence.

Wrong again
Those in Hell wish God was not there:

There are under the unbearable; unrelenting agony coming from the Holy wrath of God

 

[ding]

Wrong again
Those in Hell wish God was not there:

There are under the unbearable; unrelenting agony coming from the Holy wrath of God

How do you know this?

 

[1Thess521]

How do you know this?

How do you know this?

Revelation 14:9–10 says, “They, too, will drink the wine of God’s fury, which has been poured full strength into the cup of his wrath. They will be tormented with burning sulfur in the presence of the holy angels and of the Lamb.”

A breath of relief is usually heard when someone declares, “Hell is a symbol for separation from God.” To be separated from God for eternity is no great threat to the impenitent person. The ungodly want nothing more than to be separated from God. Their problem in hell will not be separation from God, it will be the presence of God that will torment them. In hell, God will be present in the fullness of His divine wrath. He will be there to exercise His just punishment of the damned. They will know Him as an all-consuming fire.
RC Sproul

 

[ding]

Revelation 14:9–10 says, “They, too, will drink the wine of God’s fury, which has been poured full strength into the cup of his wrath. They will be tormented with burning sulfur in the presence of the holy angels and of the Lamb.”

That passage doesn't say the location which this is taking place.

 

[1Thess521]

That passage doesn't say the location which this is taking place.

are you kidding?

You really don't the location of where the expression "with burning sulfur" or "fire and brimstone" is referring to?

USCCB " Eternal punishment in the fiery pool of burning sulfur (or “fire and brimstone"

Revelation, CHAPTER 14 | USCCB

CHAPTER 14 The Lamb’s Companions.* 1Then I looked and there was the Lamb standing on Mount Zion,* and with him a hundred and forty-four thousand who had his name and his Father’s name written on their foreheads.a 2I heard a sound

bible.usccb.org

Haydock '"with punishments upon punishments for ever and ever."

 

[Arch Stanton]

Well let me see Judas was picked for the part he had in the plan of salvation. The original 12 were before Pentecost and my how Peter changed after Pentecost. Jesus would never have selected child rapists to be leaders, He would not select popes who had orgies, who the one who dug up the dead. None of those activities are part of the salvation plan and is after Pentecost.

Scripture tells us to use discernment. It tells us the fruit of the spirit and fruit of the world. Your institution wallows in the fruit of the world. If it is Jesus' bride it must meet certain standards and it doesn't. We are told to flee from false teachers your institution has false doctrines because it has strayed so far away from the Word of God.

Arch that is such a poor excuse for evil fruit, to bring up the 12. They would not have tolerated the sexual sin of leaders that your church has hidden, lied about. Jesus said sin will be exposed. Your institution's sin has been exposed throughout the centuries and shows it is not what it claims to be.

Luke 12:2
But there is nothing covered up that will not be revealed, and hidden that will not be known.
Galations 5

17 for the flesh desires what is contrary to the Spirit, and the Spirit what is contrary to the flesh. They are in conflict with each other, so that you are not to do whatever you want. 18 But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law.

19 The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; 20 idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions 21 and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.

Your institution has the acts of the flesh, its leaders have been involved in:
sexual immorality, impurity and debaucher, idolatry, hatred, discord, jealousy, selfish ambition, envy, fits of rage, fractions, orgies throughout the centuries.

I was referring to your logic

 

[balshan]

I was referring to your logic

Yep MY logic is spot on. Your logic is faulty, you don't know the difference between God's plan and just plain ignoring evil. You are the one who does not understand before Pentecost and after Pentecost. Your the one that thinks Jesus would tolerate evil priests and sinful behaviour throughout the centuries. He would never allow children to be harmed.